DEATH WOBBLE!
- Thread starter Tbird Clair
- Start date
Two suggestions... first and most important, get your tires balanced PERFECTLY. I don't care if they were recently balanced, few shops will take the time it takes to get them balanced well enough so they won't cause a shimmy or at times even DW. Have a heart-to-heart talk with the guy who will be doing the balancing before he starts. Tell him you're experiencing DW and he needs to spend extra time to get them perfect. And for him to tell you if he can't get them perfect. I had to return to my local Discount TIre shop twice the same day after they balanced my tires before they figured out they need to spend the time to get them balanced well enough. The bigger the tire, the more critical tire balance becomes.
Second, do a dry steering test... have a helper repeatedly turn the steering wheel back & forth while you look for anything loose that shouldn't be... like side-to-side slop at points like where the track bar is bolted to the axle. Look at everything including the control arm mounts, tie rod ends, track bar, drag link, etc.
DW is commonly caused by a combination of things, often an imperfectly balanced tire to serve as its trigger, together with something loose or worn to let the oscillations caused by the out of balance tire to build up to the point of DW.
Second, do a dry steering test... have a helper repeatedly turn the steering wheel back & forth while you look for anything loose that shouldn't be... like side-to-side slop at points like where the track bar is bolted to the axle. Look at everything including the control arm mounts, tie rod ends, track bar, drag link, etc.
DW is commonly caused by a combination of things, often an imperfectly balanced tire to serve as its trigger, together with something loose or worn to let the oscillations caused by the out of balance tire to build up to the point of DW.
OP
It's been happening here and there recently at low speeds and for short durations... Today it happened at 65 on the highway... Scary as hell, but I thought "hey, at least I'll die driving a jeep"
I am not and expert on DW but have some input on tire balancing. My wifes Acura is very sensitive to tires that are not balance, even the slightest off. would get slight vibration through steering wheel and slight shimmy even though 3 shops balanced the tires. finally she took it to a shop that does what is called Road Force Balancing and wow, what a difference. try to find a place that does road force balancing..
I went thru much the same experience at my local Big O tire store in Utah. They "force balanced" my MT MTZ three different time and never did get them just right. I dealt with this particular store for over 20 years and trust them. I bought the tires and wheels thru Quadratec or as Big O suggested would have taken the defective tire back to the dealer! Finally got rid of the tires and problem was solved.
As Jerry stated get under it and have a helper move that steering wheel. I have had several problems that took forever to track down and it was only by putting my hand on each component was I finally able to locate the problem. Hint: Most often it was trac bar related! Although once it was ball joints--Jack the wheel off the ground and push/pull the tire top and bottom. There should be NO play.
Good luck and please keep us updated.
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That's why I'll only buy my tires from a local source, it's just too hard to take care of problems with them if you bought them over the internet. And most local retail tire stores will either meet online pricing if you push them to, or they'll come close enough to make it worth it to buy local. Not to mention buying local helps to keep our local communities employed.
Ya Jerry it was definitely a lesson learned !That's why I'll only buy my tires from a local source, it's just too hard to take care of problems with them if you bought them over the internet. And most local retail tire stores will either meet online pricing if you push them to, or they'll come close enough to make it worth it to buy local. Not to mention buying local helps to keep our local communities employed.
OP
I'll take this as an opportunity to learn more about how these TJ beasts are put together! Thanks for all your concern and input. The dealer I bought her from wrote a set of new tires at cost into my contract, fortunately! I'll be having new tires put on within the week hopefully! I will be sure to look at things myself and with a mechanic friend who has owned jeeps... Today's commute was death wobble free, thank goodness! Cheers, all!!!
Find out what your tire allowance is and what brand & model tire the dealer is planning to install. It may be a good idea, depending on the tire they're including, to upgrade them to a tire more worthy of a Jeep's purposes. Who knows, maybe the tire they're planning to install is better suited to a Fiat 500.
