NSG370 to AX15 swap

Nice write up.
You guys push me to do things I might otherwise not try!!

I have about 150K on my 05 NSG370. Knock on wood, so far so good, but my second daughter is learning stick as we speak...if she's anything like my first forcing shifts and missing gears 😢 ....lets just say I'm knocking on wood.. .hard and often, that she stays as is.

What is 5th gear ratio like in comparison to the 370s 6th? Not that its on the highway that much, but curious.

Didn't Mercedes use the 370 in their light box trucks as well?

sorry, I somehow missed this post.

AX15 5th is .79 and NSG370 6th is .84. Should result in about 180rpm lower at 75mph.

Here's a chart I put together comparing the two sets of ratios in terms of vehicle vs engine speed. I set it up for 35/4.88 but should be almost identical for 33/4.56.

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It was over a month ago but to top this project off I installed a shift knob from an 80s Toyota.

It's a little lighter gray than my interior but not nearly as light as this photo makes it appear, for some reason.

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Toyota knobs are M12 so I found some threaded inserts to adapt it to the M10 threads for the Jeep knob (which in turn was welded on by yours truly because the shifter was 8" too long and came with 3/8" fine thread).
 
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just a little follow-up.

I'm still happy with the swap. I can tell first gear isn't what it was with the NSG but it hasn't really turned out to be an impairment, either. It does seem to have more of a mechanical whine that I notice mostly in 2nd-3rd gear, but at least it doesn't sound like a pile of gears thrown into a box.

I decided against continuing to store the old NSG370 core and instead of selling it for pennies on marketplace, I got in touch with popular rebuilt seller High Impact, which referred me to their supplier, High Gear Transmission. (i got the impression that, at least with the NSG370, High Impact is just a reseller and doesn't actually do the rebuilds). High Gear was actually willing to pay me a core return and arrange it to be picked up from my driveway! I just had to drain the oil, find a pallet and some straps to secure it. I won't publicly post what they paid but if you have one to get rid of I'll give you the name of who to ask for. I didn't have any expectations so I let him come up with the number himself and it seemed pretty fair.
 
Heres some math for those those wondering how much gearing they'd lose going to the ax15 from a nsg370.
His 4.88 gear ratio x 4.46 nsg370 first= 21.76
4.88 ratio x 3.83 ax15 first = 18.69 new ratio

18.69 ratio÷ 4.46(nsg370 first gear)=4.19 equivalent gear ratio if you keep the nsg370

So before you swap out your nsg370,understand its a decent step higher. Like putting 4.19 gears in place of 4.88

Conversly my 4.10 geared ax15 jeep would get the equivalent of 4.77 axle ratios by putting in an nsg370.
Probably at a loss of strength and reliability though.

Adding 4:1 tcase to his ax15 combo gets a 74.76 crawl ratio.where he had 59.2 before with a nsg370/231.
 
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Will the AX15 mate up to the NP241 as well? Guessing yes, since you mentioned you'd like to get one.

Well...I know the 231 bolts up to both of them so I assumed the 241 would as well. I'm pretty sure I've come across 241 swaps into AX15 TJs around here but I couldn't say whose it was. Probably would be good to make sure before spending the dough on one.
 
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I'm about halfway through. No luck with the bread trick so I had to hitch a ride to the parts store to get the pilot bearing puller and lost a couple hours. It's out now, but silly me didn't think to put the new one in the freezer while I waited so now I'm waiting for that. I could mount the transfer case up to the AX15 but I think I'd rather not have the extra 70 pounds attached while I'm trying to stab the input shaft in. I'm using a transmission jack but one thing I don't like about it is it doesn't give me good control over the pitch of the transmission. Last clutch job I did, i actually rigged up a sling out of ratchet straps, across the frame and under the transmission, and laid underneath it using my hands and knees to position it while I watched the input shaft. I'm not as young as I was then though, so I'm not sure I'm up to that.

View attachment 330316

Another lesson learned, I thought I'd just swap the crank pos sensor over while both transmissions were out, but that ended up a stupid move on my part because while I was yanking the trans and tc assembly loose from the engine and clutch, the CKPS got caught on a heat shield and cracked. Glad the Mopar sensor is available and only about $40.

