Novak Conversions Jeep Wrangler TJ engine mounts

05 TJ getting an audio upgrade and a back up camera

strappah

New Member
Original poster
Supporting Member
Joined
Jul 18, 2023
Messages
15
Location
Cincinnati
I've had my TJ for a week but have been researching audio upgrades for about a month. Based on a previous install in a CJ-7, I figured I would just pick up a marine radio and some Polk db speakers from Crutchfield and be on my way. It had been awhile since I'd shopped for car audio gear and I was surprised at newer tech like compact and bluetooth amps but also disappointed by the current single DIN marine radios. A Google search to see what other TJ owners had done brought me to this forum. I've probably spent more time reading threads here than is good for my job but I definitely feel like I've picked up a lot of great info.

I'm long winded, I apologize in advance. Questions just below the next section with the endless babble about thought process following that so it can be easily skipped.

Short(ish) version:
  1. First priority is swapping the dash speakers with some high efficiency speakers. I'm looking for something that will give me more volume and clarity on the stock head unit or an aftermarket head unit until I decide if I want to go with an amp. Budget is $100, maybe $125 for something that will really go above and beyond. I've been looking at 90db and above, so based on Crutchfield and the threads I've read here, that would be Kicker DS, CS, or KS series, the Polk db (realizing they are not as highly thought of as they used to be), or maybe even the Hertz Unos. Doesn't have to be Crutchfield but I've had good luck with them so that's where I'm looking so far. Components are an option if I can keep the tweeter protected from the weather.
  2. Second priority is a back up camera. I didn't expect to be that worried about visibility in a Jeep that will rarely have the back window in or the top up until my first day doing daycare pick up in it. Backing up in those parking lots is stressful enough, but a topless TJ is like a toddler magnet. I have enough parts from other installs to piece something together relatively quickly but will be using the info here to help figure out the wiring.
  3. Third is swapping the head unit. Lots to consider here but I definitely want enough power to drive the speakers while driving with the top down. Enough power to hear on the highway may not be doable without an amp but I'm hoping to at least hear up to 40mph.
  4. The rest - self-power sub, amp, amp for a sub, amp(s) for sub and speakers, kick panel and sound pod speakers, etc. all comes later.
Questions:
  1. Am I being unrealistic to hope for enough volume off a head unit only to hear at 40mph with the top down? How about 60? I think I saw a few posts said yes as long as they had an amp powering a sub so they could filter the lows away from the rest of the speakers but I may have misunderstood.
  2. Anyone try a marine bluetooth amplifier like JVC KS-DR1204DBT or Kenwood KAC-M5024BT yet? I've seen this asked 2 or 3 times but I haven't found an answer yet (still more searching to do). I'm wondering if I should just leave the stock unit in place as a theft deterrent and go with a bluetooth amp to give me power enough to drive the speakers along with bluetooth functionality.
  3. Anyone running Hertz Uno series, X130 or K130? According to the marketing spiel and the 93 sensitivity, these should be great with head unit only power now but also be capable of handling amp power later. Saw these mentioned in lists of speakers being considered recently but haven't read anything yet about someone using them. Wondering if these live up to the name and ratings or if it just marketing fluff.
  4. Anyone have pictures of the inside of a Tuffy Series II Center Console, with or without the sub installed? The marketing pics for these are tiny and ancient (startac phone and early Garmin GPS unit are mid to late 90s photoshoot giveaways). I'm trying to compare storage space of the stock center console with sub vs a Tuffy console with or without the Sub installed and haven't been able to find decent photos of the Tuffy yet.
  5. If at the end of this I have a mix of speakers running off the head unit and speakers/sub running off an amp, what do I need to take into consideration when picking speaker/amps for this? Are there delays that need to be set on the head unit or the amp to keep everything in sync? Or is the additional processing time for the amp not a concern?

The MUCH longer version:

I've been thinking about this way too many hours the last month. I wanted to make sure I knew what I was looking for before I stared spitting out questions and pulling the dash apart.

Current state: I've got the stock 6 disc changer radio with the sub. When I first turned on the radio, all I could hear was low end distortion, even with the bass turned all the way down. I assume the sub is blown or deteriorated or the amp is wasted. I pulled the fuse and that solved that issue. Listened to the rest of the speakers individually. They all work but they don't sound good. They aren't quite crackly but they are very tired as is to be expected for their age and mileage. CD changer works. Previous owner left a bluetooth via FM station adapter so I can stream but that isn't my favorite approach.

