New clock spring, horn still won't turn off

southernwrangler

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Hello all. I have a 1997 TJ 4.0 I6 Manual no cruise control

Having an issue where my horn isn’t turning off. I’ve replaced clock spring. I’ve replaced fuses.

What other issues could this be caused by?

Could a wiring issue cause other issues in that electrical circuit?

I ask that because I’ve had to replace my crank position sensor, and my latest CEL code was a P0123 throttle position sensor, and I’ve read that it’s on the same circuit as the horn/clock spring.

Any new ideas would be a great help.

Devin
 
Have you tried pulling the horn relay? Does it shut off then? If it does temporarily swap the horn relay with another same-size relay to see if that fixes it. The horn circuit itself is not on the same circuit as the CPS.

If swapping the relay didn't fix it and if you know how to use an ohmmeter, remove the horn relay. See if the red wire with yellow tracer is grounded which would cause the horn to sound. It is not supposed to be grounded unless the horn button is pushed. The horn button via the clock spring is what normally grounds it. If that wire is still grounded after installing the new clock spring either your horn button is bad or the red wire with yellow tracer is damaged somewhere in its wiring harness and is shorted to the body somewhere.

Horn Circuit.JPG
 
Have you tried pulling the horn relay? Does it shut off then? If it does temporarily swap the horn relay with another same-size relay to see if that fixes it. The horn circuit itself is not on the same circuit as the CPS.

If swapping the relay didn't fix it and if you know how to use an ohmmeter, remove the horn relay. See if the red wire with yellow tracer is grounded which would cause the horn to sound. It is not supposed to be grounded unless the horn button is pushed. The horn button via the clock spring is what normally grounds it. If that wire is still grounded after installing the new clock spring either your horn button is bad or the red wire with yellow tracer is damaged somewhere in its wiring harness and is shorted to the body somewhere.

View attachment 382961

Yes sir I’ve switched the relay with a similar relay (the A/C next to the horn is the same relay) and the problem still exists.

I have continuity on the relay as well, using the ohmmeter, which I guess indicates it’s grounded somewhere or, like you guys are saying, bad horn switch.

Another challenge is the previous owner re-wired the entire jeep.

Is the above diagram for my 97? I saw another diagram you posted on a similar thread and it looks different. I’ve attached that diagram

Thanks for your replies guys

9C9E9F29-2237-4050-A1A9-BA0C962D526D.png
 
From the picture you included it is not possible to tell what year FSM you got it from without going through them all. If you go through the search there is a page with all the manuals for dl. Make sure you have the correct year. You will find the color coded wires will vary at times through out the years and so will some circuits. Most people will not completely rewire a jeep but will hack the existing wiring. If the original wiring was damaged they may have pulled a harness from a different year jeep as a donor, but the diagrams will help you figure out what is going on with that.
 
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Yes sir I’ve switched the relay with a similar relay (the A/C next to the horn is the same relay) and the problem still exists.

I have continuity on the relay as well, using the ohmmeter, which I guess indicates it’s grounded somewhere or, like you guys are saying, bad horn switch.

Another challenge is the previous owner re-wired the entire jeep.

Is the above diagram for my 97? I saw another diagram you posted on a similar thread and it looks different. I’ve attached that diagram

Thanks for your replies guys

View attachment 382966
It's not for a 97 but electrically it's the same with the same wire colors except for the dual horns which doesn't affect how to troubleshoot the ground issue.

P.S. former Series 7 guy.
 
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It's not for a 97 but electrically it's the same with the same wire colors except for the dual horns which doesn't affect how to troubleshoot the ground issue.

P.S. former Series 7 guy.

Thank you!

Do you have any experience with where that wire might be shorting? At first glance it appears to run through the firewall straight to the fuse box next to the battery.

Thanks again
 
From the picture you included it is not possible to tell what year FSM you got it from without going through them all. If you go through the search there is a page with all the manuals for dl. Make sure you have the correct year. You will find the color coded wires will vary at times through out the years and so will some circuits. Most people will not completely rewire a jeep but will hack the existing wiring. If the original wiring was damaged they may have pulled a harness from a different year jeep as a donor, but the diagrams will help you figure out what is going on with that.

You’re correct they didn’t re-wire the entire jeep but installed some aftermarket lights and have modified the wiring to do so.
 
Disconnect the wiring to the air bag and horn switch at the wheel if it goes off it is in the horn switch

The horn switch appears to be functions.

As I was installing the new clock spring, the wire that comes from the clock spring and connects to the horn wire accidentally touched metal, and the horn beeped.

I’m no electrician, so correct me if I’m wrong, but that would mean that the issues lies somewhere in the actual wiring? (The red with yellow tracer as indicated in a different comment)
 
Originally you said the horn won’t shut off? Does the horn intermittently beep while driving? Is it consistent and repeatable? Like on left turns, pushing brake, over bumps?
In section 8m of the service manual it looks like the airbag cover and horn switch may be serviceable. I would disconnect the wire to the horn switch at the airbag and drive the vehicle for a week. If it doesn’t honk the horn switch would be the problem.
 
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When it shorted it works the same as pushing on the horn it completed the circuit and sounded the horn. So a couple of things when your working in around the clockspring pull the ground off the battery and wait 5mins so you do not have the airbag accidentally discharge on you, makes for a bad day. If you have the airbag removed and power to the system and the horn is not sounding except when you short the horn wire. But it is constantly on when plugged into the horn check the horn if there is continuity through it that will be your issue.
 
Update: I disassembled the airbag itself, and the switch in the airbag/horn assembly was stuck closed.

I jiggled and pressed and tinkered with the circular ‘plate’ that you press as you use your horn, and it seemed to fix the closed switch

Thanks for all the ideas!

Devin