Driving a manual is like fly fishing, a auto is like bait casting

mrblaine said:
You sorta missed the point that you are in control and have to drive one and the other you're just along for the ride and just have to remember to turn at the end of the row.
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A long while back I was working my way through an obstacle and being instructed to just keep it in gear and idle through (by the same guy who spotted me into a flop later on). All that did was get me into trouble. So I went back to actually operating and controlling the vehicle as well as I can.
 
Jerry Bransford said:
In nearly 60 years of driving I've never needed to have an automatic transmission rebuilt.
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Sounds like you must trade off vehicles more often than some Jerry. As far reliability is concerned , the world is full of auto trans repair shops , just try to find a manual trans shop. Not that reliability is the end all , but both transmissions have their applications in the world some are easier to drive offroad , some are more difficult to drive offroad but are more efficent in power transfer, reliability and fun. i'm glad you are OK and you guys escaped from The Peoples Republic ! :)
 
ColoJeep said:
Sounds like you must trade off vehicles more often than some Jerry. As far reliability is concerned , the world is full of auto trans repair shops , just try to find a manual trans shop. Not that reliability is the end all , but both transmissions have their applications in the world some are easier to drive offroad , some are more difficult to drive offroad but are more efficent in power transfer, reliability and fun. i'm glad you are OK and you guys escaped from The Peoples Republic ! :)
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Just depends on what you call fun. If driving your Jeep on the street is the fun part for you, then manual is probably for you. If you like 4 low and rocks, auto is the undisputable option.
 
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ColoJeep said:
Sounds like you must trade off vehicles more often than some Jerry.
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Nope I rarely trade my vehicles in, none with less than 120k miles and most are closer to 200k. My present 04 automatic has 120k miles on it. I installed a used 32RH into my previous TJ to convert it from a manual transmission and it had 220k miles on it when stolen 12 years ago. I've had more clutch problems than automatic transmission problems.
 
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Jerry Bransford said:
In nearly 60 years of driving I've never needed to have an automatic transmission rebuilt.
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I keep my vehicles for a very long time (my daily driver is a 24 year old Subaru with 373k on it). I haven't owned many vehicles, manual or automatic, that didn't eventually need a transmission rebuilt. Granted, most times that's in the 200k-300k range, but nearly all eventually wear out. If I didn't keep them forever-ish, I'd likely not consider that in my decision. I like things I can fix myself because it's getting harder and harder to trust someone else to do it right, and with shop rates being what they are, I'm glad I'm a handy feller...
 
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suicideking said:
Just depends on what you call fun. If driving your Jeep on the street is the fun part for you, then manual is probably for you. If you like 4 low and rocks, auto is the undisputable best.
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You know you can have fun in the rocks and the street, it all depends on the gear reduction you chose to build. At some point most extreme off road Jeeps also become almost unusable on the road, forget driving 200 miles on the street. The next step is a Cummins Dodge dragging a car hauler with the jeep.
It all depends on your application and use. If crawling over washing machine size rocks is your type of wheeling then the auto is best/easiest. If you commute on mountain dirt roads, snow, mud and crawling on 18" rocks while keeping the ability to highway drive 200 miles then a manual is just fine.
To each his own .
 
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mrblaine said:
You sorta missed the point that you are in control and have to drive one and the other you're just along for the ride and just have to remember to turn at the end of the row.
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I didn't sorta miss your point. I completely missed it. Piloting a race car and plowing a field (properly) require constant attention. Which one am I just along for the ride?
 
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ColoJeep said:
You know you can have fun in the rocks and the street, it all depends on the gear reduction you chose to build. At some point most extreme off road Jeeps also become almost unusable on the road, forget driving 200 miles on the street. The next step is a Cummins Dodge dragging a car hauler with the jeep.
It all depends on your application and use. If crawling over washing machine size rocks is your type of wheeling then the auto is best/easiest. If you commute on mountain dirt roads, snow, mud and crawling on 18" rocks while keeping the ability to highway drive 200 miles then a manual is just fine.
To each his own .
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My TJ performs perfectly well on the highway and will easily cruise at 80-85 mph with its 5.38 gearing and 4:1 tcase with 35's. You clearly need more experience with automatics in Jeeps.
 
