Painting and Sanding Essentials

[Tiger98]

Ever since I got my jeep I've wanted to paint it desert tan down the line and now I'm getting some really bad chipping and peeling on my hood, so at the very least I'll have to sand that down and paint it. So that got me thinking about just doing the whole thing along with the hood.

I'm really not too picky about the idea of high end quality that a shop would provide and I have a personal preference for flat/matte paint jobs. I think off road vehicles look cool without the gloss finish anyway. I've seen some good looking paint jobs(to my eye anyway lol) for 50 to 100 dollars.

So what is the process and what are the essentials I would need to wear down the old paint, get the stickers off, and paint it? As far as I know from videos I've watched, I would need tape and plastic, 80 grit sandpaper, a torch to heat the stickers for removal, a cloth to wipe it down, and about 6 to 8 cans of rustoleum tan. I just wanted to make sure I'm not missing anything and just find out what the general process and application timing is in case anyone here has done something similar or knows how to.

 

[bmcgc]

Yikes!

Don't touch your Jeep with 80 grit.

Painting is a process. Follow the process and you get good results, don't follow the process and you get terrible results.

For a good budget paint job on a driver, you do all the prep work/disassembly and have Macco spray the paint and you do the reassembly.

For a good DIY, watch a bunch of YouTube videos and then decide how far in the weeds you want to go.

I have done a decent CJ5 paint job in the driveway with a Harbor Freight paint gun and a small compressor. I used enamel with a hardener. When I sold 4 years later, it looked as good as the day I painted it.

 

[GregBelleville]

https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PLpcfFxafn4EL3CI_JZAq6dJUCzY0wDfOe&si=jiAbnoJRFMJdsIKn

here's a playlist from Jeep Solid YouTube channel for his process painting his Jeep.

good choice on desert sand btw .

 

[AndyG]

I’ll second the 80 grit - thats for descaling/scarifying metal and for aggressive wood sanding-

Wash wash wash with Dawn and hot water

Remove decals and the residue with heat or adhesive remover - dont sand it off , it spreads

Then you are ready to start-

For what you want to do there are a lot of options to coat it -

Remember glazing compound is the fast fix for small nicks.

Bondo is for the big stuff, but the less the better.

 

[Tiger98]

Okay, I'll try to avoid 80 grit and go higher. I believe my jeep has been painted twice since the original flame red. Is there a particular grit that would be more suitable for me?

There are just a few spots I want to fix with bondo. A strip that's maybe a few inches on the driver side windshield edge and a little spot about the same size on the bottom of the driver side door near the hinge as well. Both spots have rust.

I've seen some videos where they use a primer and some where they just go straight in with the enamel spray so I wasn't sure if that's a necessity or not as far as the longevity of the paint job.

 

[Rickyd]

You need much more research to do this. Different grits are for different things. It takes a lot of time and patience to paint a vehicle

 

[Tiger98]

You need much more research to do this. Different grits are for different things. It takes a lot of time and patience to paint a vehicle

I'm aware of the different grits, I have a sander that I use for remodeling jobs. It's just that some people I've watched used a combination of 80 first and then sequentially higher up to about 220 eventually to get it ready for their primer or paint. I just haven't ever sanded or painted metal, so I wanted to check.

I'm not looking to do a high end gloss paint job with clear coat etc, just wanting to get rid of the old paint that's chipping, avoid rust, and get a flat tan color on it. I can't do it right away because I don't have a garage to paint it in and it's just too cold for the paint right now anyway. I'm just looking to get as much information as possible about how to approach a cheap, basic diy paint job like I've seen others do with their Jeeps, as I really liked how they turned out.

 

[bmcgc]

How bad is the rust? Pics would help.

If you do not get 100% of the rust, it is coming back.

 

[TheBoogieman]

Are you trying to put Maaco out of business?

https://www.hagerty.com/media/maintenance-and-tech/rattle-can-diy-paint-job/
https://www.wranglerforum.com/threads/my-160-rattle-can-paint-job.358441/

 

[MikekiM]

I get that you aren’t looking for a high gloss show quality finish but what initially described sound REALLY aggressive. Like using a sledgehammer to get a splinter out of a mosquito’s ass.

As mentioned, 80 grit is too aggressive and will leave deep gouges (not scratches). You’re making extra work. Paint isn’t that difficult to scuff /sand. Maybe start with 150 or 180 and dial back to 120 if needed.

Can’t imagine getting coverage with 7 or 8 cans. I would think twice that many to get full coverage but I very well could be wrong. I would take it to shop for paint of that magnitude. YMMV.

