EV thread

[Zorba]

However this is becoming the trend throughout the car OEMs anyway ...

They learned it from the TelCos. Pre iPhone-on-wheels, and especially pre-electronic cars are already starting to increase in value. I'm not necessarily anti-EV - one would fit nicely with my usage model IF it had cheap, easily replaced batteries and omitted the iPad sprouting out of the dash. But as the market stands today, I have less than zero interest.

 

[Apparition]

That’s what I figured. Comparing a 120k luxury car expenses to a Honda Civic is not fair.

You can select the average cost of specific vehicles but most Tesla models are too new to have numbers. The S is over $1k annual costs. On average Dodge $634, Ford $775, Chevy $649, Ram $858, Honda $428 and Toyota $441

It is interesting to follow the links, looks like most of the article I originally linked was from a Jalopnik article where they had this explaining the JD Power ranking
https://jalopnik.com/advisor/tesla-maintenance-cost/

"J.D. Power reported an average of 176 mechanical issues per 100 Tesla vehicles, compared to an industry average of 121 issues."

I still don't see how they could be that mechanically problematic. I'd have to find what they consider a mechanical problem, for all I know it could be plastic fitment on dash trim.

 

[BugoutJeep]

They learned it from the TelCos. Pre iPhone-on-wheels, and especially pre-electronic cars are already starting to increase in value. I'm not necessarily anti-EV - one would fit nicely with my usage model IF it had cheap, easily replaced batteries and omitted the iPad sprouting out of the dash. But as the market stands today, I have less than zero interest.

I have interest, but I just can't see spending more than I bought my house for, just for a truck that hasn't been invented yet.

I wouldn't mind some smaller EV stuff, but I think for everyday driving, there's not something that makes financial sense and if I'm going to get a small car, then I want the ability to travel or when I go to see family and EVs don't have the range and I don't trust the availability of the charging stations in the Rural US where I'd be travelling.

I guess for now it's just gonna be repair and try to acquire used stuff in a reasonable manner and hopefully I can become a better mechanic, because I'm not buying anything new at the moment. I don't trust any new vehicles right now and I don't think I can reasonably expect the ability to repair anything that's new. I would almost guarantee pricing will be set almost exactly where the OEMs will know when and how they will force you to new models.

 

[BugoutJeep]

You can select the average cost of specific vehicles but most Tesla models are too new to have numbers. The S is over $1k annual costs. On average Dodge $634, Ford $775, Chevy $649, Ram $858, Honda $428 and Toyota $441

It is interesting to follow the links, looks like most of the article I originally linked was from a Jalopnik article where they had this explaining the JD Power ranking
https://jalopnik.com/advisor/tesla-maintenance-cost/

"J.D. Power reported an average of 176 mechanical issues per 100 Tesla vehicles, compared to an industry average of 121 issues."

I still don't see how they could be that mechanically problematic. I'd have to find what they consider a mechanical problem, for all I know it could be plastic fitment on dash trim.

I remember going down this rabbit hole on some vehicle in the past and the headline was basically saying how much X vehicle sucked ie broken all the time. At the end of the article, the big issues were like Bluetooth related nonsense. They had no significant data on anything that failed that actually mattered and likely most of those issues might very well be tracked to user error, if I were to take a guess.

Granted if you're spending a crazy amount of money on a vehicle, then that little stuff better be perfect, but my perspective is just that I don't have a use for an EV and those are about the only vehicles I would consider buying brand new at the moment and even then I don't think I'll be ready for a decade to get one, because I want to let the tech and stuff pan out. Stuff may change. If I got some crazy incentive to buy 1 reasonably or something or my financials miraculously went into super rich for some reason, then maybe I'd consider, but right now, my interest is in reading and gathering information.

 

[Apparition]

I remember going down this rabbit hole on some vehicle in the past and the headline was basically saying how much X vehicle sucked ie broken all the time. At the end of the article, the big issues were like Bluetooth related nonsense. They had no significant data on anything that failed that actually mattered and likely most of those issues might very well be tracked to user error, if I were to take a guess.

Granted if you're spending a crazy amount of money on a vehicle, then that little stuff better be perfect, but my perspective is just that I don't have a use for an EV and those are about the only vehicles I would consider buying brand new at the moment and even then I don't think I'll be ready for a decade to get one, because I want to let the tech and stuff pan out. Stuff may change. If I got some crazy incentive to buy 1 reasonably or something or my financials miraculously went into super rich for some reason, then maybe I'd consider, but right now, my interest is in reading and gathering information.

Yeah, I know people couldn't figure out Ford's SYNC system so they were always going to the dealer so that didn't help but the JD power thing specifically said mechanical so I don't think the electrical gremlins would qualify.

Tesla, from what I've heard/read, is really good at the software side. Less so on the assembly side but they are improving rapidly.

 

[starkey480]

Yeah, I know people couldn't figure out Ford's SYNC system so they were always going to the dealer so that didn't help but the JD power thing specifically said mechanical so I don't think the electrical gremlins would qualify.

Tesla, from what I've heard/read, is really good at the software side. Less so on the assembly side but they are improving rapidly.

Yeah they had some issues with early model 3 from 2017-2020. Luckily the software stuff was fixed with over the air updates. They had some assembly issues with improperly torquing some of the suspension bolts and stuff like that which got fixed in 2020 I believe. Also another reason I bought new. Seems the reliability went up a lot after 2020.

