Receiver hitch pin distance survey

Apparition said:
I’ve got an idea I’ll throw out because it may get some better ideas.

The flared protector needs to be made independent of pin length and the only way I see that happening is if the protector was positioned by the rear face of the receiver. Possibly a magnet on the top surface that would hold the protector in place against the receiver, I picked top because in my mind it’s least likely to get an extreme angle of pull and it could easily be labeled Top.

Then ramp the protector down so the shackle still has space for the pin. Possibly have a minimum pin depth required.
Click to expand...

No disagreement but the issue remains that it can't be done with a 3/4" pin depth. The eye of the shackle and the support for that still sticks out further than the minimum engagement distance for the flared protector. They can't live in the same space.
 
  • Like
Reactions: DrDmoney and Apparition
mrblaine said:
No disagreement but the issue remains that it can't be done with a 3/4" pin depth. The eye of the shackle and the support for that still sticks out further than the minimum engagement distance for the flared protector. They can't live in the same space.
Click to expand...

Need to figure out a way to make it unusable with a short pin depth.

A red zone of death on it that needs to be inserted fully to disappear. But that won’t stop people from using it incorrectly. And adds unnecessary expense.
 
Apparition said:
Need to figure out a way to make it unusable with a short pin depth.
Click to expand...
Not possible and make it a viable product.
Apparition said:
A red zone of death on it that needs to be inserted fully to disappear. But that won’t stop people from using it incorrectly. And adds unnecessary expense.
Click to expand...
Absolutely.
 
  • Sad
  • Like
Reactions: DrDmoney and Apparition
The real issue I see is that once you ship it you have no control on hows it’s used. iIn our litigious world filled with Stupid People and their lawyers. You are a rich business owner, after all, in the eyes of the jury. 😉
Many of the aftermarket receivers are made with tall flanges to clear the bumper. They are designed for a pulling load and will fail with an unforgiving side load. How many of use have witnessed 2-3 or more vehicles tied together pulling someone out of a jam?

https://mobileimages.lowes.com/prod...e9-badc-f5e613a8f3c3/00771426.jpg?size=pdhism
 
  • Like
Reactions: Zorba
bucky said:
The real issue I see is that once you ship it you have no control on hows it’s used.
Click to expand...

I understand and I know from some stuff with the Savvy front bumper precisely how that goes. I also understand perfectly from that experience that folks will do stupid shit, then they will post it on the forums first, then they will never contact the company about the stupid shit they did.

The second one of those was Warn throwing us under the bus. Dumbass shock loaded his winch and snapped it in half. Contacts Warn about warranty, Warn tells him that it being mounted on a Savvy bumper is why it failed. Now we get to deal with the double dumbass scenario.
 
  • Sad
  • Face Palm
  • Wow
Reactions: Zorba, DrDmoney and rasband
You could finish your survey and offer three different models. One at the most common depth, one at the second most common, and one "custom". For the custom, the customer denotes the depth when ordered, you drill it and send it away. Extra charge for the custom. You could also offer a "blank" model with no holes for the customer to drill himself.
 
why not this?

1664208489102.png


1. it accommodates a range of pin depths, and sets its own insertion depth when the flange hits the end of the receiver
2. it provides extra support around the flare radius for the narrow depths (don't really know how much you'd need)
 
freedom_in_4low said:
why not this?

View attachment 362184

1. it accommodates a range of pin depths, and sets its own insertion depth when the flange hits the end of the receiver
2. it provides extra support around the flare radius for the narrow depths (don't really know how much you'd need)
Click to expand...

I think the propensity for misuse is too high. E.g. someone with a shallow depth uses the back of the slot leaving way too much of the depth unsupported by the receiver.

My only thought was something that's telescoping on a spring - but that makes the design and production likely much too difficult.
 
rasband said:
I think the propensity for misuse is too high. E.g. someone with a shallow depth uses the back of the slot leaving way too much of the depth unsupported by the receiver.

My only thought was something that's telescoping on a spring - but that makes the design and production likely much too difficult.
Click to expand...

hence the added thickness on the end. Put as much support as you need there, and there's no limit to how shallow the slot can extend.
 
freedom_in_4low said:
hence the added thickness on the end. Put as much support as you need there, and there's no limit to how shallow the slot can extend.
Click to expand...

