Penetrating oil, home made

[StG58]

Penetrating oil, and it's effectiveness, comes up a lot on Jeep forums. You gotta' really feel for the folks in the rust belt and along the coastline.

Here's two old school tips for those really nasty nuts and bolts we all run into occasionally.

Ed's Red. This started out as a do it yourself gun cleaning solution and kind of migrated from there. It works. Does it work better than Kroil? That I don't know, but I do know that it works better than anything else that I could lay my hands on easily.

Here's how you make the stuff.

Ed’s Red bore cleaner and penetrating fluid
1 part Dexron II, IIe or III Automatic Transmission Fluid (ATF), GM Spec. D-20265 or later. (Started out as Sperm whale oil, back in the day)
1 part Kerosene – deodorized, K1
1 part Aliphatic Mineral Spirits, Fed. Spec. TT-T-2981F, CAS #64741-49-9, or may substitute “Stoddard Solvent”, CAS #8052-41-3, or equivalent, (aka “Varsol”)
1 part Acetone, CAS #67-64-1.

[All of the usual precautions for handling caustic and flammable solvent fluids must be taken, such as wearing goggles and rubber gloves.]

Mix outdoors, in good ventilation. Use a clean 1 gallon metal or glass container only!
Add the ATF first. Use the empty ATF container to measure the other components, so that it is thoroughly mixed. Keep it tightly capped and apply generously. This stuff will melt plastic and paint, so beware.

If Ed's Red doesn't cut it after sitting for a few hours, go to the drug store and buy some Wintergreen oil. Apply liberally and let set overnight. Wintergreen oil works through a chemical reaction with iron oxide and WILL free up a rusted fastener. We used it down in the engine room in the Navy and it worked when nothing else would. Drip a little Ed's Red on the fastener after it sits overnight.

As a side note: Ed's Red is a really good gun cleaner and preservative if you add a little Lanolin to it. Probably as good as CLP. It doesn't remove copper fouling though, you need ammonia for that. Ed's Red, ammonia, Ed's Red and into the safe it goes.

 

[Chris]

I hadn't heard of Ed's Red, I'll have to give that a try! I have to admit, ever since @Jerry Bransford got me started on Kroil, I haven't used anything else. The Kroil seems so much more effective than the PB Blaster I was using before.

 

[StG58]

I hadn't heard of Ed's Red, I'll have to give that a try! I have to admit, ever since @Jerry Bransford got me started on Kroil, I haven't used anything else. The Kroil seems so much more effective than the PB Blaster I was using before.

Not surprised, actually. Ed's Red is very old school. Heck, the original recipe was made with sperm whale oil instead of ATF! That hasn't been available for a few weeks, right? It's pretty cheap to make and works like a charm most of the time. Way better than anything else that I've purchased over the counter anyway.

The hot tip is the Wintergreen oil. That stuff will free a fastener better than anything else known to man. It used to be part of a lot of commercial penetrating oil products, but I haven't seen it listed as a content for awhile. The down side is that the body converts one constituant of it into aspirin. So, don't drink it or rub a ton of it into your skin. If you're alergic to aspirin you'll have the same reaction to it if you get enough in your bloodstream.

 

[Chris]

This is some real old fashioned stuff! I'm going to assume it's been around for quite a long time?

Wintergreen oil? Ahhh, I'll bet it smells good then. I had NO idea however that Wintergreen oil would free a fastener. What is it in it that frees fasteners so easily?

As for the aspirin part, that's useful to know. When I work on the Jeep I always use my latex gloves (I get boxes of them from Harbor Freight for cheap), so that would protect my hands from that sort of stuff. I may have to give it a whirl!

 

[StG58]

This is some real old fashioned stuff! I'm going to assume it's been around for quite a long time?

Wintergreen oil? Ahhh, I'll bet it smells good then. I had NO idea however that Wintergreen oil would free a fastener. What is it in it that frees fasteners so easily?

As for the aspirin part, that's useful to know. When I work on the Jeep I always use my latex gloves (I get boxes of them from Harbor Freight for cheap), so that would protect my hands from that sort of stuff. I may have to give it a whirl!

The earliest reference to Ed's Red as a penetrating oil that I've found was in literature from the 1920's. I was using it as a gun cleaning solvent, and got curious. Did a little digging on-line and it was referred to in an article about restoring and using old machine tools, which led me to an article in a machinist's magazine from the '20's that had a whole discussion about this miraculous new penetrating oil / bore solvent invented by C.E. "Ed" Harris at Frankford Arsenal. Thought I'd give it a try and there we are.

