Overheating brakes in the mountains

Nobody asked what gear ratio are you running?

With my 97 and AX-15 5 speed and 4.88s I can pick a gear and run down a hill at a controlled speed with a very rare touch of the brakes.

Riding brakes all the way down a hill warps rotors, glazes pads and can even boil the fluid.

-Mac
 
Nobody asked what gear ratio are you running?

With my 97 and AX-15 5 speed and 4.88s I can pick a gear and run down a hill at a controlled speed with a very rare touch of the brakes.

Riding brakes all the way down a hill warps rotors, glazes pads and can even boil the fluid.

-Mac

4.11 gears from the Rubicon, and is an auto tranny.. the first gear didn't help a lot..
 
I don't want to come across as a dick, but it sounds like the primary problem here is flatlander braking technique. Brakes are designed/intended to slow the vehicle down - they are NOT a speed maintenance device. Now I wasn't there, so I cannot say for sure - BUT - I certainly have seen plenty of flatlanders get into trouble in the mountains because they ride the brakes. Gear the vehicle down if its getting away from you. You have to respect the mountain, because the mountain certainly won't respect you!
 
I don't want to come across as a dick, but it sounds like the primary problem here is flatlander braking technique. Brakes are designed/intended to slow the vehicle down - they are NOT a speed maintenance device. Now I wasn't there, so I cannot say for sure - BUT - I certainly have seen plenty of flatlanders get into trouble in the mountains because they ride the brakes. Gear the vehicle down if its getting away from you. You have to respect the mountain, because the mountain certainly won't respect you!

thats where I was going too. to the OP you said to go into 4low would of been too slow, but if your brakes went out you'd of been FUCKED with no way to slow it down ! think about that next time, so you dont end up in a pile at the bottom !!!
 
I don't want to come across as a dick, but it sounds like the primary problem here is flatlander braking technique. Brakes are designed/intended to slow the vehicle down - they are NOT a speed maintenance device. Now I wasn't there, so I cannot say for sure - BUT - I certainly have seen plenty of flatlanders get into trouble in the mountains because they ride the brakes. Gear the vehicle down if its getting away from you. You have to respect the mountain, because the mountain certainly won't respect you!

I guarantee you he can go back to the exact same trail, do his braking the exact same way and he won't smoke my stuff after it is broken in.
 
We manual transmission guys do not tend to have these issues.😃
I don't have them either with my automatics which can be downshifted too. My 5.38 gears and 42RLE automatic will engine brake me enough in Low and 4Lo on a steep hill that nearly everyone behind me is riding their brakes.
 
We manual transmission guys do not tend to have these issues.😃

I have a wife who likes to get to red lights and stop signs as fast as possible before slamming the brakes. I’m lucky if she gets 30K before the rotors are warped.

It would take a lot more than that to actually warp a rotor.
 
  • Like
Reactions: mrblaine
I guarantee you he can go back to the exact same trail, do his braking the exact same way and he won't smoke my stuff after it is broken in.
That's a good thing - but that doesn't excuse poor technique (if that is, indeed, the case - I wasn't there).
 
I don't have them either with my automatics. Automatics can be downshifted too. My 5.38 gears and 42RLE automatic will engine brake me enough in Low and 4Lo on a steep hill that nearly everyone behind me is riding their brakes.
Yep. I always downshift automatics as needed, even in routine driving. Not a subscriber to the "American automatic transmission driving technique", it has a shift lever for a reason. The only ones behind you riding their brakes are those that don't know how to drive correctly.
 
Or put it in 4 low and let the transmission take care of the rest.

This is not the right thing to do for a general case.
With manual or automatics, one should downshift to low gear, like with my 42RLE it should be 2nd gear and release the gas pedal. This can bring the engine to 4K RPM, but it will remove significant amount of heat from the brakes.
If the slope is really bad then even first gear can be considered, but it is for really low speeds.
 
This is not the right thing to do for a general case.
With manual or automatics, one should downshift to low gear, like with my 42RLE it should be 2nd gear and release the gas pedal. This can bring the engine to 4K RPM, but it will remove significant amount of heat from the brakes.
If the slope is really bad then even first gear can be considered, but it is for really low speeds.