View attachment 330337


NOTE: The Advance Adapters bellhousing puts the CKPS in the correct location, but it is rotated about 90° from the factory orientation. This points the connector UP instead of REAR. I have a 1" MML and a UCF Extra clearance skid and had to plug in the CKPS before mounting it because there wasn't enough room, and once installed the harness plug is 1/8" or less from the tunnel.

View attachment 333164


This is too close for comfort in my opinion, and thinking about someone with a higher tuck, I don't know what you'd do about this. Take a hammer to the tunnel, I guess, but I don't know how I'd ever get a good whack there without pulling the whole works out again. I remember there being some wiggle room in the motor mounts when I installed my MML, and I centered the fan in the shroud. I might loosen those bolts back up and try to shift it over to the driver side to get some more room here. I know @mrblaine has done at least one of these swaps so I'm curious what his thoughts are on this. I don't know why, but I just assume every TJ he touches has a Savvy skid :ROFLMAO:

I know this is an old thread, sorry!
Just curious if you have had any issues with the crankshaft position sensor being turned 90 degrees like that?
Im looking to do this swap myself, but Im not sure if this will even be an issue without a motor mount lift?
What do you think?
 
I know this is an old thread, sorry!
Just curious if you have had any issues with the crankshaft position sensor being turned 90 degrees like that?
Im looking to do this swap myself, but Im not sure if this will even be an issue without a motor mount lift?
What do you think?

I'm still not a fan of how close it is but I haven't had any problems. Probably won't be an issue without a MML and a tuck. If I ever have occasion to pull the transmission again I'll probably beat on that spot with the BFH to add some clearance.
 
I'm still not a fan of how close it is but I haven't had any problems. Probably won't be an issue without a MML and a tuck. If I ever have occasion to pull the transmission again I'll probably beat on that spot with the BFH to add some clearance.

hey @freedom_in_4low thanks for the response!
I have most everything ready to do this swap, I just haven't sourced a bellhousing.
I find it somewhat odd that Advance Adapters bellhousing orients the CKPS facing forward.
 
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hey @freedom_in_4low thanks for the response!
I have most everything ready to do this swap, I just haven't sourced a bellhousing.
I find it somewhat odd that Advance Adapters bellhousing orients the CKPS facing forward.

It's odd to me too. The only explanation I can think of is that theyre' just buying a casting and machining the sensor provision into it, and since the casting wasn't originally designed to account for that sensor, it doesn't allow for the typical sensor orientation. If you look at my photo, there's a reinforcement rib right about where the screw should have gone, and there's not material there to machine a flat mounting surface into.
 
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starting this thread to document my swap instead of doing it after the fact when my memory is fuzzy.

Background: my NSG370 pops out of reverse. In street use it's tolerable but it's exacerbated when backing against any resistance, such as uphill (like the 8% grade on my driveway) or if a tire has to climb a rock or a log on the trail. This is annoying at best, and at worst could be dangerous or life threatening if on a narrow mountain switchback in Colorado. I had an AX15 in my '99 TJ Sahara, I liked it better, and the cost of swapping is almost the same as a rebuilt NSG370. (this thread is not for the purpose of rehashing the relative merits or issues with either transmission or of changing from one to the other)

Parts Required:
(1) New AX15 transmission. I got mine from Novak (their pn TR-AX15) because it was $50 less to ship here from Utah than from Advance Adapters in California. It comes with the shift tower and a new shift lever that isn't quite the same as OEM. It's straight, seems thicker, and is unpainted. I'll have to bend it to my needs. It also came with a shift knob that looks decent enough but not stock by any stretch, and has Novak's name on it.
https://www.novak-adapt.com/catalog/transmission/transmission-packages/ax15-package/
https://advanceadapters.com/transmission-ax15-4wd-new-unit-750-tip-boxed

