04 LJK Repair, Redo, Recycle - The 3 R's of a First Build

I did the same when I forgot. Full taco of the link mount. Only took one time though.
I'll probably just leave it as is for the time or hammer it straight again. It has a lateral brace right up until the area with the bolt so that sway bar generates some high torque.
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90* vertical looking from the front to back. i think if it swings past vertical it then has to jump that point to get back. it seems kinda similar with a sway link...... if it gets past that point it might come back or it might try and go the other way once force gets applied again. if the shock leans in and the TB tries to shove the axle back??
 
90* vertical looking from the front to back. i think if it swings past vertical it then has to jump that point to get back. it seems kinda similar with a sway link...... if it gets past that point it might come back or it might try and go the other way once force gets applied again. if the shock leans in and the TB tries to shove the axle back??
The shock doesn't control the motion of the axle, that's the job of the control arms and trackbar. As long as the heim joints aren't bound up the shock can only transfer load down it's axis in which case I can't see how a couple degrees matters one way or the other.
 
The shock doesn't control the motion of the axle, that's the job of the control arms and trackbar.
right. the TB controls the axle on an arc if the shock is taking force while the TB is in the low end of the arc it pushes the axle back against the the shock that is leaned in if it can't be forced back out it folds no? an arc vs a linear motion. ya the joints are suppsed to allow that movement but if your on the wrong side of that action your bent. if you get trapped inside the fulcrum your bent. IDK how to word it right.

now IDK how much is to much, i might be totaly mistaken but thats what i see.
 
right. the TB controls the axle on an arc if the shock is taking force while the TB is in the low end of the arc it pushes the axle back against the the shock that is leaned in if it can't be forced back out it folds no? an arc vs a linear motion. ya the joints are suppsed to allow that movement but if your on the wrong side of that action your bent. if you get trapped inside the fulcrum your bent. IDK how to word it right.

now IDK how much is to much, i might be totaly mistaken but thats what i see.
I'm not following, would need a picture. If you're misalignment bushings are not bound up or at their maximum misalignment then the shock remains a 2-force member resisting only axial loads.
 
I'm not following, would need a picture. If you're misalignment bushings are not bound up or at their maximum misalignment then the shock remains a 2-force member resisting only axial loads.
i'm probably missing something.... i'll ponder a bit more on it and see if i can find the words.

panhard control to the axle seems would have a fair bit of influence and maybe provide some forgiveness.
an axle without (rear) would have to fight the suspensions action as it tried to push the thing back outside of vertical bushings or not.....and not just a shock i thought this was a CO....... a sole support and dampening mechanism it aint just pushin a weak shock it's has to fight the weight on the springs too. once it leans in past 90 it's trying to keep the axle in as the axle tries to get back out. without a panhard to help........... can your stems beat your links in an arm wrestling match.
 
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i'm probably missing something.... i'll ponder a bit more on it and see if i can find the words.

panhard control to the axle seems would have a fair bit of influence and maybe provide some forgiveness.
an axle without (rear) would have to fight the suspensions action as it tried to push the thing back outside of vertical bushings or not.....and not just a shock i thought this was a CO....... a sole support and dampening mechanism it aint just pushin a weak shock it's has to fight the weight on the springs too. once it leans in past 90 it's trying to keep the axle in as the axle tries to get back out. without a panhard to help........... can your stems beat your links in an arm wrestling match.
I think you have a fundamental misunderstanding of the role of the shock (or coilovers) in our linked suspensions (or we're just not communicating well to each other via forum posts). Pictures really help, draw out what youre concerned about. The shock does not control the motion of the axle it only resists acceleration (ie damps movement) and the CO springs set the at rest position of the shock (ride height). If your shock ever fights in a proverbial arm wrestling match with your control arm, it loses. Which is why it doesn't do that. And I'm trying to say that going slightly past 90 deg doesn't change the fact that it is or is not fighting the control arms UNLESS you have consumed the amount of misalignment I'm your heim joints on either e d of the CO. The CO can also provide limiting function for the kinematics of the axle (the path of motion for the axle). When serving as a limit strap, it is just that acting like a strap.

