Pros & cons of each control arm: Savvy vs Metalcloak

Texas-TJ

Texas-TJ

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I'm sure this has been discussed a number of times. If so, I do apologize. I couldn't find any old threads comparing each one specifically.

Savvy = Johnny Joint, double adjustable
MC = Duroflex, double adjustable, MC states they have more degree of flex

Is one easier to maintain? Is one joint more durable than the other? Is one easier to rebuild? Is one company more established than the other (could be around longer)?

I know that most people on the forum prefer Savvy. I'm just trying to figure out why before I pull the trigger. I look forward to hearing everyone's opinions. Thanks
 
I’ve had both MC arms and Savvy arms. First off, make sure you buy double adjustable control arms not the single adjustable version. Current MC arms are a couple years old and no issues yet with the bushings. I prefer the aluminum savvy arms because I’m a fan of the Currie Johnny joints and their reliability.
 
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MC's claiming more flex is typical of their smoke and mirror claims and advertising. The Duroflex material inside their "flex" joints is nothing more than rubber, it doesn't have nearly the performance, flex, or longevity of the Johnny Joint used by Savvy, Rock Jock/Currie, and others.
 
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I haven't rebuilt a johnny joint but the MC arms are simply the barrel of the control arm and the joint is held in place with a washer and a snap ring on either side. Pretty easy to replace.

Longevity-wise, those I wheel with use johnny joints and their joints last longer than my duroflex joints. I wheel my rig pretty hard and the bonded rubber duroflex joints dont seem to handle it very well.
 
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Texas-TJ said:
I'm sure this has been discussed a number of times. If so, I do apologize. I couldn't find any old threads comparing each one specifically.

Savvy = Johnny Joint, double adjustable
MC = Duroflex, double adjustable, MC states they have more degree of flex

Is one easier to maintain? Is one joint more durable than the other? Is one easier to rebuild? Is one company more established than the other (could be around longer)?

I know that most people on the forum prefer Savvy. I'm just trying to figure out why before I pull the trigger. I look forward to hearing everyone's opinions. Thanks
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If you take an MC joint and a Savvy JJ apart, you'll understand why there's no comparison.

All the MC joint is is a steel ball bonded to rubber.
 
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Metalcloak bushings tear apart when subjected to repeated and sustained misalignment. Johnny Joints don't. Metalcloak bushings allow for noticably more deflection resulting in axle wrap than Johnny Joints do. Metalcloak bushings retain many of the reasons one would move away from the factory Cleavite bushings in the first place, making them largely pointless.

But for some reason, Metalcloak bushings contain Kevlar fiber fuzz where Johnny Joints don't. Make of that what you will.
 
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jjvw said:
Metalcloak bushings tear apart when subjected to repeated and sustained misalignment. Johnny Joints don't. Metalcloak bushings allow for noticably more deflection resulting in axle wrap than Johnny Joints do. Metalcloak bushings retain many of the reasons one would move away from the factory Cleavite bushings in the first place, making them largely pointless.

But for some reason, Metalcloak bushings contain Kevlar fiber fuzz where Johnny Joints don't. Make of that what you will.
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I don't do a lot of trails or off-roading, except on South Texas beach sand. I currently have RE arms and want to switch over to something much better. How difficult is it to perform the required maintenance on the Savvy arms to keep them in optimal condition?
 
Texas-TJ said:
I don't do a lot of trails or off-roading, except on South Texas beach sand. I currently have RE arms and want to switch over to something much better. How difficult is it to perform the required maintenance on the Savvy arms to keep them in optimal condition?
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You have to take the joint apart with snap ring pliers and a press or the special expensive tool (2 tools if you have different size jj's). It's a matter of minutes to take one apart. The thing is I don't expect you'll have to rebuild them for a very long time.

When I took my MC joints apart they were entirely dry after a year and a half. I took my Savvy joints apart that I bought from Starkey who wheeled them kinda hard. They still had grease in them. I cleaned them up while I was there, but it wasn't necessary. The ball actually moves inside the joint of the JJ but the ball does not move inside the joint of the MC. It's bonded to the rubber bushing, so it pulls and eventually rips off.
 
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JMT said:
You have to take the joint apart with snap ring pliers and a press or the special expensive tool (2 tools if you have different size jj's). It's a matter of minutes to take one apart. The thing is I don't expect you'll have to rebuild them for a very long time.

When I took my MC joints apart they were entirely dry after a year and a half. I took my Savvy joints apart that I bought from Starkey who wheeled them kinda hard. They still had grease in them. I cleaned them up while I was there, but it wasn't necessary. The ball actually moves inside the joint of the JJ but the ball does not move inside the joint of the MC. It's bonded to the rubber bushing, so it pulls and eventually rips off.
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***** The ball actually moves inside the joint of the JJ but the ball does not move inside the joint of the MC. It's bonded to the rubber bushing, so it pulls and eventually rips off *****
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That description right there says it all for me to know that the JJ is the way to go. Thanks.
 
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Texas-TJ said:
I don't do a lot of trails or off-roading, except on South Texas beach sand. I currently have RE arms and want to switch over to something much better. How difficult is it to perform the required maintenance on the Savvy arms to keep them in optimal condition?
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I have done very little to my Johnny Joints and never had them apart over the past 12-13 years, they are still fine.
 
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I was having to tear down all 8 of my Johnny joints 2-3 times a year to grease them, the creaking and groaning was unbearable. My metalcloak joints are nice and quite. The oldest ones are over ten years old, no problems. However, I dont wheel as hard or frequent as I used to.
 
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Texas-TJ said:
How often do you hit the zerks with a little red n tacky??
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Greasing a johnny joint while still assembled is a fool game. They don't take grease, and if you do manage to squeeze some in there, you run the risk of damaging the Poly race.

I live in an area where there is clay mud...it sucks the oil out of the grease and leaves a sticky mess behind. Its nasty, and requires me to rebuild my joints at least once a year. I've been trying different greases and techniques to keep it in there. I'm about due for another rebuild...
 
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Mike_H said:
Greasing a johnny joint while still assembled is a fool game. They don't take grease, and if you do manage to squeeze some in there, you run the risk of damaging the Poly race.

I live in an area where there is clay mud...it sucks the oil out of the grease and leaves a sticky mess behind. Its nasty, and requires me to rebuild my joints at least once a year. I've been trying different greases and techniques to keep it in there. I'm about due for another rebuild...
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what kind of techniques?
 
Texas-TJ said:
what kind of techniques?
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I have a few grease grooves carved into a couple of my front control arm bushings. I'm using Energy Suspensions Poly bushing Grease (silicon based, vs Petroleum) and I wanted to get more in there, since the joint fits so tight, I believe most of the grease squeezes out anyway.

Kinda like the Double loop pattern here.

standard-groove-types.jpg
 
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I can say from experience that it can take about 30k miles of neglect to wear out the poly races in a Johnny Joint. And all it takes is a large thin washer from a good hardware store to pack the worn races tight again in the housing.
 
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Mike_H said:
I have a few grease grooves carved into a couple of my front control arm bushings. I'm using Energy Suspensions Poly bushing Grease (silicon based, vs Petroleum) and I wanted to get more in there, since the joint fits so tight, I believe most of the grease squeezes out anyway.

Kinda like the Double loop pattern here.

View attachment 405559
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Are you getting any different results from the Energy Suspension stuff? I have it in half of my joints and I'm hearing squeaking again but I don't know where it's coming from yet.

My controlled experiment seemed to demonstrate that the clay sucked up more stuff out of the Redline stuff but I didn't have a way to evaluate what remained so I'm not sure how useful the test was.
 
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