A hair dryer is a better option for the graphics removal than a torch.

Skip primer? That sounds like a mistake.

I like the matte finish but there is an extreme difference between a nice matte finish and the “I just primed my Jeep and left it at that” look.

 

[BlueC]

There are just a few spots I want to fix with bondo. A strip that's maybe a few inches on the driver side windshield edge and a little spot about the same size on the bottom of the driver side door near the hinge as well. Both spots have rust.

Body filler is for leveling low spots 1/8th inch or less, not patching panels. If you use mud/body filler in this way, it WILL cause severe rust and degradation within a year or so, and the metal under will be 10x worse. If you apply filler and/or paint over rust without killing it first, that will speed up the corrosion.

From the few things I read here, you really need to take a step back, you're nowhere near ready to do this yet. Watch some restoration work.

 

[freedom_in_4low]

400 grit for the areas you just need to rough up the existing paint.

Not much call for below 150 for anything else. The only 80 grit I use is on flap discs and grinding wheels where I'm removing raw material quickly enough to make sparks. Wherever you start, you'll be working your way back up to about 400 before you spray it so don't go any coarser than you absolutely have to. No need to get down to bare metal, you just need to get flakes out to where the top layer is well adhered and the transition through layers is smooth enough that you can't feel it with your fingers. If you do get down to bare metal you'll need to use an acid etch primer for the new paint to stick, and you'll need a high fill primer to smooth out some of the gauges and flakes to get it smooth enough not to show up in the new paint. By that point you'll have so many spots of different colors that you'll want to prime the whole thing so you don't need 30 cans of topcoat to get them all covered. Use a primer color that is close enough to tan that it won't require a ton of topcoat to cover, but different enough that you can tell how thick you're laying it down.

Find something at least the size of a door to practice your spray technique on and do it until you're good at it both propped up vertical and laying flat. Follow the directions on the can when it comes to ambient temperature, humidity, recoat times, etc. If you're going for matte because you think it's easier to get a consistent finish and not worry about things like orange peel you'd be wrong. I did a full car job with matte rattle cans back in 2004 and it came out looking like complete ass and I hated it. Now that I know what I'm doing I can match a panel to factory gloss paint, still with rattle cans but more knowledge. You still have to make steady long strokes back and forth with the right travel speed and the right overlap to keep a good wet edge or the end result will be splotchy and rough and add a lot more finish sanding. if the paint isn't thick enough and you get into the primer again then it's a whole new worm can to blend it back out for a seamless finish when you don't have a clear coat and buffing and polishing. You'll need to put down at least 3-4 light coats to get full sandable coverage, if you try to get it in less than that you'll be asking for runs and sags.

If you prime the whole thing with a single color you might be able to get away with 12 cans. I'd probably buy 20. The last thing you want is to run out and then have parts of the jeep painted at different times in different ambient conditions. If you are running out, stop between coats and go get some more.

 

[matkal]

I'm doing a color change on a rust free tub, white to red. All I'm doing is deglazing the paint with red ScotchBrite pads. If you're going to use sand paper 400 grit is all you need if the paint in good condition

 

[freedom_in_4low]

Body filler is for leveling low spots 1/8th inch or less, not patching panels. If you use mud/body filler in this way, it WILL cause severe rust and degradation within a year or so, and the metal under will be 10x worse. If you apply filler and/or paint over rust without killing it first, that will speed up the corrosion.

From the few things I read here, you really need to take a step back, you're nowhere near ready to do this yet. Watch some restoration work.

Echo this. Rust needs to be completely removed down to clean metal. If it's all the way through it needs to be patched with new metal (welding). Bondo is for filling valleys that are just deeper than what you can do with filler primer. It's not for sculpting new body.

 

[BlueC]

It's not for sculpting new body.

It's alarming how many people use it that way. I've seen cardboard and aluminum foil used as a backer.

 

[JMT]

400 grit for the areas you just need to rough up the existing paint.

Not much call for below 150 for anything else. The only 80 grit I use is on flap discs and grinding wheels where I'm removing raw material quickly enough to make sparks. Wherever you start, you'll be working your way back up to about 400 before you spray it so don't go any coarser than you absolutely have to. No need to get down to bare metal, you just need to get flakes out to where the top layer is well adhered and the transition through layers is smooth enough that you can't feel it with your fingers. If you do get down to bare metal you'll need to use an acid etch primer for the new paint to stick, and you'll need a high fill primer to smooth out some of the gauges and flakes to get it smooth enough not to show up in the new paint. By that point you'll have so many spots of different colors that you'll want to prime the whole thing so you don't need 30 cans of topcoat to get them all covered. Use a primer color that is close enough to tan that it won't require a ton of topcoat to cover, but different enough that you can tell how thick you're laying it down.