How would that not be the correct move? OP stated that he was already in 1st gear in 4 High and applying the brakes for “several minutes” and still struggling on the trails. Sounds to me that he did not have enough gear reduction to provide sufficient engine braking. Why would he not want to be in 4 low and let the engine do more of the work to slow down some?
 
te

yes I'm sure that was not the problem... it was the constant braking from the downhills that caused them to overheat.. I put my foot on the brake pedal constantly for several minutes (the slope was very steep)

I was not in 4lo because the np241 is 4:1 and I would need to go extremely slow... and it is an auto... I was in first gear but didn't help...

once I knew they were overheating I used the 4lo to help the rotors cool faster with the air flow

what part of this are yall not reading ? "foot on the brake constantly for several minutes", "not in 4low because I would need to go extremely slow", "the slope was very steep" or "I was in 1st gear and it didn't help" ? In this situation there's 3 choices put it in 4 low, hold foot on the brakes and smoke em or take a rollercoaster ride to the bottom !
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: Artsifrtsi
How would that not be the correct move? OP stated that he was already in 1st gear in 4 High and applying the brakes for “several minutes” and still struggling on the trails. Sounds to me that he did not have enough gear reduction to provide sufficient engine braking. Why would he not want to be in 4 low and let the engine do more of the work to slow down some?

I take my words back. My apologies. I missed the part where he mentioned that he already was in the first gear.
It is kind of very hard to overheat brakes with 1st gear
 
"not in 4low because I would need to go extremely slow"

when in 4lo the automatic transmission still uses at least the first three gears, and probably* even overdrive. The owners manual says 25 mph max when in low range. I've never gone that speed in 4lo but I wouldn't call the 15 to 20 MPH I've done extremely slow when off road.


* I added the "probably" because I don't know if I've gotten to overdrive while in 4lo but with accountants and lawyers always demanding so much crap, I wouldn't be surprised if the WTFCM (ECM/PCM/TCM) is considered smarter than the average Jeeper and does what IT feels like doing to make the guys in suits happy.
 
  • Face Palm
Reactions: tr21triton
when in 4lo the automatic transmission still uses at least the first three gears, and probably* even overdrive. The owners manual says 25 mph max when in low range. I've never gone that speed in 4lo but I wouldn't call the 15 to 20 MPH I've done extremely slow when off road.


* I added the "probably" because I don't know if I've gotten to overdrive while in 4lo but with accountants and lawyers always demanding so much crap, I wouldn't be surprised if the WTFCM (ECM/PCM/TCM) is considered smarter than the average Jeeper and does what IT feels like doing to make the guys in suits happy.

On mine with a 5 speed, I use OD in 4low fairly often to move with some speed. Even then, with the 241 I top out at not quite 30mph with the engine above 4k rpm. At that point, I'm shifting back to high range.
 
I take my words back. My apologies. I missed the part where he mentioned that he already was in the first gear.
It is kind of very hard to overheat brakes with 1st gear

I think him being in 4 High was essentially pushing him down the mountain. Might have had more success rolling in neutral at that point haha
 
I think if the OP had of turned around and gone uphill he wouldn't of smoked his brakes. but he couldn't of done it fast if he was in 4low so he would of probably had to shift to 4 high to go faster. however if he got to going too fast he might of had to hit the brakes again i think....I must be really missing something here ! so let me ask you if I am going down a very steep incline and having to hold constant pressure on the brakes to slow down (because thats how you keep from going too fast) now I understand that the automatic shifter ONLY HAS DNP AND NO 123DPN positions on it so it cant be locked into a certain gear. now due to prolonged friction the brakes start to smoke ! WTF do you do ? he said he didn't want to go into 4low because it was too slow ! so what other option is there ? damn this aint fucking rocket science
 
Look - it doesn't matter how damn slow you have to go if it keeps you off the brakes. I'm not at all familiar with the Jeep autoboxes - if it isn't possible to lock the transmission into a gear, that's an inadequacy of the transmission and I'd be looking for something different. But if that's what you have to deal with, then the only way I see out of it is 4-lo. Too slow? Too bad! Beats brake fade.

Anecdote: I was going down the eastern slope of Tioga pass in the High Sierra, pulling a fifth wheel trailer. The auto-box wouldn't hold it back enough in 2nd, so I put it in first. Pulled over at EVERY turnout (there are plenty of them), and got honked at by all the flatlanders as they flew past me, feet on the brakes until they vanished out of sight ahead. WITHOUT EXCEPTION, I'd soon be smelling burning brakes, and there the fools would be in a turnout a couple of miles ahead, with their heads under their vehicles wondering why their brakes were fading. One case looked like the guy had barely managed to get it stopped before going over the cliff. I'd just toot my horn and roll on past. I don't think I ever saw any of them again - I figure they got religion after that.

Gear the fucking truck down as much as necessary to stay off the brakes. When you do need to brake, do so like you mean it. Slow waaaay down, then get off the brakes again to let them cool until the next time. Otherwise, sooner or later sayonara baby because physics wins - EVERY time! Again: Brakes are designed to slow you down, they are NOT a speed maintenance device. That's what the engine and driveline are for.
 
  • Like
Reactions: tr21triton