Goal: Cleaner sound. Enough volume to be heard top down at 35-40 a must, 60-65 would be fantastic. Playback via streaming and/or mass storage device is almost mandatory. This Jeep will be a seasonal street vehicle only used for errands, school drop off/pick up, and some fun drives. The system doesn't need to keep me awake on long commutes or vacation travel, but some entertainment for bouncing around town would be nice. I do not have a trained ear so it won't take audiophile quality to impress me.

Limitations: 2 car seats in the back seat mean I can't pull the back seat out to make more space for gear. The storage space behind the seat is barely enough as it is so I want to keep that as empty as possible. Any gear will have to fit in the dash, under the seats, in the console, and/or in the kick panels.

Music to support: I listen to a wide variety of music so the system will hopefully be able to support everything from 70s rock to 80s pop to metal and techno along with Frozen, Baby Shark, and The Lego Movie for the riders in the back (if it can refuse to play JoJo Siwa I'd consider that a plus but not a requirement).

Experience: I've done around 10 head unit swaps and speaker installs so I'm pretty comfortable with taking the dash apart and popping off door panels. I've installed peripherals like changers, satellite radios, mp3 drives, and back up cameras so running and hiding wires is definitely doable. I have zero experience with amps and subs, so running power all the way from the battery will be new for me. Also, I've always soldered my harness adapters which sounds like a big no no according to the "Basic wiring connector and terminal questions, product related" thread from last month so I'll need to step it up there. I'll try to use the existing threads as much as possible for amps and subs but I may have a few questions when/if I get there. I don't know much about tuning the overall system or setting the soundstage but am looking forward to learning more.

Timeline: Dash speakers and back up camera in the next 2 weeks. Head unit in the next few months. Everything else can wait a bit.

Budget: Up to $100 for the dash speakers, maybe a bit more if someone convinces me something like the Hertz K 130 is worth the extra cash. Other than a few bits for mounting and power I shouldn't need to spend much on the camera. Past that I don't know yet - the TJ has 182k miles on it with no major work done, I'm not sure how much money I want to put into upgrades if there are major repairs right around the corner. I'm already getting some errors for O2 sensor issues and some rust repair to get done. I'll have a better idea on the rest in a few months.

Components being considered (links below):
Short Term Speakers: I've got some 16yr old very lightly used Polk db525s in my CJ-7 that would be an ideal quick fix since they aren't going to be used for at least the next 6-9 months until the 7 is road ready again. The only problem with this is that getting the driver side speaker out is a real pain given all the other stuff back there, and putting something back in wouldn't be much fun either. I'm not sure the money saved using something on hand is worth all the effort and tool throwing that would be involved making it happen. I also have some 16 year old Polk db 6500 and db 650s in my daily driver that would be decent for kick panel pods and sound bar pods, I could pull those and then upgrade my truck where quality speakers have a better chance of succeeding, so to speak. I know these Polks are all pretty efficient with head unit only power and the marine certification is always a bonus for a Jeep. Past that, as I mentioned above, I'm considering the Kicker DS, CS, or KS series, the Polk db522, or maybe even the Hertz Unos. I know the Polks were popular 5 years ago but it has been at least that long since the model has been updated and they have fallen somewhat out of favor as a result - I'm keeping them in consideration due to my past experience and their marine certification.

No matter what speaker I go with, I'll be using the brackets that shift the aim more toward the driver's torso instead of their knees as well as some baffles I have leftover from a previous install. I won't be going with the select pods as I'd rather spend that money on kick panel pods.

Long Term Speakers: If I go with an amp later, I'll take a closer look at the BLAM, Match, and Skar that have been mentioned in numerous threads. I don't think any of these are decent options on head unit only power. Hoping for components somewhere in the mix.

Head units: Only 1 of the single DIN marine radios currently for sale at Crutchfield have the USB connection on the back of the unit which is a bit of a disappointment. I'm not a big fan of having cables hanging from the from of the unit and the waterproof covers that are suggested for boats usually block these ports anyway. The design just seems off to me. So that kills my original plan. I've got 2 10+ year old marine units and 2 15-25 year old Kenwood units not currently being used. All of these have some sort of aux input, changer control, or MP3 capability so any of them would add functionality the stock unit doesn't offer. But seeing as how the install gear for these would run $40 for single din or $100 for double din, I'm not sure it is worth spending that money to install a much older device when Crutchfield would give me the install gear for free/discounted if I bought a new and far more capable head unit. I'm also not sure if I'm putting too much emphasis on the marine radio - resistance to the elements is nice and all, but if it doesn't have the functionality I want it may not really matter how long it lasts.