Find something at least the size of a door to practice your spray technique on and do it until you're good at it both propped up vertical and laying flat. Follow the directions on the can when it comes to ambient temperature, humidity, recoat times, etc. If you're going for matte because you think it's easier to get a consistent finish and not worry about things like orange peel you'd be wrong. I did a full car job with matte rattle cans back in 2004 and it came out looking like complete ass and I hated it. Now that I know what I'm doing I can match a panel to factory gloss paint, still with rattle cans but more knowledge. You still have to make steady long strokes back and forth with the right travel speed and the right overlap to keep a good wet edge or the end result will be splotchy and rough and add a lot more finish sanding. if the paint isn't thick enough and you get into the primer again then it's a whole new worm can to blend it back out for a seamless finish when you don't have a clear coat and buffing and polishing. You'll need to put down at least 3-4 light coats to get full sandable coverage, if you try to get it in less than that you'll be asking for runs and sags.

If you prime the whole thing with a single color you might be able to get away with 12 cans. I'd probably buy 20. The last thing you want is to run out and then have parts of the jeep painted at different times in different ambient conditions. If you are running out, stop between coats and go get some more.

This^^^

I’d only add a few things.

1. there’s no way you’re getting out for $50-100 in paint and prep materials.
2. Wash it with Dawn many times to remove all oils that could get embedded in the paint when you sand. If they’re not removed they could contaminate your paint job.
3. Go to an automotive paint supply business and say, “what do I need to do for this kind of paint job.” They will be very helpful.
4. Rattle canning the whole thing would be a pain to me. I much prefer using a paint gun. But I know there’s an entry fee in compressor and gun, so that may not be possible for you.

 

[bmcgc]

New paint will not adhere to a smooth slick surface.

The purpose of sanding is to remove the top layer of paint and open the pores of the paint so the new paint has something to stick to.

Typical new car paint is 1.5-2 mils of paint and 2 mils of clearcoat. Usually no less than 4 mils and no more than 7 mils total.

1 mil is 1/1000 of an inch.

According to Rustoleum, one 12 ounce can will paint 8-12 sf at 2 mil dry film thickness.

Most people way over apply rattlecan paint and end up with 6+ mil dry film thickness.

I helped a friend do a CJ2A that had some rust issues. We cut out the rusted areas and pop riveted 20ga steel patches over the holes with a thin coat of polyurethane between the panels to waterproof the patch. It looked pretty good, better than trying to hide the damage under Bondo.

 

[B1Toad]

I typed up a whole novel on suggestions of how to properly paint a vehicle but removed it as I see you want to go with rattle cans which is totally your choice.

Using rattle cans for your top coat is not something I'd recommend unless you really don't care how it will hold up.

 

[bmcgc]

...And, this is not an afternoon or weekend project.

1/2 day cleaning the old paint. A couple people have recommended Dawn, I bite the bullet and buy wax and grease remover, then use Dawn. The paint has contaminants on it. If you do not remove the contaminants, sanding will push them into the paint and affect adhesion and appearance of the new paint.

1 day to deconstruct.

1-4 days sanding, cleaning and masking. The amount of bare metal you expose, time on bodywork and panel alignment and if you paint inside and out or just out.

1 day to paint.

1 day to cure.

1 day to reconstruct.

Pretty much 36-60 hours of labor + 1 day for the paint to dry.

Add time if you have to build a paint booth and/or work around weather.

 

[B1Toad]

...And, this is not an afternoon or weekend project.

1/2 day cleaning the old paint. A couple people have recommended Dawn, I bite the bullet and buy wax and grease remover, then use Dawn. The paint has contaminants on it. If you do not remove the contaminants, sanding will push them into the paint and affect adhesion and appearance of the new paint.

1 day to deconstruct.

1-4 days sanding, cleaning and masking. The amount of bare metal you expose, time on bodywork and panel alignment and if you paint inside and out or just out.

1 day to paint.

1 day to cure.

1 day to reconstruct.

Pretty much 36-60 hours of labor + 1 day for the paint to dry.

Add time if you have to build a paint booth and/or work around weather.

Exactly, and to go to all that work then use rattle cans for the top coat is absurd IMHO.