From an article on Ed's Red:
This formula is based on proven principles and incorporates two polar
and two nonpolar solvents. It is adapted from the one in Hatcher's
Notebook for "Frankford Arsenal Cleaner No.18," but substituting
equivalent modern materials. I had the help of an organic chemist in
doing this and we knew there would be no "surprises." The original
Hatcher formula called for equal parts of acetone, turpentine, Pratts
Astral Oil and sperm oil, and optionally 200 grams of anhydrous lanolin
added per liter. Some discussion of the ingredients is helpful to
understand the properties of the cleaner and how it works.

Pratts Astral oil was nothing more than acid free, deodorized kerosene.
I recommend "K1" kerosene of the type normally sold for use in indoor
space heaters. Some users have reported successful substitution of
civilian aviation grade kerosene such as Turbo-A. I am reluctant to
"recommend" substitution of aviation grade kerosene, because the effects
upon firearm components of the additives required in aviation fuels are
unknown. Some "jet- fuels" are gasoline/kerosene blends and absolutely
should not be used, because of their increased flammability.

An inexpensive, effective substitute for sperm oil is Dexron (II, IIe or
III) automatic transmission fluid. Prior to about 1950 that most ATF's
were sperm oil based, but during WWII a synthetic was developed for use
in precision instruments. With the great demand for automatic
transmission autos after WWII, sperm oil was no longer practical to
produce ATF in the quantity demanded, so the synthetic material became
the basis for the Dexron fluids we know today. The additives in ATFs
which include organometallic antioxidants and surfactants, make it
highly suitable for inclusion in an all-purpose
cleaner-lubricant-preservative.

Hatcher's original Frankford Arsenal No. 18 formula used gum spirits of
turpentine. Because turpentine is expensive today, and is also an
"aromatic" solvent, which is highly flammable, I chose not to use it.
Safer and cheaper is "aliphatic mineral spirits," a petroleum based
"safety solvent" used for thinning oil based paints and also widely used
as an automotive parts cleaner. It is commonly sold under the names
"odorless mineral spirits," "Stoddard Solvent" or "Varsol".

Acetone is included in "ER" to provide an aggressive, fast-acting
solvent for caked powder residues. Because acetone is an aromatic,
organic solvent, it is recommended that users leave it out if the
cleaner will be used in enclosed spaces lacking forced air ventilation.
The acetone in ER will evaporate, liberating volatile organic compounds
(VOCs) into the atmosphere unless containers are kept tightly closed
when not in use. The cleaner is still effective without the acetone, but
it is not as "fast-acting."

Wintergreen came from U.S. Navy machinery maintenance manuals and a crusty old Master Chief. "Stop beating on that damn thing laddie, and go get some Wintergreen from the Corpsman!" He was probably hung over.

It seems to be the methyl salicylate in Wintergreen that converts the rust, or at least breaks it up into a small grained damp powder.

 

[Chris]

So I wonder what that says about me that I absolutely love Wintergreen mints? Anytime I buy mints (which is actually quite often), I always get the Wintergreen flavors, haha.

 

[StG58]

So I wonder what that says about me that I absolutely love Wintergreen mints? Anytime I buy mints (which is actually quite often), I always get the Wintergreen flavors, haha.

That you don't have to stretch out as much before you work out because your joints aren't all rusted up?

 

[derekmac]

AFT mixed with acetone has always worked great for me. Just make sure you don't get any on a painted surface.

 

[Mike_H]

Interesting...I'm going to go get some of that wintergreen oil tomorrow...Rear shock bolts...Rust belt...impending lift install...yeah....

 

[StG58]

Interesting...I'm going to go get some of that wintergreen oil tomorrow...Rear shock bolts...Rust belt...impending lift install...yeah....

I bet it works great. Hit the fastener with a wire toothbrush to knock the loose stuff out of the way, soak it down, and wait. Be warned that Wintergreen likes to creep, so it's going to get everywhere. Doesn't seem to hurt anything though and your TJ will smell minty fresh when you're done.

 

[05 Blue Unlimited]

This is one of those unexpected gem of a thread. Thanks for posting!

ER eats plastic...how do you recommend applying it, small paint brush?