Amps/Subs: My only direct experience with amps and subs is the set ups that were built to deafen everyone in the car and annoy the neighbors. I know that isn't the only use for amps and subs, I just haven't experienced it personally. It sounds like an amp is the best way I'm going to get decent sound at highway speeds with the top down so this will definitely be a consideration. The threads have been very informative as to all the options for getting 1-2 amps in place without sacrificing valuable space. I've tagged several in dash installs I plan on revisiting. Short term, I have an unused still in the box Kenwood KSC-SW1 and the wiring kit to go along with it. It is a self powered dual 6.5 inch sub (1 powered, 1 not), so it is a lot bigger than the newer compact 6-8 inch self-powered subs. I'm not sure if I can fit it under the back seat the way people have done with the smaller KSC-SW11. If I can find a spot for it, I'll use it. It is old and underpowered compared to new options but better than nothing. Long term, I really like the size and specs of the JBL BassPro Nano. I may consider swapping in the Kicker in the stock location that have been discussed here as well, but I may want to put in a Tuffy console to increase the amount of lockable storage space so an under seat option may be better.

Old gear on hand:
https://www.crutchfield.com/p_107DB525/Polk-db525.html
https://www.crutchfield.com/p_107DB6500/Polk-Audio-db6500.html
https://www.crutchfield.com/p_107DB650/Polk-Audio-db650.html
https://www.crutchfield.com/p_575CP4DCKS/Rockford-Fosgate-CP4DCKS.html
https://www.crutchfield.com/S-6kt3ecxRrll/p_113KSCSW1/Kenwood-KSC-SW1.html
 
Questions:
  1. Am I being unrealistic to hope for enough volume off a head unit only to hear at 40mph with the top down? How about 60? I think I saw a few posts said yes as long as they had an amp powering a sub so they could filter the lows away from the rest of the speakers but I may have misunderstood.

You likely want more power than what a standard aftermarket deck provides. I’ve gone that route and it’s garbage compared to adding amp power. With additional power, I listened to music doing 70-80mph all the way to PHX Monday night (half doors and no windows).

I was looking at this Sony deck (45w rms x4) back when it wasn’t available due to supply chain shortages. Here’s the marine version as well.

I ended up running a five channel under the steering column so I can’t speak to the results of those decks. But I’d imagine they are way better than the 14w or so rms output of standard decks.

I agree with you on the USB location. I prefer it to be in the back so I can connect through the glovebox if I ever have the need. I just removed both usb cords from the back of my deck because I haven’t used them since installing my android deck two years ago (removed clutter when installing the water/meth injection controller).

If at the end of this I have a mix of speakers running off the head unit and speakers/sub running off an amp, what do I need to take into consideration when picking speaker/amps for this? Are there delays that need to be set on the head unit or the amp to keep everything in sync? Or is the additional processing time for the amp not a concern?

Mixing powered and unpowered speakers would probably not make you happy. The powered speakers would dominate the soundstage and the underpowered speakers would sound relatively flat and weak. You’d have to turn down the powered speakers to better notice the u powered speakers (terrible). There’s a stark difference between speakers running off standard deck power vs decent amp power regarding output and richness.

I’m running the Polk speakers and they sounded weak and flat powered by an alpine deck. With amp power, those same speakers make me super happy and I prefer the output from my dash speakers more than the soundbar speakers.

Listened to the rest of the speakers individually. They all work but they don't sound good.

Sounds terrible lol… you would likely appreciate a moderately priced upgrade.

The system doesn't need to keep me awake on long commutes or vacation travel, but some entertainment for bouncing around town would be nice. I do not have a trained ear so it won't take audiophile quality to impress me.

Limitations: 2 car seats in the back seat mean I can't pull the back seat out to make more space for gear. The storage space behind the seat is barely enough as it is so I want to keep that as empty as possible. Any gear will have to fit in the dash, under the seats, in the console, and/or in the kick panels.

I only run speakers and sub in the stock locations. No need to run dual-ported Sundown SA 12s in a jeep to be happy.

Also, I've always soldered my harness adapters which sounds like a big no no according to the "Basic wiring connector and terminal questions, product related" thread from last month so I'll need to step it up there. I'll try to use the existing threads as much as possible for amps and subs but I may have a few questions when/if I get there. I don't know much about tuning the overall system or setting the soundstage but am looking forward to learning more.

I just use crimp-on heat shrink terminals. Keeps a solid connection and corrosion out.

Timeline: Dash speakers and back up camera in the next 2 weeks. Head unit in the next few months. Everything else can wait a bit.