Or how far the sleeve can be pulled out, depending on the pin depth. That can create highly unwanted leverage during a side pull.

So much of the design requirements for this are to prevent the consumer from misusing the product, intentionally or unintentionally.
 
jjvw said:
Or how far the sleeve can be pulled out, depending on the pin depth. That can create highly unwanted leverage during a side pull.

So much of the design requirements for this are to prevent the consumer from misusing the product, intentionally or unintentionally.
Click to expand...

Idiot customers are a cost of doing business. if there's zero tolerance for misusing a product, then all recovery gear, and automobiles in general, shouldn't be available to anyone. Make it as idiot proof as you can, provide an air tight instruction sheet, and then move on.
 
freedom_in_4low said:
why not this?

View attachment 362184

1. it accommodates a range of pin depths, and sets its own insertion depth when the flange hits the end of the receiver
2. it provides extra support around the flare radius for the narrow depths (don't really know how much you'd need)
Click to expand...

The main reason that is a struggle is due to the 2" max dimension in any direction for the part that slides into the receiver. If you measure a reasonable sized shackle that would be used, it is .750 main leg diameter from the eye back to the loop and knot. Unless you skewer the loop with just the hitch pin at a 5/8" diameter and why would you, then the dimensions add up to more than 2". The minimum sleeve diameter that I would stick the hitch pin through is 1". 1" + .750 + .750 = 2.5" or a number that exceeds our dimension we have to fit everything inside off. It can be done with a slotted hole as I mentioned and flattening the shackle leg but it will be tight but doable. Unfortunately that leads to the second issue is once you start loading the shackle, the two legs will try to separate to the diameter of your sleeve and go straight out. That will force the sleeve outward to whatever limit it happens to stop.
1664210355366.png
 
freedom_in_4low said:
Idiot customers are a cost of doing business. if there's zero tolerance for misusing a product, then all recovery gear, and automobiles in general, shouldn't be available to anyone. Make it as idiot proof as you can, provide an air tight instruction sheet, and then move on.
Click to expand...

I don't need it to be 100%. What I need is a reasonable expectation it will work as desired regardless of customer proficiency levels. It isn't the customer that is the problem, it is the lack of a standard with regard to pin depth.

The key to a successful product is not how many situations you can make it work in, the key is putting something out there that negates customer contact for problematic situations after the sale. I don't want that phone call, I work diligently at evaluating my stuff on a continual basis to avoid getting that phone call. A variable pin depth practically guarantees I will get that call no matter how well I design the part.

That is the only thing that makes what I do worth it.
 
  • Like
Reactions: bucky, jjvw and Zorba
1-3/4" for my DirtWorx TJ/LJ rear bumper

2-1/2" for Reese Class III hitch for 2017 Jeep Grand Cherokee
 
freedom_in_4low said:
hence the added thickness on the end. Put as much support as you need there, and there's no limit to how shallow the slot can extend.
Click to expand...

I have completely overlooked the reason a slot won't work. The entire premise behind the first aspect of a receiver insert is to provide a larger diameter radius for the shackle eye to go around to limit the stresses induced by the smaller diameter hitch pin. You can't reasonably do that with a slotted insert.
 
  • Like
Reactions: freedom_in_4low
mrblaine said:
I have completely overlooked the reason a slot won't work. The entire premise behind the first aspect of a receiver insert is to provide a larger diameter radius for the shackle eye to go around to limit the stresses induced by the smaller diameter hitch pin. You can't reasonably do that with a slotted insert.
Click to expand...

Ok, I follow that now. I was thinking of just an insert to provide the flare radius but you basically need it to be a thimble to fit inside the tube with that rope thickness and radius diameter.
 
  • Like
Reactions: mrblaine
freedom_in_4low said:
Ok, I follow that now. I was thinking of just an insert to provide the flare radius but you basically need it to be a thimble to fit inside the tube with that rope thickness and radius diameter.
Click to expand...

Exactly and the exit of the insert for the flared section needs a minimum distance for the pair of legs to almost or fully touch before they return to straight. That puts the pin depth at around 1.5" minimum, 2.0" would be much better.
 
  • Like
Reactions: freedom_in_4low
Top Bottom
Back