Need caster angle consultation

Slow Eddie

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Bakersfield, CA
My 97 4 banger has a 3 inch lift, 1 inch motor mount lift, and a 1 inch body mount lift. Stock transfer case and drive shaft. I have adjustable upper and lower control arms on both the front and rear, as well as adjustable track bars. Also front caster cam delete plates.

I finally got around to adjusting my control arms after installing the lift, and I followed the write up from another site that had me pull the springs and center the bump stops with the spring perch at full bump, then set lowers, then adjust pinion angle etc. for the uppers.

First thing I noticed after reinstalling the tires and dropping the vehicle to the floor was that my front wheels looked too far forward, nearly maxing out the adjustability in the control arms, and in the rear the tires seemed also too far forward, with the control arm adjustments basically bottomed out.

I am pretty sure I set the rear pinion angle correctly, parallel to the transfer case output shaft at 3.2 degrees.

But I am pretty sure I screwed up the front pinon. I read that there is a 12 degree difference between pinion and caster for the LP30. I put my angle finder on the doughnut on the back of the differential, cranked the pinion up to 18 degrees, then subtracting 12, gives me 6 degrees of caster which was my target for 33 inch tires. But I have seen some other math on a few sites that say if you are shooting for 6 degrees, then you go 6 degrees on your pinion, then subtract 12 and you get negative 6, which is actually a positive caster of 6. Which this would mean I currently have 6 degrees of negative caster currently the way I adjusted to 18 degrees. Math is hard.

Needless to say, I am going to do it all over again while the correct size sockets are still scattered around the floor of my garage. But I need some assistance with the caster angle math. My plan was to start at 6 degrees of caster and hope for no vibrations and good drivability. Then adjust up or down to get the best caster angle with no vibrations.

By the way, is it obvious when the vibrations are coming from the front and not the rear driveshaft? I have this nightmare of chasing my tail.

I've been working on this thing for 5 years.

Thank you.

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I just went back out to the garage and confirmed negative caster on the drivers side axle C. I am not usually this dumb most of the time. But this is one of those times.
 
Eddie, I am not an expert and will never claim to be. With that said, in my experience. The location of tires are not correct anytime they are lifted and sat back down. Needs to be taken for a short drive to get the wheels to settle in their positions.
 
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Eddie, I am not an expert and will never claim to be. With that said, in my experience. The location of tires are not correct anytime they are lifted and sat back down. Needs to be taken for a short drive to get the wheels to settle in their positions.

More importantly would be that the weight of the vehicle is on the tires (or jack stands) and at ride height.
 
This might help...


-Mac
 
More importantly would be that the weight of the vehicle is on the tires (or jack stands) and at ride height.

Is it possible to get any accurate suspension geometry sitting on jack stands? I do not think so. When you put on new suspension parts you are not supposed to tighten them until the vehicle is fully resting on the ground.

If you drive your jeep around the block and look at the placement of the wheels again you will probably see a difference.
 
Is it possible to get any accurate suspension geometry sitting on jack stands? I do not think so. When you put on new suspension parts you are not supposed to tighten them until the vehicle is fully resting on the ground.

If you drive your jeep around the block and look at the placement of the wheels again you will probably see a difference.

Why not?
 
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So before I started tearing it all down again to try and re-center the axles, I decided to readjust the front upper control arms to get the proper caster amount and take it for a test drive. After the test drive, the front looks better, but I think that has more to do with the caster change and the fact that the springs are no longer bowed. The rear however, still too far forward. But since its drivable I think I am going to move on to the next issue rather than burn another day adjusting the rear. I will come back to it later and consider it a "final touch".

Also I think I did feel some driveline vibration, both front and rear. The front seems to resonate through the steering wheel, the rear resonated through my butt in the seat. But it was not too bad. Seemed to show up at 2500 RPMs for the front and 3000 RPMs for the rear.

Thank you.

This might help...


-Mac

I did set my toe and realign my steering wheel based on that thread and a few others I came across, hence the aluminum bracket used for measurement attached to the wheel hub in the forth picture.
 
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Is it possible to get any accurate suspension geometry sitting on jack stands? I do not think so. When you put on new suspension parts you are not supposed to tighten them until the vehicle is fully resting on the ground.

If you drive your jeep around the block and look at the placement of the wheels again you will probably see a difference.

How would the Jeep know what's holding the axles up off the ground?
 
So before I started tearing it all down again to try and re-center the axles, I decided to readjust the front upper control arms to get the proper caster amount and take it for a test drive. After the test drive, the front looks better, but I think that has more to do with the caster change and the fact that the springs are no longer bowed. The rear however, still too far forward. But since its drivable I think I am going to move on to the next issue rather than burn another day adjusting the rear. I will come back to it later and consider it a "final touch".

Also I think I did feel some driveline vibration, both front and rear. The front seems to resonate through the steering wheel, the rear resonated through my butt in the seat. But it was not too bad. Seemed to show up at 2500 RPMs for the front and 3000 RPMs for the rear.

Thank you.



I did set my toe and realign my steering wheel based on that thread and a few others I came across, hence the aluminum bracket used for measurement attached to the wheel hub in the forth picture.

Try adjusting all your arms to stock length first.

Then get jeep on its full weight.center axles left to right with the track bars

Then disconnect one upper arm and set your pinion angles/caster. Adjust disconnected upper so bolt slides in with no prying.

Adjusting too many things at once will make this unnecessarily complicated. It is an easy process
 
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