I was using this as my front camera before I decided that the front camera idea didn’t do much for me function wise.

Ill run it instead of a different rear camera because this one is of higher quality.
Budget: Up to $100 for the dash speakers, maybe a bit more if someone convinces me something like the Hertz K 130 is worth the extra cash. Other than a few bits for mounting and power I shouldn't need to spend much on the camera. Past that I don't know yet - the TJ has 182k miles on it with no major work done, I'm not sure how much money I want to put into upgrades if there are major repairs right around the corner. I'm already getting some errors for O2 sensor issues and some rust repair to get done. I'll have a better idea on the rest in a few months.

Components being considered (links below):
Short Term Speakers: I've got some 16yr old very lightly used Polk db525s in my CJ-7 that would be an ideal quick fix since they aren't going to be used for at least the next 6-9 months until the 7 is road ready again. The only problem with this is that getting the driver side speaker out is a real pain given all the other stuff back there, and putting something back in wouldn't be much fun either. I'm not sure the money saved using something on hand is worth all the effort and tool throwing that would be involved making it happen.

Imo, the polks are cheap enough to just buy another set and save yourself the headache of moving parts around.
I also have some 16 year old Polk db 6500 and db 650s in my daily driver that would be decent for kick panel pods and sound bar pods, I could pull those and then upgrade my truck where quality speakers have a better chance of succeeding, so to speak. I know these Polks are all pretty efficient with head unit only power and the marine certification is always a bonus for a Jeep. Past that, as I mentioned above, I'm considering the Kicker DS, CS, or KS series, the Polk db522, or maybe even the Hertz Unos. I know the Polks were popular 5 years ago but it has been at least that long since the model has been updated and they have fallen somewhat out of favor as a result - I'm keeping them in consideration due to my past experience and their marine certification.

I run Polk 5.25 in the dash (in dash pods) and 6.5 in the soundbar since the PO had 6.5s in there.

No matter what speaker I go with, I'll be using the brackets that shift the aim more toward the driver's torso instead of their knees as well as some baffles I have leftover from a previous install. I won't be going with the select pods as I'd rather spend that money on kick panel pods.

Long Term Speakers: If I go with an amp later, I'll take a closer look at the BLAM, Match, and Skar that have been mentioned in numerous threads. I don't think any of these are decent options on head unit only power. Hoping for components somewhere in the mix.

I was recently informed that I can run 2ohm Blam coax speakers with my amp in the stock locations. I don’t have a need to upgrade but I may end up doing it bc I don’t like having money.
 
Last edited:
Ive done many stereo upgrades over the years
What you have CAN work with an external amp

You need an external amp for good sound
Head units “claimed power” are not going to cut it

I have no idea how that sub sounds so its a toss up
Plus subs are very individual taste

Get an amp, figure out where to install
Mine went in the center console and I wired it all from there
I tossed the junk OEM sub that was there, this fit zero problem

The bracket is just a 2” wide piece of aluminum from Home Depot lbent to shape, and.hot glued fabric on it for some cushion

XIThaQt.jpg
 
Last edited:
Head units “claimed power” are not going to cut it
Save more $$$ and revisiit the idea

Generally speaking yes, but Sony makes higher powered versions that continuously output about the same as an alpine power pack.

Have you tried one of the higher powered Sony decks I linked? I haven’t, but I imagine theres a big difference between a pioneer deck pushing 14wx4 and the Sony pushing 45x4

I’m happy with my amp setup, but not everyone wants to make that effort, so a higher powered Sony deck is a potential alternative to get more output.

Edit: the stock sub enclosure is more than enough to give base with a kicker 6.75 sub and amp once you reinforce the sidewalls of the enclosure with dynamat. I’ve been pleasantly surprised tbh. I run the soundstream Picasso 5-channel under my steering column to make use of dead space and not take up cargo room for speakers or expose electronics if I have a few inches of water intrusion.
 
Last edited:
When it comes to Sony, I was a loyalist in the 90s to their Video equipment, but car audio and home audio was very low grade unless you went to their top of the line home audio

Now I can only speak for my own experiences, but Walmart carried Sony & Pioneer and that was indicative of their level as well. It MAY have changed, dont know

I havent owned a Sony deck in many years
Im not opposed to it, but Id never drive speakers with it

Stereos is just one of those highly subjective areas
We all like different music and levels of volume
Im a metal kinda guy
 
When it comes to Sony, I was a loyalist in the 90s to their Video equipment, but car audio and home audio was very low grade unless you went to their top of the line home audio

Now I can only speak for my own experiences, but Walmart carried Sony & Pioneer and that was indicative of their level as well. It MAY have changed, dont know

I havent owned a Sony deck in many years
Im not opposed to it, but Id never drive speakers with it

Walmart carries a lot of products. That doesn't mean they carry the higher powered (more expensive models) and if they do I wouldn’t consider that a bad thing. It’s not like they are selling a similar but inferior model for 1/2 the cost that Amazon or crutchfield sell it for.

