Death wobble puzzle

Hilton

Hilton

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Joined
Sep 25, 2020
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Shreveport
Good morning!

I have a 2005 Rubicon that I got about a year ago from a friend of mine.

3.5" lift with 32.8" tires.
RE springs with matching shocks
Supporting mods.

About 6 weeks ago it started getting death wobble every once in a while, and then more frequently until the Jeep was basically unable to be driven. It's not a daily driver.

I replaced the RE track bar with a Currie because of everything I read. I also replaced the RE stabilizer with a new one, bought quicker disconnects *(mainly cosmetic I'm embarrassed to say) and rotated my tires front to back.

The wobble didn't go away.

I bought the Currie correctlynk steering system, installed it, and did an at home alignment with some aluminum square bar.

The wobble is much better, but still there.

I think the bracket for the steering stabilizer has made contact with the track bar. I'll rotate it slightly up this evening.

The pitman arm is NOT a drop.

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What do you think I should do next? I'm running out of ideas. Control arms are reasonably new.

Steering box?
Rear trackball?
 
Put wrenches on each amd every suspension bolt, make sure they are tight!
Put the wheels on the ground and get under it while someone wiggles the steering back and forth about 6” of turn. Look and feel for what parts are moving. Perticularly at mounting bolts / points
 
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That's a good suggestion, and I did that already.
I THOUGHT I felt movement at the heim joint on the RE track bar. That's what started my journey into the land of expensive Rock Jock parts.
Initially I contacted RE because of their "lifetime warranty regardless of who originally bought it" policy. The metal bar is under warranty forever, but any part that may actually fail is not covered. I looked at replacing the heim joint alone and it was close *(well, relatively) to the price of a new RE1600 track bar. I liked what I read about the Currie version and the Johnny Joints and decided to go that route. I replaced the sway bar disconnects at the same time because they were ugly and I didn't like having to push up on the vehicle to remove the center section.

Probably accidental consequation, but the wobble really got bad when I took the doors, roof, and spare tire carrier off the Jeep. I wonder if the weight change made a difference. Of course it may have just been a coincidence.

I'm puzzled, but I'm not upset... yet.

I grabbed each of the front wheels when the Jeep was off the ground and shook them. The hubs felt tight and normal.
 
Put the axles on jack stands, then take a pry bar and try to lift up the the tire. That's a good way to check for ball joint looseness that may not be apparent with bare hands.
 
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I'm a terrible mechanic, but a fantastic parts swapper!

I've had mixed results with my methods.

On a side note, I accidentally created a duplicate thread and I'd love it if a mod would combine them into one.
 
Hilton said:
Good morning!

I have a 2005 Rubicon that I got about a year ago from a friend of mine.

3.5" lift with 32.8" tires.
RE springs with matching shocks
Supporting mods.

About 6 weeks ago it started getting death wobble every once in a while, and then more frequently until the Jeep was basically unable to be driven. It's not a daily driver.

I replaced the RE track bar with a Currie because of everything I read. I also replaced the RE stabilizer with a new one, bought quicker disconnects *(mainly cosmetic I'm embarrassed to say) and rotated my tires front to back.

The wobble didn't go away.

I bought the Currie correctlynk steering system, installed it, and did an at home alignment with some aluminum square bar.

The wobble is much better, but still there.


The pitman arm is NOT a drop.
Click to expand...

If it's really "unable to be driven" the dry steering test should show what's wrong pretty quickly. It's probably something really worn out, a couple things somewhat worn out. Maybe some of each.

If "unable to be driven" is somewhat of an exaggeration we need more details than you've shared. When, where and what starts the DW? How do you stop it (temporarily)?

Exaggeration or not:

Were the lift, tires and "supporting mods" done before you got the TJ or shortly before the DW?
What are those "supporting mods"?
 
Ok...
These are always so hard to diagnose on the inTRAnet.

#1 erase from your brain thinking something can't be it because "it's new"
Start again with the dry steering test.
Have a helper move the wheel a few inches back and forth.
NOT RUNNING! You need solid ground unaided offering resistance.

Watch every single joint.
(This isn't a race)
Pitman arm on the splined box shaft. (Yes they wear out and a softer material than the hardened shaft)
The TRE at the Pitman...
All TRE'S after.
It's a daisy chain of steering joints. If one is bad...it needs fixed and then down the daisy chain you might find another.

Once you've verified all steering joints are OK watch the track bar...
Both ends very closely!!!

