New window installation woes

I was reading the first post thinking you were going to court...I’m glad it all worked out in the end. A complete 180 in the elk Construction pics and the new guys job.
 
Well, the new crew (who actually speaks English) made it out here today and got to taking off all the damaged siding and the window trim.

Here's some photos of just one of the pieces of caulking they removed from the last guys:

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That caulking is literally 1" thick all around. You can take it and hang it around your neck, swing it like a lasso, etc. It's that thick! This is what these guys had done around every one of the windows they installed. Talk about half ass!

Here's some shots of just part of the siding they have been removing. The entire house looks like this from front to back, and on the sides!

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They are coming back tomorrow, and my guess is they'll be back Monday as well.

The good thing is that the job these guys are doing looks top notch and I'm very happy with it so far.

So as it turns out, maybe this is a blessing in disguise? I'd say I'm getting around 70% of all the siding on my house replaced, and they are going to paint it to match as well.

It's probably costing the owner well over 10k (more than I paid for the windows), but I'm very happy that I didn't even have to argue with them. He agreed to this without any hesitation at all, and has been very adamant that he will do whatever it takes to make it right.

I heard from these guys doing the new work that he fired the crew that messed this up, and he sent them a bill for over 10k! Looks like those guys are fucked.

Needless to say, I will be leaving a glowing review for Window World once this is all said and done.
Chris, let me start off by saying I'm glad you're getting your windows redone the right way. Looks like the second crew is doing a proper job. With that said, I am a contractor in Ohio. We do a lot of windows and fiber cement siding (Hardie and Nichiha). Just to let you know, the owner probably isn't losing money on this, rather just making less. Most window installers are sub contractors who work for cheap (can do the job for waaaay less than an hourly employee). The average pay per window is $65-75. The cost of an average size vinyl replacement window (under 101 UI) is $110. Thus, with 15 windows, his labor and material was somewhere around $2800 plus misc materials. Most window companies operate off 50% gross margins because of the high call back rates. So, he probably has enough in there to redo your windows and at worst break even (not factoring in opportunity cost and lost time). So, while its great that he is redoing your windows, his gesture is not as grand as you might think. On a side note, he can't technically fire a sub contractor but can choose to not use them again. However, that is exactly what companies/contractors tell customers to make them "feel better" and regain their trust although they dont really get rid of them...please note that this is just some useless insight from an another contractor.

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Chris, let me start off by saying I'm glad you're getting your windows redone the right way. Looks like the second crew is doing a proper job. With that said, I am a contractor in Ohio. We do a lot of windows and fiber cement siding (Hardie and Nichiha). Just to let you know, the owner probably isn't losing money on this, rather just making less. Most window installers are sub contractors who work for cheap (can do the job for waaaay less than an hourly employee). The average pay per window is $65-75. The cost of an average size vinyl replacement window (under 101 UI) is $110. Thus, with 15 windows, his labor and material was somewhere around $2800 plus misc materials. Most window companies operate off 50% gross margins because of the high call back rates. So, he probably has enough in there to redo your windows and at worst break even (not factoring in opportunity cost and lost time). So, while its great that he is redoing your windows, his gesture is not as grand as you might think. On a side note, he can't technically fire a sub contractor but can choose to not use them again. However, that is exactly what companies/contractors tell customers to make them "feel better" and regain their trust although they dont really get rid of them...please note that this is just some useless insight from an another contractor.

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Ahhh, I didn't know this! I figured they would be losing a lot of money. All 15 windows plus the sliding door cost me $8600 total. I figured after paying the first crew to install them, and now these guys to fix it, they would probably be losing money. But now it makes sense. I suppose at worst he's breaking even, which is better than losing money.

This new crew is much, much better. I'm very impressed with their work and their attention to detail.

Here's some photos I took today of the back and one side of my house before they applied the caulking. It also looks like this on the front and the other side of my house. Needless to say that around 70% of the siding on my house is being replaced, which I can't complain about.

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They're going to come back Monday and finish the front. After that, someone is going to come out and paint the new siding to match, and then I'll paint the window trim white, as that is obviously up to me to do.

I'm really happy with the work they have done though!

Well done Chris.
Some home owners would have just pissed everyone off.
You handled it very well.

I'm very calm and collected. I never yell at people when they do something wrong or screw up. I was very angry when the first crew left it the way they did, but when I called the owner I calmly explained it to him, sent him photos, and he was very apologetic and said he would do anything to make it right.

I always like to give people the benefit of the doubt. It's the same reason you don't call up a business and scream at the customer service person for getting your order wrong. It's not that person's fault most of the time, and even if it is, you've got to give them a chance to make it right before tearing them a new one. We all make mistakes after all.

What shocks me most is that the first crew that installed the windows thought that their work was acceptable!
 
Your economy is doing pretty well. The window guy is probably always looking for crews to do the install and your house, a bungalow, flat yard, 15 average size windows would be the place to test a new crew. I doubt he was expecting problems, he was likely hoping for the best and when you called he was pissed but not surprised so he jumped to fix it. You can bet that crew never got paid and windows, a custom manufactured item, are a high margin product so he had some dollars to spend correcting the install..... which he did, likely with his best crew.

The amazing part is he got them to your place so quick. As Taylor says, he won't have any profit left but you will be one of his best spokesmen. And he plans to sue the idiots who made the mess....
but they are likely back in Portland by now.
 
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Regarding what looks like a clean installation, here are the specs for fiber cement lap siding:

1. In the field--no gaps, but light contact between siding pieces at butt joints. No caulk.

2. Side of window amd corner trim--1/8" gap at horizontal joint between sidimg and trim. Caulk gap.

3. Above window--Z-flashing between siding and trim with 1/4" gap. No caulk.

3. Ground clearance--1" from concrete patio or deck and 6" from ground.

There are many more but i think these are the most relevant to your job. If these specs are not followed then likely issues will follow with cracked or rotten crumbling concrete board.

Any queations, just shoot pics and send my way.

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Ahhh, I didn't know this! I figured they would be losing a lot of money. All 15 windows plus the sliding door cost me $8600 total. I figured after paying the first crew to install them, and now these guys to fix it, they would probably be losing money. But now it makes sense. I suppose at worst he's breaking even, which is better than losing money.

This new crew is much, much better. I'm very impressed with their work and their attention to detail.

Here's some photos I took today of the back and one side of my house before they applied the caulking. It also looks like this on the front and the other side of my house. Needless to say that around 70% of the siding on my house is being replaced, which I can't complain about.

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They're going to come back Monday and finish the front. After that, someone is going to come out and paint the new siding to match, and then I'll paint the window trim white, as that is obviously up to me to do.

I'm really happy with the work they have done though!



I'm very calm and collected. I never yell at people when they do something wrong or screw up. I was very angry when the first crew left it the way they did, but when I called the owner I calmly explained it to him, sent him photos, and he was very apologetic and said he would do anything to make it right.

I always like to give people the benefit of the doubt. It's the same reason you don't call up a business and scream at the customer service person for getting your order wrong. It's not that person's fault most of the time, and even if it is, you've got to give them a chance to make it right before tearing them a new one. We all make mistakes after all.

What shocks me most is that the first crew that installed the windows thought that their work was acceptable!
Looks like it turned out nice! Don't worry too much what the contractor makes. Thank goodness he's a man of his word and stepped up to correct it for you. Now you can be proud to show off your new windows!
 
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