The world has greatly changed how it produces items in the past 20 years. I’ll get the deck that I prefer and judge it based on how it performs, not on where I purchased it from. I’ve never been a Sony guy for car audio, but I like some of their recent offerings over Kenwood and Alpine.

Fwiw, Sony decks seem to be much better than they were in the early 2000s. Their speakers and decks were trash back then.
 
Last edited:
Serious question OP

Do you anticipate leaving your Jeep uncovered in the rain or live in an area where rainfall can sporadically happen ???
If not, you don't need Marine Grade anything. Frankly just keep a quickie cover inside the Jeep at all times.

Those Hertz Uno's the Crutchfield rep steered me away from them, and pointed me to these instead.
Granted they cost more but far better quality overall. You definitely want Components up front for a better sound stage to the listener
https://www.crutchfield.com/p_107DB5252/Polk-Audio-DB-5252.html
The Hertz "Cons" he told me were the foam woofer surround, and the paper woofer even tho it's water repellent, it's not very high end.
I vaguely recall him saying these were technically rated 93db by the 2.83 volt method which is kinda horseshit marketing also IMO
Which means they're really 90db by the 1watt/1meter method that's been used for years. I'm sure I just confused ya, but passing along the info.
https://www.crutchfield.com/p_301K130/Hertz-K-130.html
 
Last edited:
Thank you to all who have replied so far.
You likely want more power than what a standard aftermarket deck provides. I’ve gone that route and it’s garbage compared to adding amp power. With additional power, I listened to music doing 70-80mph all the way to PHX Monday night (half doors and no windows).

I was looking at this Sony deck (45w rms x4) back when it wasn’t available due to supply chain shortages. Here’s the marine version as well.

Mixing powered and unpowered speakers would probably not make you happy. The powered speakers would dominate the soundstage and the underpowered speakers would sound relatively flat and weak. You’d have to turn down the powered speakers to better notice the u powered speakers (terrible). There’s a stark difference between speakers running off standard deck power vs decent amp power regarding output and richness.

I’m running the Polk speakers and they sounded weak and flat powered by an alpine deck. With amp power, those same speakers make me super happy and I prefer the output from my dash speakers more than the soundbar speakers.

Bummer that head unit only is unrealistic but about what I expected. Same with the mix of amp/not amped speakers but that is exactly the info I was looking for so thanks. Good info on the powered Polks as well.

I ordered a pair of the Polk db522 and they should arrive today. Not sure if I'll keep them but I started to feel like if I didn't order something soon I'd just get stuck in my paralysis by analysis phase and still be trying to make a decision in a few years.

That's the 1 marine deck I saw with rear USB. I didn't look much at the specs and didn't realize the built in amp put out that much power rms. I'll have to take a closer look, it could be a good short term option until I've got time to research and install the amp. I'm realizing my previous positive experience with Kenwood is making me quick to ignore everything else. It is an easy way to cut down on looking at too much but also means I miss some good options to consider.

I just use crimp-on heat shrink terminals. Keeps a solid connection and corrosion out.
I'll add that to the options to consider.

Imo, the polks are cheap enough to just buy another set and save yourself the headache of moving parts around.
Agreed. The ones I have don't fit great where they are in the 7 due to the top mount depth so I had to use some spacers. The db522 would be a better fit there. But that driver side speaker was such a pain it may take the speaker not working at all for me to pull it back out.

Ive done many stereo upgrades over the years
What you have CAN work with an external amp

You need an external amp for good sound
Head units “claimed power” are not going to cut it

I have no idea how that sub sounds so its a toss up
Plus subs are very individual taste

Get an amp, figure out where to install
Mine went in the center console and I wired it all from there
I tossed the junk OEM sub that was there, this fit zero problem
Good info. If that old sub wasn't sitting around unused I wouldn't even consider it, I'm not even sure I want to go thru the effort of installing it in my truck that I bought it for way back when given the better options available now. I may just try to get a little $$$ on eBay for it and move on to something newer.