(1) Advance Adapters 712590L AX15 bellhousing with 05-06 crankshaft position sensor location. My understanding is the bellhousing comes with both CKPS locations so it's backward compatible. The Advance Adapters bellhousing includes all the stuff that goes inside the bellhousing except for the flywheel, disc and pressure plate. At time of order they gave me an expected ship date of May 17. Based on the backlog they had at the time she seemed optimistic that it wouldn't move out but left open the possibility that it could. Because of course, COVID. 🙄
https://advanceadapters.com/4559

(1) Luk clutch kit 05-065. Not technically "required" but at 127k miles it would be dumb to have the transmission out and not replace the clutch. I'll have an extra pilot bearing and release bearing because I couldn't buy the clutch or the bellhousing without them. I'll freshen up my flywheel with some emery cloth.
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B000CICYZ4/?tag=wranglerorg-20

(1) pilot bearing remover tool. if I forget to get it before I start the job I'll use the bread trick. The bread trick didn't work, so I went to the zone and got the pilot bearing tool.

(1) Weatherpac connector for the reverse light switch. The NSG370 uses a Mercedes connector that will be cut off and replaced. I got this 5-pack from Amazon https://www.amazon.com/dp/B076H987BN/?tag=wranglerorg-20, and this tool to crimp them https://www.amazon.com/dp/B071KFLY43/?tag=wranglerorg-20

The AA bellhousing kit came with most of the hardware (9 bellhousing to transmission bolts, 3 clutch dust cover bolts, 2 slave cylinder mounting bolts, 1 05-06 CKPS mounting bolt) but for some reason did not include the following, which I sourced from the local Ace Hardware.

(4) 7/16-14 x 1" bolts to mount transmission mount bracket to transmission. The NSG370 used M10x1.5 here. Get flange bolts if you can, use washers if you can't.
(1) 3/8-16 x 2" bolt for starter (again, NSG370 had a metric bolt here). I got a regular hex head and a washer, and had to grind a couple of threads off the length of it because it was bottoming out in the bellhousing before tightening up. I don't think 1-3/4" would have given enough thread engagement, but maybe if it was a flange head and you didn't have to use a washer.
(1) M10x1.5x50 countersunk bolt. I'm welding this on top of the shift lever after I cut it off as the one that came with the transmission was comically long.

I used two additional hex cap screws to attach a cover over the 97-04 CKPS hole, and it's not listed in the bellhousing kit parts list but I have no memory of purchasing them. I think they were the same thread pitch as the 05-06 CKPS, which would make them 1/4-20, but you'll want to make sure.

What's the same or close enough:
1. Overall length. When I had the two side by side last year I measured them as within 1/4", so my driveshafts will be fine.
2. t-case interface. NP231J's all had the same bolt pattern and clocking for the run of the TJ. My t-case has a long input gear that originally came from an AX15, so in a way it's going home, and my front case half came from a 2000 Cherokee with an AW4, which was an identical replacement for the front half that I broke a bolt tab off of during an SYE install in 2019.
3. clutch slave cylinder.

To be considered:
1. The inner shift boot of the NSG370 is basically at tub level, which I expect will conflict with the enlarged section where the upper and lower shift lever meet. The AX15 boot sits proud of the tub to be above this point. My NSG370 boot is trashed anyway and I'm not gonna buy a new one for $180, but if I ditch the hard plastic outer section for an older one, then I think it moves the mounting point for the front half of the center console, so then I'd need one of those from a 2001-2004 TJ. I like the 06 console better so I adapted a <99 AX15 shift boot onto the hard plastic floor plate from the NSG370. https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01BGJM830/?tag=wranglerorg-20
2. I understand the NSG370 transmission mount will bolt up but will interfere with a couple of bolt heads on the AX15, so I need to notch it out to clear those. No problem.

Thank you for this thread, I am sad to lose my 6spd but I also don’t want a $18000 lawn ornament. I will start my swap as soon as I get all my poop in a group. Standby!!😊
 
Hey folks, planning on doing this swap myself. Anyone know if this is the type of bellhousing needed? Prices at Novak have gone up, like everything else, and I'd hate to pay close to $500 for a bellhousing. Thanks!
 
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