Dilemma for new owner

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Cbinau

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Oct 28, 2018
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Location
Bartlesville, OK
Quick intro: log time lurker first time poster. After mom passed away we designated funds for our sons first vehicle. After driving and searching he chose a Jeep. We found that 97-2000 fit the budget. After testing driving several we ran into a super clean 03. Test drove it on the highway and everything was good.after negations I got it into a reasonable price slightly above budget.

When driving home (2.5 hrs away) on interstate at speedlimit of 75MPH we ran into the “Death wobble”. Luckily from my research I knew what it was. However must occur from 40-55 after a bump. Ours 65-75 after a bump. I drove the rest of the way at 60 and no issues.

Took it to a tire shop and they said it needs a trackbar, steering cylinder and new tires. The tires have more wear on the passenger side and is uneven.

So the dilemma is we can’t afford to fix the suspension issue AND the tires at the same time. They said if we just fix suspension ($500) now and then tires ($850) in a month then the tires will mess suspension up, and if I bought tires the suspension will ruin tires and either situation will void warranty.

So it sounds like my only option is to park it for total repair?
 
Agreed on the second opinion.

The steering gear would be messed up because of DW. Not the cause of it. Unbalanced tires are the cause. A worn track bar allowing the unbalanced tires to shift the axle back and forth is why you feel it. A stock track bar isn’t expensive. I don’t know why this schmuck is telling you 500. Get new tires, balance them, install a new track bar, and you should be good to go.


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Davidtj said:
I would get another opinion
Click to expand...
I second this!

What did they say was wrong with the track bar? The steering damper (which I assume they mean by steering cylinder) won't cause or cure the DW, and generally, all you really need is a cheap Monroe one.

Both are cheap and easy to replace with common hand tools.
 
That shop owner is just trying to take advantage of you, he probably has a new boat payment due. I agree with all of the above advice but when getting the tires balanced, note this... not many tire shops will take the time to get tires balanced any better than what they consider to be "good enough" which is seldom good enough for the type of front-end and larger size tires a Wrangler has. Speak with the guy actually doing the tire balance and tell him you'll slip him an extra $20 or so if he gets them perfect so your wobble goes away.

Before going in for the tire balance, do check that there's nothing loose that can make it easier for your DW to develop. Here's how.... with the tires on the ground, have a helper repeatedly turn the steering wheel back & forth while you watch the steering system for unwanted side-to-side slop/movement where the tie rod, track bar, and drag link components are bolted to their respective mounting points. Especially where the track bar bolts to the axle on the passenger side. Note that they are all mounted on ball joints so there will be normal rotational play about their long-axes. You just don't want any side-to-side slop where they bolt into place which can allow DW to develop more easily after being triggered by a bad tire or imperfect tire balance.

Also make sure your tires are properly inflated. That does NOT mean to inflate them to the psi pressure indicated on the tire's sidewall, that is only the tire's maximum safe air pressure which is never the correct pressure to use. If you'll tell me/us exactly what size tires are installed I can give you a good appropriate pressure to use for your Wrangler. Most of the time tire shops grossly overinflate tires.

FrontEnd.jpg
 
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Thank you all for the comments! The $500 included both parts labor for both and alignment.

Tire size is 255-70-18. They also recommended to maybe go a little wider since I am switching from highway tires to AT tires.
 
Yeah. F that shop. Wider tire because you’re going to an all terrain? Craziness. I don’t understand that.

What part aside from the track bar? Gear box?


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Stox5225 said:
Yeah. F that shop. Wider tire because you’re going to an all terrain? Craziness. I don’t understand that.

What part aside from the track bar? Gear box?


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Click to expand...
Besides trackbar the invoice labor says “Sterling Cylinder” but the part is “Steering Stabilizer”
 
Do you work on your own vehicles at all? If so, do a dry steer test ( there are videos online ) and see what you find. A trackbar can wear out but often times it is a loose axle end bolt which allows it to shift back and forth. Technically it is a steering damper, it does not stabilize anything. They are there simply to slow quick back and forth movement in the steering wheel. A properly aligned vehicle with good steering components and good tires do not even need them.

Bad tire balance is often the cause of death wobble. Tire balance on the TJ needs to be dead on. Plus it sounds like your tires are pretty beat up, not helping the situation at all.

You can shoot some video of the dry steer test and post it up for the forum to check out. I'd bet money the forum will get you better information than that tire shop.

And welcome to the forum!
 
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Cbinau said:
Besides trackbar the invoice labor says “Sterling Cylinder” but the part is “Steering Stabilizer”
Click to expand...

Hm. For the labor involved with either part (cylinder or stabilizer), I still feel as though 500 is high to do either/or and the track bar. I’d bring it elsewhere.


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The dry steering test is best performed by a series of fast & short left-right movements of the steering wheel, maybe a quarter turn before reversing direction. The point is just to see if there's any slop/movement where there shouldn't be. Like quick left/right turns at perhaps one second intervals. Slow turns all the way to the end just make you have to wait until you're at the next reversal to see any potential movement. Like shaking something to see if it rattles.
 
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Cbinau said:
Here is a faster video, sorry about orientation of my phone


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The rigid steel linkages in your steering are fine. What we actually need to see are the joints, which we don't get clear views of. There is a very brief view showing the driver's side tie rod end making a sudden jump when it changes direction. This is the type of thing you are looking for. That particular joint is loose or worn out.

With someone turning the steering wheel back and forth (enough to just move the tires is fine), reach in and hold each connection in the steering links and the track bar. If you feel movement, you need to tighten it or replace it.
 
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Davidtj said:
Just curious why you are staying with 18 inch wheels/tires is that because what’s on there?
May not be your best choice depending on what your plans for Jeep are
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Replacing just the tires is more affordable right now. I dont think we can swing Wheels & Tires. Switching from these HWY tires to an AT tires is an upgrade. We may do minimal offroad when camping, hunting or a small muddy patch here in town.
 
jjvw said:
The rigid steel linkages in your steering are fine. What we actually need to see are the joints, which we don't get clear views of. There is a very brief view showing the driver's side tie rod end making a sudden jump when it changes direction. This is the type of thing you are looking for. That particular joint is loose or worn out.

With someone turning the steering wheel back and forth (enough to just move the tires is fine), reach in and hold each connection in the steering links and the track bar. If you feel movement, you need to tighten it or replace it.
Click to expand...

Ok, I will see if I can get a video of the joints, and report back if there is any play when grabbing the track bar. Thank you!
 
Cbinau said:
Replacing just the tires is more affordable right now. I dont think we can swing Wheels & Tires. Switching from these HWY tires to an AT tires is an upgrade. We may do minimal offroad when camping, hunting or a small muddy patch here in town.
Click to expand...
The cost difference in tires between a 15" and 18" rim will mostly cover the costs of new rims. Then you'd also have the 18" rims to sell, so you'd possibly even be in money.
 
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