Thoughts on suspension / lift on future EV rigs

rjaym

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Now that SEMA is over I am curious if any vendors are offering ideas on how motor on axle design EVs will be lifted / increase travel. Will portal type lifts become the norm? It seems now is the time the r/d will get some financial backing, I’m curious about the interest from the aftermarket on how they will support these new EV designs. rj
 
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I’m curious about the interest from the aftermarket on how they will support these new EV designs. rj

People will always want to lift and modify what ever vehicles they have. Been seeing a lot of Rivians out on the trail. Seems like right now is the ground floor. Demand hasn't hit yet but with all these states mandating things go that way it would be smart for someone to establish themselves as "the go to" for EV
 
I don't see any EVs being lifted for actual off-road use anytime soon. I even doubt that we see electric Jeeps being modified beyond shops/companies trying to make a statement. Like it or not, even with gov mandates, EVs are an unpopular, niche market product for the generally "better off" (financially speaking), i.e. EVs are a toy. Not only is the EV market relatively insignificant, the people who buy them aren't the people who lift a vehicle beyond something like bigger wheels. So my thoughts are there won't be anything real for the EV crowd anytime soon. Don't count on Savvy or RockJock to make any EV specific lift kits.
 
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I don't see any EVs being lifted for actual off-road use anytime soon. I even doubt that we see electric Jeeps being modified beyond shops/companies trying to make a statement. Like it or not, even with gov mandates, EVs are an unpopular, niche market product for the generally "better off" (financially speaking), i.e. EVs are a toy. Not only is the EV market relatively insignificant, the people who buy them aren't the people who lift a vehicle beyond something like bigger wheels. So my thoughts are there won't be anything real for the EV crowd anytime soon. Don't count on Savvy or RockJock to make any EV specific lift kits.

13 states have passed laws to make all cars sold be EV by 2030-2035. That only 10 years… small time for R&D. Popularity of EV doesn’t matter… it’s coming. As infrastructure builds so will demand. If Savvy and Rockjock don’t, someone else will
 
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13 states have passed laws to make all cars sold be EV by 2030-2035. That only 10 years… small time for R&D. Popularity of EV doesn’t matter… it’s coming. As infrastructure builds so will demand. If Savvy and Rockjock don’t, someone else will

That's 10 years to shake out and change laws and mandates. I just don't see Evs "coming" like many of the talking heads and financially invested would like us to think. EVs have been "coming" for over 100 years now.

Here's a 1909 Baker EV, the Tesla of it's day. Baker and other EV makers suffered from many of the same issues of today when comparing EV to conventional vehicle.
1668528140202.png
 
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That's 10 years to shake out and change laws and mandates. I just don't see Evs "coming" like many of the talking heads and financially invested would like us to think. EVs have been "coming" for over 100 years now.

Here's a 1909 Baker EV, the Tesla of it's day. Baker and other EV makers suffered from many of the same issues of today when comparing EV to conventional vehicle.
View attachment 376890

Water is a renewable energy source. How bout a steam engine car?!! 🤔
 
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EVs are a toy ... the people who buy them aren't the people who lift a vehicle beyond something like bigger wheels.
Think about that and what we do for a hobby. And we spend a lot of money to do it. 100% torque at the first RPM is very, very, attractive from an offroad performance standpoint. All we need is better batteries and its game on. For mall crawlers you may be right because their game is to stooge around in their parade Jeeps and give each other rubber ducks.
 
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I’m thinking the portal axle will become more common place. I can’t get my head around how to increase travel with a “ skateboard” type platform . The packaging on an EV is purposely tight so adding or rearranging is nearly or completely impossible. Portals to my simple brain eye seem like a “ doable “ but the software/ MCU/ BMS would have to know or at least tuned to understand this modification. Not impossible, but likely far more involved than the hardware.
Agreed, SEMA2022 was probably too soon to see any real aftermarket concepts since few true EV trucks are on the market. They are coming and they will be AWD. Folks will want to lift them and make them their own. Maybe not improve there off road abilities but at least the typical lift and tires we see everyday. THOSE buyers will likely drive the market to a useful improved suspension design.
Any SEMA or folks part of the aftermarket products biz. please comment. rjm
 
Suspension packaging seems to be a tremendous potential advantage of an EV off roader. I can readily envision after market straight axles with motors in them that could be purchased and bolted onto existing ICE vehicles like a TJ. Put modular batteries in place of the entire deleted drivetrain and gas tank and you have a lot more freedom to modify and adjust you suspension to your likes and needs. Plus put your caster where ever you like and nothing to tuck😀
 
Indeed- Woodrow, I agree. Both ford and Chevy already offer EV kits aimed at the hot rod / restorod community-. That’s a good thing. I hope, for the sake of that community street rodders embrace it. It’s mind boggling when you imagine what the auto industry will look like in 20-30 years. It will be a massive shift from what we see and know as “ typical/ normal” drive train today.
 