 

[Mike_H]

This is one of those unexpected gem of a thread. Thanks for posting!

ER eats plastic...how do you recommend applying it, small paint brush?

The Acetone in the ER is what will really damage the plastic. The rest of it is fairly safe.

 

[StG58]

This is one of those unexpected gem of a thread. Thanks for posting!

ER eats plastic...how do you recommend applying it, small paint brush?

Thank you.

A glass eyedropper or a cheap acid brush works great. You can sometimes find chemical proof pipettes at industrial supply houses that work well and are really cheap.

 

[Mike_H]

I bet it works great. Hit the fastener with a wire toothbrush to knock the loose stuff out of the way, soak it down, and wait. Be warned that Wintergreen likes to creep, so it's going to get everywhere. Doesn't seem to hurt anything though and your TJ will smell minty fresh when you're done.

I hope so...I don't know ANYONE who has gotten those out without breaking at least one of them. I hit them with kroil for a few days last time I had the tank out. That was May'ish, so its been there a while now. I hit one of them with a ratchet, just to see, and it didn't feel like it was going to come out.

 

[StG58]

I hope so...I don't know ANYONE who has gotten those out without breaking at least one of them. I hit them with kroil for a few days last time I had the tank out. That was May'ish, so its been there a while now. I hit one of them with a ratchet, just to see, and it didn't feel like it was going to come out.

I got all four of my rear uppers out without a failure...I think one got messed up going back in though. Running a chasing tap through to clean the threads might be a good idea.

 

[ohiopatriot]

Penetrating oil, and it's effectiveness, comes up a lot on Jeep forums. You gotta' really feel for the folks in the rust belt and along the coastline.

Here's two old school tips for those really nasty nuts and bolts we all run into occasionally.

Ed's Red. This started out as a do it yourself gun cleaning solution and kind of migrated from there. It works. Does it work better than Kroil? That I don't know, but I do know that it works better than anything else that I could lay my hands on easily.

Here's how you make the stuff.

Ed’s Red bore cleaner and penetrating fluid
1 part Dexron II, IIe or III Automatic Transmission Fluid (ATF), GM Spec. D-20265 or later. (Started out as Sperm whale oil, back in the day)
1 part Kerosene – deodorized, K1
1 part Aliphatic Mineral Spirits, Fed. Spec. TT-T-2981F, CAS #64741-49-9, or may substitute “Stoddard Solvent”, CAS #8052-41-3, or equivalent, (aka “Varsol”)
1 part Acetone, CAS #67-64-1.

[All of the usual precautions for handling caustic and flammable solvent fluids must be taken, such as wearing goggles and rubber gloves.]

Mix outdoors, in good ventilation. Use a clean 1 gallon metal or glass container only!
Add the ATF first. Use the empty ATF container to measure the other components, so that it is thoroughly mixed. Keep it tightly capped and apply generously. This stuff will melt plastic and paint, so beware.

If Ed's Red doesn't cut it after sitting for a few hours, go to the drug store and buy some Wintergreen oil. Apply liberally and let set overnight. Wintergreen oil works through a chemical reaction with iron oxide and WILL free up a rusted fastener. We used it down in the engine room in the Navy and it worked when nothing else would. Drip a little Ed's Red on the fastener after it sits overnight.

As a side note: Ed's Red is a really good gun cleaner and preservative if you add a little Lanolin to it. Probably as good as CLP. It doesn't remove copper fouling though, you need ammonia for that. Ed's Red, ammonia, Ed's Red and into the safe it goes.

Ed's red is awesome in the gun room, used it for years.

The wintergreen I'll have to try, I have never heard of that and I'm smack dab in the rust belt. Great info.

The torch is my go-to for stubborn fasteners.

 

[Mike_H]

I don't have a "real" torch...haven't been able to justify one yet. Plus, fire around vehicles makes me nervous. Its a thing...I know, but I'm a chicken when it comes to fire. When I pulled my bumper bolts, I had to weld a nut to a broken stud then rubbed a wax crayon where I could see the threads. The hot stud melted the wax, and it wicked into the frozen nut in the frame. Worked like a charm.

 

[ohiopatriot]

then rubbed a wax crayon where I could see the threads. The hot stud melted the wax, and it wicked into the frozen nut in the frame. Worked like a charm.

Ha, an old timer (to me 30 years ago(now I'm the old timer) showed me that trick except with bees wax, still keep a stick in my box today.