What are you using for wiring and wrap? In that pic it almost looks like flexible steel conduit, is it split loom? I've used wire wrap in the past which has a very nice clean look and offers flexibility for wires having different entry and exit points but is a pain to actually wrap and isn't easy to add more wires to at a later time without unwrapping and rewrapping.

Your build brought Skar speakers to my attention, I hadn't heard of them before. If I go with kick panel pods and amp, I'm definitely going to consider their Maine SK65MB
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07RSKRV8Q/?tag=wranglerorg-20

Ask...............They will tell you everything you need to know about the system you want to build. They won't try to sell you expensive crap that you don't need.
Agreed, Crutchfield is fantastic for information and support. I would have ordered the Polks from them but they kept going in and out of stock. If I go with the Kickers or Hertz I will go thru them. I will almost certainly order my amp and/or additional sub wiring gear from them so I can get their support on the install.
 
  • Like
Reactions: TheBoogieman
What are you using for wiring and wrap? In that pic it almost looks like flexible steel conduit, is it split loom? I've used wire wrap in the past which has a very nice clean look and offers flexibility for wires having different entry and exit points but is a pain to actually wrap and isn't easy to add more wires to at a later time without unwrapping and rewrapping.

Your build brought Skar speakers to my attention, I hadn't heard of them before. If I go with kick panel pods and amp, I'm definitely going to consider their Maine SK65MB
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07RSKRV8Q/?tag=wranglerorg-20

I bought 3/8" wire loom for the power wire
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07PNBYWMP/?tag=wranglerorg-20
I bought 1/4" wire loom by 100' for the 14 gauge speaker wire I used for all speaker runs.
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07KDFD3WP/?tag=wranglerorg-20
Also make sure you buy quality shielded RCA cables so you're not picking up any harmonics.
Length will depend on where you mount your amplifier(s) but mine was 6.6' x 2 for the deck to center console
The sub I have a hop off point from the amp RCA outs

I also have this speaker terminal set for crimping on the proper connectors.
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B08HH6RL1H/?tag=wranglerorg-20
Something like this bypasses the need to carry spare fuses for the amplifier power wiring also if you decide to use it.
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B078XQJFSW/?tag=wranglerorg-20
 
I bought 3/8" wire loom for the power wire
[URL]https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07PNBYWMP/?tag=wranglerorg-20[/URL]

I bought 1/4" wire loom by 100' for the 14 gauge speaker wire I used for all speaker runs.
[URL]https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07KDFD3WP/?tag=wranglerorg-20[/URL]

Also make sure you buy quality shielded RCA cables so you're not picking up any harmonics.
Length will depend on where you mount your amplifier(s) but mine was 6.6' x 2 for the deck to center console
The sub I have a hop off point from the amp RCA outs

I also have this speaker terminal set for crimping on the proper connectors.
[URL]https://www.amazon.com/dp/B08HH6RL1H/?tag=wranglerorg-20[/URL]

Something like this bypasses the need to carry spare fuses for the amplifier power wiring also if you decide to use it.
[URL]https://www.amazon.com/dp/B078XQJFSW/?tag=wranglerorg-20[/URL]

I know to expect misspellings when things are made in China, but this one really cracked me up.

IMG_0802.png
 
  • Haha
Reactions: CreepinDeth
Serious question OP

Do you anticipate leaving your Jeep uncovered in the rain or live in an area where rainfall can sporadically happen ???
If not, you don't need Marine Grade anything. Frankly just keep a quickie cover inside the Jeep at all times.

Those Hertz Uno's the Crutchfield rep steered me away from them, and pointed me to these instead.
Granted they cost more but far better quality overall.
[URL]https://www.crutchfield.com/p_107DB5252/Polk-Audio-DB-5252.html[/URL]

The Hertz "Cons" he told me were the foam woofer surround, and the paper woofer even tho it's water repellent, it's not very high end.
I vaguely recall him saying these were technically rated 93db by the 2.83 volt method which is kinda horseshit marketing also IMO
[URL]https://www.crutchfield.com/p_301K130/Hertz-K-130.html[/URL]

Perfectly legit question. Yes, I think getting rained on topless at some point is very likely. Or I did when I thought I'd run topless all the time. After a week of driving my kids are saying the sun and wind are a bit much with no cover so the soft top will be up more than I'd originally planned. So maybe now only mostly likely. The doors will be off and windows out as much as possible. That doesn't worry me as much for the in dash speakers and the speaker pods are probably ok, but if I go with kick pods I definitely want marine grade, and if I go with components I'd be concerned about the tweeter as well since it will be on the dash, pillar, or near the pod depending on how testing goes. I'm trying to keep my options open as marine grade may be overkill, but it seems like something that should always be considered in a Jeep.