Whether or not the axle has a panhard or 4 link is not relevant. The triangulation of the 4 link or the panhard of the so called 3-link are just what's required to control all degrees of freedom of the axle. That's not to say that some designs don't make the damper or spring an integral part of the suspension mechanism. For example the McPherson strut on IFS cars or the leaf spring on a traditional truck rear end. Those items control motion and provide some spring/damper functions. The linked suspensions of the TJ+ era divorce the the three roles: motion control, damper, spring.

It seems you have the concept of a sway bar end link in head, where it goes past top dead center and now lacks control over a degree of freedom. That doesn't exist in the coilover / 3 link discussion.
 
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Worked on what will be my spare mount. I copied heavily in concept from Blaine's. I REALLY wanted to make this out of riveted aluminum as a test of how to do that style of fabrication. I want to make the console and rear storage with that construction and I like the aircraft style construction look of it. Here are my pieces assembled out of sign board. It's not impossible to rivet together, I'd use extruded angle on the inside to rivet through. I just have to decide if I want to put that much effort into a part that is completely covered by the spare tire.

The spare tire itself will rest against the bottom bolt heads so that means that bottom piece will need to be 3/16 so I can countersink screws flush in it. The plate that mounts to the wheel adapter vis-a-vis the spare tire will probably be 1/4". 1/8" everywhere else.

I had to offset the spare to the passenger side to clear the latch handles. There really isn't a whole lot of room between handles and the tail light a 40" tire would be a tight fit.

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On the topic of the coilover past T.D.C. (past 90*), I would think if the coilover had excessive preload, fully extended, it could counteract the natural arc of the track bar. It will get there but might have some resistance, at first? However, I would think the serious problem would be if the track bar to coilover angle went beyond 90*. We don't have that problem.
 
On the topic of the coilover past T.D.C. (past 90*), I would think if the coilover had excessive preload, fully extended, it could counteract the natural arc of the track bar. It will get there but might have some resistance, at first? However, I would think the serious problem would be if the track bar to coilover angle went beyond 90*. We don't have that problem.
Not following, the only way the shock could counteract the natural arc of the track bar is to bend the track bar. Otherwise it travels in the same radius arc regardless of shock angle. As far as resistance, that's the shocks job to resist acceleration.
 
@sierradmax mentioned this site sendcutsend and this spare holder seemed like the perfect test. I drew up the pieces I made out of signboard with a couple modifications to make it kind of self jig and not have as much offset to the passenger side. I am constrained by the latch handles on the driver side. Blaine mentioned to just cut the handle and center the tire which is probably the best option but I decided to leave it offset to passenger side by a few inches because I like the handles and appreciate the leverage to crank them down tight. Prices are shown to give you some feel for if others might want to use them and includes shipping to WA. Put order in Sunday evening and should ship on next Monday.
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So far so good, will weld and check if the spare fits tomorrow. It was so rad how good everything fit together. I did have to take a little off the bottom off of the side legs but everything else was spot on.View attachment 330612
looking good, once you get done, do mine :)

Missed you at Reiter today... had fun in tank traps :D
 
Looks real good. Do you think you saved any money in lieu of fabricating yourself? Another good site I've used is www.OSHcut.com
Not sure if I saved any money, I did this for quality not cost. Also i'm kind of over Hours of angle grinder and mountains of dust. This was so very nice slapping everything together. It still took some edge break prep work. Then I got into a whole lot of welding. Thanks to @mrblaine who helped me learn something and try different techniques, settings etc chasing a decent weld.

I have a lot of grinding to do, going to try to make the outside look weldless on the corners.
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I did a test fit with just the tack welds. I think it might work!
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Things did move a bit in the welding bolt holes are not perfect which sucks but I think it'll work. Hit it with some steelit. I got a die grinder and worked on making the outer corners look unwelded per Blaine's tutelage. Turned out pretty clean. Definetly the best I've ever done. I'm going to put another coat of steel it. Let it cure for a few days then color match the outside Light khaki, then clear coat. On the interfaces between steel and aluminum I'm going to add a piece of black vinyl wrap to keep things from fretting and gouging up the aluminum.

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