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I can’t get my head around how to increase travel with a “ skateboard” type platform . The packaging on an EV is purposely tight so adding or rearranging is nearly or completely impossible.

Physically speaking, the modular "skateboard" platform and its independent front and rear suspensions will be a major limiting factor for anyone seriously trying to make a production EV into even a moderate (stock conventional truck or wrangler level) off-roader. These vehicles will be limited and confined to something like a Subaru (we all know Subaru guys who think their car will go where a Jeep will :rolleyes:). Beyond the 1-2" of suspension adjustment, you're looking at SAS just for the suspension lift, add in traction motors on custom axles, now we're looking at very, very big money, so it's not going to be financially feasible anytime soon.

Both ford and Chevy already offer EV kits aimed at the hot rod / restorod community-. That’s a good thing. I hope, for the sake of that community street rodders embrace it.

Why is that a good thing?
 
Think about that and what we do for a hobby. And we spend a lot of money to do it

I get the toy aspect, but the current price of an EV is 5-10x that of an old Jeep. What does a $100,000 Jeep look like, and what can it do off-road? A $100,000 EV looks like a stock EV built for street duty only. Add the exorbitant cost of EVs with their niche market status, and I see no real aftermarket suppliers bringing significant support out any time soon beyond what is shared with a similar conventional vehicle platform, like a Jeep being offered in conventional and electric power.

100% torque at the first RPM is very, very, attractive from an offroad performance standpoint.

I see how that would be good in slow speed stuff like rocks and tight trails, but I can't imagine electrical components holding up very long in mud, water, or sand.

For mall crawlers you may be right because their game is to stooge around in their parade Jeeps and give each other rubber ducks.

That's where I believe EV specific vehicles will live, urban areas. The current buyers tend to think of them as some kind of status symbol, much like the ~80% rented luxury brand vehicles.
 
...independent front and rear suspensions will be a major limiting factor for anyone seriously trying to make a production EV into even a moderate (stock conventional truck or wrangler level) off-roader.
I definitely agree. That's why I think modifying a conventional chassis (such as a Jeep) would work far better.
very, very big money...
Possibly. Certainly, electric crate motor set ups were prohibitively priced last time I checked. However, conventional Jeep mods are very expensive as well, particularly axles and engines. Also, its reasonable to expect new tech to come down in price with time as more people get into the game.
Why is that a good thing?
Freedom. More options is almost always good. No one likes to be told what to do (especially me). I'd really rather government not mandate EVs, but don't think current automotive options haven't been more or less mandated by large auto and petroleum interests for a long time.
 
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No one likes to be told what to do (especially me). I'd really rather government not mandate EVs, but don't think current automotive options haven't been more or less mandated

This is my #1 issue with electric vehicles. Get the politicians and their financial interest out and let the market decide if EVs are "the future".

Real, current and looming environmental effects from EVs is #2.
 
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This is my #1 issue with electric vehicles. Get the politicians and their financial interest out and let the market decide if EVs are "the future".

Real, current and looming environmental effects from EVs is #2.

I get that and it sounds like we agree. Beyond politics and the environment, the EV offroad concept is interesting with some obvious advantages and disadvantages. I'm not too interested in a new EV (or any new car for that matter) but I won't rule out giving an EV conversion on an older rig a try in the future.
 
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I was hoping this thread wouldn't go political. I ask that we step away from that direction. I do understand and agree politics play a role in what vehicles we drive for necessity and pleasure/sport. Regarding the question from BlueC "why is that good thing". Its a good thing that the auto manufactures are throwing these options to the tinkerers and builders so they/we /I can get some hands-on experience with building hot rods/cruisers/ off road etc around the format. I'm grateful they have provided these options to the general public this early in the development process. My OP was aimed at development for the new vehicles - basically what will a 2043 jeep "Rubicon" suspension look like? SEMA has always been an event that shows what's coming up - concepts of the near (next year) future and beyond. For the aftermarket industry to continue to thrive they must adapt to what is offered by the automotive industry. Part of the reason SEMA assoc. was created was to improve the sustainability of the aftermarket.
 
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Regarding the question from BlueC "why is that good thing". Its a good thing that the auto manufactures are throwing these options to the tinkerers and builders so they/we /I can get some hands-on experience with building hot rods/cruisers/ off road etc around the format.

That's not the typical answer, good for you. I can understand that, even though it's not my thing.

My OP was aimed at development for the new vehicles - basically what will a 2043 jeep "Rubicon" suspension look like? SEMA has always been an event that shows what's coming up - concepts of the near (next year) future and beyond. For the aftermarket industry to continue to thrive they must adapt to what is offered by the automotive industry.

This is what I've tried to address. Without a conventional vehicle platform base like a wrangler, I doubt there will be any significant off-road mechanical products developed for the standard EV, like a rivian.
 
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