There should be absolutely positively no movement there.
ZERO

Nearly all death wobble we get at the shop here is track bar related.

Good luck
 
Paparock1,

I'll do it again, that's exactly the thread I followed.

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Rubicon88,

Thanks for the post. I'll get on it.


The lift was already on the Jeep when I got it. I wrote down in a notebook all the mods when my friend sold it to me. I'll refer to it and type a list when I get home.

I appreciate the help.
 
When was the last time your tires were balanced? If I remember correctly, @Jerry Bransford says that death wobbly 99% is caused by an imbalanced front tire. Just something worth mentioning
 
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DylanM345 said:
When was the last time your tires were balanced? If I remember correctly, @Jerry Bransford says that death wobbly 99% is caused by an imbalanced front tire. Just something worth mentioning
Click to expand...
I think the opinion on this is that is a big cause of just vibrations some of which can be very very bad. Steering would play into that too. Sources from a very good friend of mine who has ran multiple shops, worked at Weddle, Currie etc - he says most ppl confuse the two. Death wobble being a harmonic issue caused almost always by incorrect caster and suspension geometry, the others just being really bad vibrations from the items others mentioned. Might be good to get OP to differentiate.
 
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I just installed 2" springs and got the death wobble. My alignment was off an inch. Reset and now it seems to be good to go
 
Rubicon88 said:
Ok...
These are always so hard to diagnose on the inTRAnet.

#1 erase from your brain thinking something can't be it because "it's new"
Start again with the dry steering test.
Have a helper move the wheel a few inches back and forth.
NOT RUNNING! You need solid ground unaided offering resistance.

Watch every single joint.
(This isn't a race)
Pitman arm on the splined box shaft. (Yes they wear out and a softer material than the hardened shaft)
The TRE at the Pitman...
All TRE'S after.
It's a daisy chain of steering joints. If one is bad...it needs fixed and then down the daisy chain you might find another.

Once you've verified all steering joints are OK watch the track bar...
Both ends very closely!!!

There should be absolutely positively no movement there.
ZERO

Nearly all death wobble we get at the shop here is track bar related.

Good luck
Click to expand...
I like this post and have seen more track bar related DW than everything else, but there is a fairly broad number of causes, and even some weird science Blaine has seen, as he has been under more than a few.

He also mentioned once the upper front control arm bushing, passenger side needs to be watched...and I have found that to be true....the mount is basically sheet metal.

If it happens consistently at a certain speed it is likely tire or harmonic related...if a bump sets it off then you need to look hard for loose or failing parts ...and dont go by shaking things by hand.....the forces at play are far greater.
 
I thought tires too, and rotated front to back. Figures the odds of all of them being out of balance was low.
Checked air pressure tonight. Was at 29ish. I lowered to 26. The temps have gone up recently. Pv=nrt etc. Noble gas law from 20 years ago.
Took another test drive. Only one wobble the whole time, right after I crossed some rr tracks. I can live with this. I'd rather it go away though.
An is another alignment and possibly a different toe setting. I'm at 1/16" in. The paperwork on the Currie steering setup says that if wobble occurs I should go up to 1/8th toe OUT. I'll start moving in that direction soon.

I also bought parking brake shoes. I'm pretty excited about swapping them. I've never done anything like them before. They seem like drums, but inside the hat of the disk brake. I'll figure it out.
 
Hilton said:
I thought tires too, and rotated front to back. Figures the odds of all of them being out of balance was low.
Checked air pressure tonight. Was at 29ish. I lowered to 26. The temps have gone up recently. Pv=nrt etc. Noble gas law from 20 years ago.
Took another test drive. Only one wobble the whole time, right after I crossed some rr tracks. I can live with this. I'd rather it go away though.
An is another alignment and possibly a different toe setting. I'm at 1/16" in. The paperwork on the Currie steering setup says that if wobble occurs I should go up to 1/8th toe OUT. I'll start moving in that direction soon.

I also bought parking brake shoes. I'm pretty excited about swapping them. I've never done anything like them before. They seem like drums, but inside the hat of the disk brake. I'll figure it out.
Click to expand...
Thats a rubicon drum in hat rotor , odd but innovative, like my 3 hole underwear idea you rotate each day then turn inside out ...six days of use with one wash.

The railroad track says it all....something is loose or a bushing is failing which equates to less density and faster movement and/ or too much movement.

You really need to check your control arm torque and bushings, and watch for the upper right to be moving in the mount...it works but really doesnt have a lot of surface area holding it.
 
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