OP
I'm getting the same as were on it because the spare is the same, (and brand new) and I will use it in the rotation. They are BFG A/T KO2 33x12.5x15
OP
I'm back! Had the new tires installed. They were aware I had DW... They couldn't align it for a bad tie Rod end(s). They say the assembly is expensive $200 ish but the labor is only about 30 minutes? That seem right? Then they can align it.
They also suggested I consider getting an additional stabilizer but I thought I'd see how fixing the tie did me before I had them order that kit. Does this sound right to all you jeep gods?
They also suggested I consider getting an additional stabilizer but I thought I'd see how fixing the tie did me before I had them order that kit. Does this sound right to all you jeep gods?
Munro
New Member
A steering stabilizer won't cure the DW, if tie rods are shot get them changed but adding another stabilizer won't fix DW.
Yeah, are they actually saying to add a *second* stabilizer? I wouldn't do that either.
That tie rod end being bad isn't helping your situation. Definitely fix the rod ends first.
That tie rod end being bad isn't helping your situation. Definitely fix the rod ends first.
OP
Ok. So new tires are on, tie Rod assembly has been replaced and they balanced and aligned it... BUT they inform me that it has negative camber (2 degrees) so it can't be perfectly aligned... The steering wheel vibrates (not DW style) they say to get the camber to negative (offset ball joints?) it'll cost me $700 ish ...do I need to worry about camber? Perhaps it was done on purpose? From what I understand, a negative camber increases handling performance in some situations... The wheel didn't vibrate when I bought it, so I can't see why the camber would have anything to do with that... What am I missing?
PS: haven't had anymore DW.
PS: haven't had anymore DW.
Good news on not having death wobble anymore.
First off, I wasn't even really sure you could adjust the camber on a TJ, especially being a solid axle. Now that I think about it, an offset ball joint (if such a thing exists), does indeed seem like the only way that would be possible.
You DO NOT need an offset ball joint though. Stick with the stock ball joints if they need to be replaced (and they should be if there are 100k+ miles on them). The stock ball joints will put you where you need to be assuming everything else is good.
I'm sorry, but I simply don't trust people aligning a TJ for me. Aligning one of these things is so damn easy to do yourself, that I just like doing it on my own.
It sounds to me like someone is blowing smoke... Seriously. Does this place you took the TJ to have a good reputation of working on vehicles? Notably off-road ones?
The wheel shouldn't be vibrating at all. Does it vibrate all the time, only at certain speeds, or just when applying your brakes?
First off, I wasn't even really sure you could adjust the camber on a TJ, especially being a solid axle. Now that I think about it, an offset ball joint (if such a thing exists), does indeed seem like the only way that would be possible.
You DO NOT need an offset ball joint though. Stick with the stock ball joints if they need to be replaced (and they should be if there are 100k+ miles on them). The stock ball joints will put you where you need to be assuming everything else is good.
I'm sorry, but I simply don't trust people aligning a TJ for me. Aligning one of these things is so damn easy to do yourself, that I just like doing it on my own.
It sounds to me like someone is blowing smoke... Seriously. Does this place you took the TJ to have a good reputation of working on vehicles? Notably off-road ones?
The wheel shouldn't be vibrating at all. Does it vibrate all the time, only at certain speeds, or just when applying your brakes?
Vibration sure sounds like unbalanced tires.
700 ish is rediculous, however it is probably what a dealer would charge for all 4. I would shop around. You should find a "off road" shop that can do it for less.
Stinger has about 70 k miles driven and at least 50k being towed. I have been thru 3 sets of ball joints. They do indeed make off set ball joints and I have had a set to correct 1.5 degree error. That didn't seem to make a bit of difference in the performance. So when I finally beat them up I replaced them with Synergy b joints. They lasted less than 15k miles. Form your own opinion! I now have stock joints and am happy.
X2. Synergy ball joints have earned an abysmal reputation, they're expensive poor quality junk in my personal opinion. I don't think you can beat the Spicers that come in the TJ, or for an upgrade, the upgraded stronger Spicer ball joint at https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00UTD76GY/?tag=wranglerorg-20
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Yes you did exactly, I should have said X2 in the beginning... and I will add that now.That's kinda what I said.