 

[starkey480]

I am also curious how the insane acceleration affects suspension wear. Going 0-60 in 2 seconds is not a small amount of force on the suspension if people are zippin around all day. Luckily my wife drives like a grandma. Me though… not so much

 

[rasband]

I am also curious how the insane acceleration affects suspension wear. Going 0-60 in 2 seconds is not a small amount of force on the suspension if people are zippin around all day. Luckily my wife drives like a grandma. Me though… not so much

I think a lot of that gets taken out on the tires, so prep your wallet for more frequent tire replacements! At least discount now actually will service EVs

 

[Apparition]

I think a lot of that gets taken out on the tires, so prep your wallet for more frequent tire replacements! At least discount now actually will service EVs

With all that weight they don't spin much. Or are you saying taken in the sidewall?

 

[starkey480]

With all that weight they don't spin much. Or are you saying taken in the sidewall?

They definitely don’t spin. But I’d assume it still wears them down.

I think a lot of that gets taken out on the tires, so prep your wallet for more frequent tire replacements! At least discount now actually will service EVs

I really only gave myself the first week for a hall pass to play as much as I want. Now I drive it pretty normal.

 

[rasband]

With all that weight they don't spin much. Or are you saying taken in the sidewall?

With the weight and torque the rubber wears a lot faster, though they are coming out with more tires EV specific.

 

[BugoutJeep]

With the weight and torque the rubber wears a lot faster, though they are coming out with more tires EV specific.

Do you notice much loss of range when doing a few launches? How's it do after launch? Do they keep pulling strong until like X mph?

 

[starkey480]

Do you notice much loss of range when doing a few launches? How's it do after launch? Do they keep pulling strong until like X mph?

Not really…. Battery will drop a 1 percent or 2 after a few floored launches. I’ve only taken it to 100 mph so far. It was scary how quickly I got there

 

[BugoutJeep]

Not really…. Battery will drop a 1 percent or 2 after a few floored launches. I’ve only taken it to 100 mph so far. It was scary how quickly I got there

I think I was looking at some specs and it reminded me of something like a sport bike, but I don't know how they do on the top end. Like a small sport bike will pull 0-100 pretty crazy quick and then it was still fast, but wouldn't hang with the bigger engines 100-200.

It would be fun a few times, but I just don't care about fast acceleration or racing anymore.

 

[starkey480]

I think I was looking at some specs and it reminded me of something like a sport bike, but I don't know how they do on the top end. Like a small sport bike will pull 0-100 pretty crazy quick and then it was still fast, but wouldn't hang with the bigger engines 100-200.

It would be fun a few times, but I just don't care about fast acceleration or racing anymore.

Exactly. The acceleration alone is a fun novelty but not a huge selling point for us. I will say it is very very handy when merging in the freeway or pulling out into traffic. The accel feels just as crazy from 60-80 as it does from 0-60

 

[BugoutJeep]

Exactly. The acceleration alone is a fun novelty but not a huge selling point for us. I will say it is very very handy when merging in the freeway or pulling out into traffic. The accel feels just as crazy from 60-80 as it does from 0-60

Yeah I've watched some videos of them smoking some very quick vehicles. It's cool, but mostly a novelty. I've looked at the trucks and stuff too and they'll have some interesting features too like crab walk and stuff and I think the Hummer, maybe others rise and lower depending on off-road/on-road, likely just trying to keep the drag on the highway down.

 

[Apparition]

Man Says Tesla 'Locked Him Out' of Car Until He Pays for $26K Battery​

https://www.msn.com/en-us/autos/new...pc=U591&cvid=e85cd0bb5ad04229904aca38858008ff

 

[InOmaha]

I’ll just be the devils advocate here.


Depends on the article you read. You can read a million articles arguing either way.
https://www.hotcars.com/why-the-tesla-model-3-is-the-cheapest-vehicle-to-maintain-and-repair/

Also good to remember they have pretty large warranty’s. Our model 3 has a 120,000 mile drive train warranty and 50,000 mile warranty on anything else. Even if that average repair cost was true in that first article, it was about $150 more than an average car. Include gas savings and you’re well ahead. Seems they included glass repair in that figure which most people have under insurance anyways. I’d also be interested to see which years of teslas they included. There were a lot of bugs in older teslas that have since been worked out.

Musk is using his multi billion in state and federal tax credits to offset his crappy business model on EVs.

I can't blame him. We use the same tax breaks on our renewable projects.

We have yet to launch a rocket with our spare change.

We drive Jeeps. Which are typically on the bottom end of the reliability scale. So I'm not going to be the first to toss a stone. However, the Jeep has no internet connection for the manufacturer to cut it off. It uses rocks and codes to do that.

 

[AMS417]

With the weight and torque the rubber wears a lot faster, though they are coming out with more tires EV specific.

EV specific tires basically means low noise. Without the traditional engine there is no ambient noise so all you hear is the tire noise while driving. Several major manufacturers are producing EV tires with noise canceling features, most of them are using a noise absorbing foam lining that makes the tire more difficult to repair if punctured.

Since a Model S weighs as much as a 4x4 F150 and has the torque of a modern diesel truck they wear tires at a rapid rate. Replacing the tires with the correct EV tires is causing some serious sticker shock, check the prices online. Nearly double a traditional tire. Using non OEM tires is causing noise complaints. One more problem to solve.

 

[starkey480]

EV specific tires basically means low noise. Without the traditional engine there is no ambient noise so all you hear is the tire noise while driving. Several major manufacturers are producing EV tires with noise canceling features, most of them are using a noise absorbing foam lining that makes the tire more difficult to repair if punctured.

Since a Model S weighs as much as a 4x4 F150 and has the torque of a modern diesel truck they wear tires at a rapid rate. Replacing the tires with the correct EV tires is causing some serious sticker shock, check the prices online. Nearly double a traditional tire. Using non OEM tires is causing noise complaints. One more problem to solve.

It’s funny to think about. Because there is less noise, I’m hearing more noise!