I wish the dash speakers weren't limited to 5.25, it keeps messing with my phased in approach and using the older Polks I already have.

Wow, if Crutchfield is steering you away from that Uno that is going to pretty much kill that idea for me, esp. with the 93@ 2.83 bit. They didn't list it that way so I was hoping it was more of a traditional rating. And good info on the wiring/loom. Thank you!
 
Keep in mind I already had the Skar 6.5” in the rollbar, so he said the Polk DB+ up front was a superior match to the 100w RMS I was driving them with.

I explained to him I already tried the Kicker CS coaxials in front and the Infinity Reference components and wasnt happy.

Much happier with the Polk components up front
Also not sure if u saw in those threads that someone posted FREE 3D printer pod files and I got those done and sent the $90 pods back

Very happy with the printed pods and used polyfill

l8Pzzzo.jpg
 
Also make sure you buy quality shielded RCA cables so you're not picking up any harmonics.
Length will depend on where you mount your amplifier(s) but mine was 6.6' x 2 for the deck to center console
The sub I have a hop off point from the amp RCA outs

To piggyback on RCA recommendations, I specifically use twisted pair for my RCAs to avoid interference (noise).

Doing so eliminated feedback I was getting on one of my previous builds, and I’ve stuck with this ever since. Just something to consider if what you have doesn’t make you happy.
 
I did get a chance over the weekend to start mock up work on the back up camera system.

Having a view out the back of the vehicle in or on top of the dash is nice for when you first go into reverse or while you are backing up/trailering and passing over the dash image while switching focus back and forth between side mirrors. But having the image in the dash isn't as helpful if you are trying to look out the back of the car while backing up. As I tend to still use the old school method of actually looking back when backing up I want a monitor somewhere in the back to fill in the blind spot while I'm turned around in the seat. The 2 places I have in mind so far are on the back right vertical of the roll bar or on top/back of the brake light.

This is something I want to get done fast but also don't know exactly what I want long term (monitor size, enclosure, mounting location) so I'm just using parts on hand for the prototype. I'm using a camera and monitor leftover from previous projects, scrap PVC, and a locking oil funnel for the housing. The housing will not only give it a mount but also some shade and hopefully some cover from the rain.

So far it looks like this:
IMG_8243.jpeg

IMG_8244.jpeg

I used a heat gun to soften the neck of the filter to get the PVC through. The taper of the filter causes the monitor to pop out so I'll probably have to create a ridge for it to sit in - I'll probably use the heat gun to do this as well. If this makes it past initial design and testing, I'll rattle can it all dark grey or black so it blends in a little better.

Location testing:

IMG_8223.JPEG

IMG_8225.JPEG

I like the roll bar view the best so far, but I'm a little concerned it is less protected from the elements and that it may just getting ripped off at speed. The brake light location is more protected, probably easier to secure and potentially better for running the wires, but I felt like I had to turn around more than normal to see it and that a larger screen may be necessary. A folded down soft top would also at least partially block it if it isn't on top of the light.

As for the camera mount, I tested 3 locations.
  1. On the tow hitch receiver. I like mounting a camera in the receiver plug/cover as it is easy to get the wires there and pulling power and a reverse feed off a 7 pin plug is very easy. Unlike mounting on the tailgate it is a fixed position so not as much concern with snaking wires through hinges. You can use it to back into place for towing and then just pull the whole thing out and disconnect the wires to put in the hitch. I wasn't a huge fan of the viewing angle at this level, though. It would have shown the absolute minimum necessary but was dominated by the ground and didn't seem to show the blind spot as well. Maybe if I changed the camera angle a little bit it would have been better, but as of now I'm calling this doable but not ideal
  2. On the bumper. Slightly better angle, still a fixed position, don't have to remove it for towing. Would require some drilling into the bumper or some kind of tie down to mount it, so some better some worse here.
  3. On the spare. This had the viewing angle I liked the beset. This is where the factory mount is for newer Jeeps so there are brackets/cameras available for exactly this location. Cuts down the options if I want to get a cover for the spare (there are some with the whole for the camera but there aren't as many design options). I would hopefully be able to run the wires through the same loom as the brake light and it would be a very short wire run to the monitor if I mount it on the brake light.
I'm leaning toward roll bar mount for the monitor and spare for the camera at this point.