Jerry Bransford said:
Nope I rarely trade my vehicles in, none with less than 120k miles and most are closer to 200k. My present 04 automatic has 120k miles on it. I installed a used 32RH into my previous TJ to convert it from a manual transmission and it had 220k miles on it when stolen 12 years ago. I've had more clutch problems than automatic transmission problems.
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Good to hear, I actually like the 32RH ! The 42RLE is an answer to a question that only existed in Daimler's weird little world. I'm sure your 5.38's help
the cause.
 
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I honestly believe a manual Jeep is more capable in snow, sand and mud than an auto in certain situations will getting the revs up/gaining wheel speed with a little clutch dump, situations like that. Obviously rock crawling the auto is best.
 
Manuals can be, or perhaps the best term would be "could be" just as capable as any auto box. The problem is gearing, and number of gears. Sure - you can put an SM-420 with its 7+:1 1st gear into a Jeep with as low of gears as you'd like in the TC and axles. But its a 4 speed and isn't going to do much for you on the street - blah, blah, blah. A "brownie" on the back end of an SM-420 just might be very nice - but try that on a Jeep! Throw enough money at the problem, and it goes away.

The auto has an "infinite" ratio as often discussed here - its a fast, cheap and easy way to overcome the above problems.

A similar discussion was raging for years in the RV community - which was better for towing? Auto won out for exactly the same reasons as above. Nobody makes a decent light truck manual transmission anymore, blah, blah, blah.

I bought an '86 Chevy with an auto to tow a 5th wheel trailer with. Was it better? It was certainly easier! After a number of years I became completely bored with the auto - I enjoy the "interaction with the machinery" aspect of driving and an auto removes most of that. Plus, most autos don't shift when I want them to, and some shift manually better than others. So I traded off the Chevy on a used '87 F-250 Diesel with manual. The damn first gear wasn't anywhere near low enough - BUT - I sure did enjoy driving/towing again!

The only auto we've owned in the last 22 years is the old MBZ - and we certainly wish it was a manual. Switching it over is problematic, but not unheard of - maybe next time I need to do a transmission change, its been replaced once already.
 
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mrblaine said:
One is like piloting a race car, the other is like plowing a field with a tractor and steering column mounted throttle.
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I grew up with both. A tractor (several from 1930s on) and a 4 speed truck or grain truck.

Then I took my drivers license test with an automatic. If you can drive a tractor and a manual truck, you can drive anything. I bet you guys never drove a high low axle grain truck before you had a driver's license.
 
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I have gone through a few vehicles in the last 40 years. 3 manuals, more auto's. I have also had both manual and automatics in motorcycles and ATV's. Manuals can be fun occasionally in and of themselves. But a lot of what most people ask a vehicle to do is utility - getting from point A to point B. When you are just logging miles, automatics and cruise control have their place.

I like my manual in my 4cyl Tacoma. It makes the best out of way too little hp. I knew I was going to be driving miles in my LJ, and the 6cly has enough power I don't need to be a frugal with hp. I could probably enjoy having a manual, but manuals with cruise control are not very common. I did manage to test drive a manual 6cly - and realized it did not do all that much for me. I guess I like my manuals in higher rev'ing 4 bangers.

fwiw, I currently have a 4cly manual car (my wife's, but it has become the kids car for the last 12 years - I put the better part of 100k miles on it commuting, great gas milage), my ranch Tacoma, a 4cyl manual motorcycle (I have not driven it in many years - my step son wants to restore it), and upgraded my automatic ATV (mostly boring ranch tool) to a manual one last year (fun toy). I have not abandoned my manual fix.
 
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mousehunter said:
I have gone through a few vehicles in the last 40 years. 3 manuals, more auto's. I have also had both manual and automatics in motorcycles and ATV's. Manuals can be fun occasionally in and of themselves. But a lot of what most people ask a vehicle to do is utility - getting from point A to point B. When you are just logging miles, automatics and cruise control have their place.

I like my manual in my 4cyl Tacoma. It makes the best out of way too little hp. I knew I was going to be driving miles in my LJ, and the 6cly has enough power I don't need to be a frugal with hp. I could probably enjoy having a manual, but manuals with cruise control are not very common. I did manage to test drive a manual 6cly - and realized it did not do all that much for me. I guess I like my manuals in higher rev'ing 4 bangers.
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??? Every manual equipped vehicle I've owned in the last 25+ years has had cruise control...
 
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