If I ditch the marine head unit idea and put a touchscreen in I'll run the feed there as well. If not, I'll probably add some type of monitor somewhere up front (rear view mirror, dash). Either way, it'll be wired to always have power so I can always check it even if I'm not in reverse.
 
Last edited:
To piggyback on RCA recommendations, I specifically use twisted pair for my RCAs to avoid interference (noise).
Comes down to the amplifier RCA input style
This guy explains it better then I can

70-80% of amps will use coax style inputs to block noise
This is just one of those test and trial things people will have to do on their own, or get lucky (or ask the manufacturer if they understand it)

I worked as a Communications engineer in Chicagos master feed for 15 years, and Im used to working with both and making both

 
Comes down to the amplifier RCA input style
This guy explains it better then I can

70-80% of amps will use coax style inputs to block noise
This is just one of those test and trial things people will have to do on their own, or get lucky (or ask the manufacturer if they understand it)

I worked as a Communications engineer in Chicagos master feed for 15 years, and Im used to working with both and making both


This is interesting thanks for sharing. :)

I figured the twisted pair generally cancelled noise bc the wires are 180* out of phase from each other. I didn’t know it also depends on the construction of the jack side.

I wonder why twisted pair fixed a noise issue in the past on an amp that wasn’t fancy and likely had SE Jacks.

Also, wouldn’t it be beneficial for aftermarket head units to run DI jacks that way the audio doesn’t share the same ground as the other electrical systems?
 
  • Like
Reactions: CreepinDeth
A few quick updates:

Got tired of reading/planning and switched to install/experiment mode. I put a set of db522s in the dash with the MTX angled adapters. Clarity is greatly improved. Volume is slightly better at 40 but still no use at 60, as expected. Bass is still muddled, also as expected. May not be the best all around sounding speaker but I liked the versatility it offered being marine rated.

Gave up on the previously posted approach for the back up camera monitor housing and will be going with a NEMA enclosure instead. If it works, I'll post pics and a link. I realized a few days ago that the brake light wiring doesn't go thru the hinge but connects via contacts on the door frame/tailgate so I'll have to come up with another plan for running the wires.

I was looking at this Sony deck (45w rms x4) back when it wasn’t available due to supply chain shortages. Here’s the marine version as well.
Ordered the Sony DSX-M80 that @Mikee024 mentioned. It has a class D amplifier built in, taking up the space freed up by not having an optical drive. Couldn't find any feedback on it here but did see some reviews from Jeep owners that said it was helpful at highway speeds. I'm gonna give it a try, seemed like a nice option until I decide what to do about amp/sub. If it stinks, it'll go back. Hope to install tonight.

Kids told me the volume required to hear at 40 was too loud for them in the back seat so power to the rear speakers has become a much lower priority. This whole audio issue may have been easier to address with a pair of air pods in transparency mode but where is the fun in that!?!
 
  • Like
Reactions: MikeE024
A few quick updates:

Got tired of reading/planning and switched to install/experiment mode. I put a set of db522s in the dash with the MTX angled adapters. Clarity is greatly improved. Volume is slightly better at 40 but still no use at 60, as expected. Bass is still muddled, also as expected. May not be the best all around sounding speaker but I liked the versatility it offered being marine rated.

Gave up on the previously posted approach for the back up camera monitor housing and will be going with a NEMA enclosure instead. If it works, I'll post pics and a link. I realized a few days ago that the brake light wiring doesn't go thru the hinge but connects via contacts on the door frame/tailgate so I'll have to come up with another plan for running the wires.


Ordered the Sony DSX-M80 that @Mikee024 mentioned. It has a class D amplifier built in, taking up the space freed up by not having an optical drive. Couldn't find any feedback on it here but did see some reviews from Jeep owners that said it was helpful at highway speeds. I'm gonna give it a try, seemed like a nice option until I decide what to do about amp/sub. If it stinks, it'll go back. Hope to install tonight.

Kids told me the volume required to hear at 40 was too loud for them in the back seat so power to the rear speakers has become a much lower priority. This whole audio issue may have been easier to address with a pair of air pods in transparency mode but where is the fun in that!?!

Hopefully the more powerful internal amp does the job. Let us know how it performs for you.
 
I just use crimp-on heat shrink terminals. Keeps a solid connection and corrosion out.

So, potentially stupid question... is there any advantage to using additional heat shrink tubing on top of a heat shrink butt connector? Overkill? Fine if you like the looks? I'm assuming the heat shrink butt connector is enough for inside a dash, this is more of a general question for using this type of connector potentially in other environments.
 
Novak Conversions Jeep Wrangler TJ engine mounts