Possible Multiswitch Issue

[Red Dog]

Two weeks ago I determined after a full weekend of researching online that the reason my head lights wouldn't turn on was the multiswitch was bad. I picked one up from O'Reillys here in town and installed it. Things worked great other than a) if my fog lights were in the "on" position when I turned the headlights on then the fog lights wouldn't turn on until I put them and the headlights back to the "off" positions, and b) the indicator light for my high beams would always be about half lit. No biggy as I normally don't use my fog lights and haven't been out and around where I would need the headlights other than a few times since then and they worked.

That brings me to tonight. Was getting dark with low visibility even in town due to winter weather so I turned on my headlights, then my fog lights. Everything looked normal on the dash and I confirmed by exiting the Jeep that all the lights were on and functioning. Drove around for about half an hour, then stopped at the gas station. Shut the fog lights off, then the head lights, then the engine. Was in the gas station for about 10 minutes. Started up the Jeep, pulled out the knob for the head lights, the high beam indicator on the dash was fully lit, no head lights at all. Checked the switch and the brights weren't even in the "on" position. Moved them to the "flash" and then the "on" positions but the indicator would not turn off nor would the head lights come back on. Pushed the knob all the way in, pulled it to the middle position and was able to turn on my fog lights. Seeing as it was only about 3 blocks from my house I drove home with the fog lights as my main source of illumination. Confirmed running lights, blinkers, brake lights worked when I got home. Shut everything down, waited five minutes, turned the Jeep back on, and still no head lights and the high beam indicator is fully lit on the dash.

Any ideas?

I'm leaning toward the multiswitch I bought went bad, or somehow my fog lights are causing an issue? Should probably mention the fog lights switch is on the panel above the ash tray/under the radio and was there when I purchased my Jeep from the PO.

I have no problem buying a MOPAR multiswitch, but before I do that I want to make sure there might not be an underlying issue elsewhere that is causing this problem. Any suggestions or assistance is greatly appreciated. I just want to get my TJ back to being functional and road worthy.

 

[Boinked]

I also have a 97. That is the correct location for the fog light switch.

The only other thing I can think of is maybe the turn signal switch is faulty. That has the high beam switch and that could cause issues.

 

[Red Dog]

I also have a 97. That is the correct location for the fog light switch.

The only other thing I can think of is maybe the turn signal switch is faulty. That has the high beam switch and that could cause issues.

Potentially silly question: is it possible the replacement turn signal switch (what I've been calling the multiswitch) was/went bad within two weeks? The only one available the night I purchased mine was by Standard. Are they any good?

 

[Boinked]

Potentially silly question: is it possible the replacement turn signal switch (what I've been calling the multiswitch) was/went bad within two weeks? The only one available the night I purchased mine was by Standard. Are they any good?

Ok i was thinking you replaced the headlight switch.

If you replaced the turn switch and it worked for a while now it is not working. I would return it to orileys and exchange it.

But i would also look into the headlight switch as a possible problem.

I have an orileys turn switch in mine no issues

 

[Red Dog]

I will try returning it in the morning. When trouble shooting possible causes originally I replaced the head light switch the night previous to replacing the turn signal switch. Reason I did was after I installed the headlight switch I turned the Jeep on to test if that fixed the problem, which it did up until I turned the bright/high beams on. At that point the original issue was still present so I went to the next step (to me) and replaced the turn signal/multi-switch. I thought that fixed the issue until earlier tonight.

I have no issue installing a MOPAR turn signal/multi-switch (part # 4794357AA was what it was listed as on their website) as the one I replaced was the original going off the markings on it. I just would like to find out if anyone can think of any other issues I could look at while waiting for the MOPAR one to arrive

 

[Boinked]

I will try returning it in the morning. When trouble shooting possible causes originally I replaced the head light switch the night previous to replacing the turn signal switch. Reason I did was after I installed the headlight switch I turned the Jeep on to test if that fixed the problem, which it did up until I turned the bright/high beams on. At that point the original issue was still present so I went to the next step (to me) and replaced the turn signal/multi-switch. I thought that fixed the issue until earlier tonight.

I have no issue installing a MOPAR turn signal/multi-switch (part # 4794357AA was what it was listed as on their website) as the one I replaced was the original going off the markings on it. I just would like to find out if anyone can think of any other issues I could look at while waiting for the MOPAR one to arrive

So i was playing around with the jeep.... still fighting steering issues. I pulled the turn signal switch and my brights came on. (This is normal just forgot) it might be a good test on yours.

Key off and out.
Light switch off.

Might give it a try to see what happens.

 

[Red Dog]

So i was playing around with the jeep.... still fighting steering issues. I pulled the turn signal switch and my brights came on. (This is normal just forgot) it might be a good test on yours.

Key off and out.
Light switch off.

Might give it a try to see what happens.

So if I'm following correctly, with the lights off, key out, and Jeep not running the brights should come on if I pull back on the turn signal (like to flash the brights when driving)?

 

[Boinked]

So if I'm following correctly, with the lights off, key out, and Jeep not running the brights should come on if I pull back on the turn signal (like to flash the brights when driving)?

Mine does. And i have no issues

 

[Red Dog]

I will try that this afternoon!

Honestly starting to wonder if I have a short someplace. Given that both times I'd had this issue I also had my fog lights turned On, is it possible the fault is with the switch for the fog lights and that is somehow causing a short?

 

[Boinked]

I will try that this afternoon!

Honestly starting to wonder if I have a short someplace. Given that both times I'd had this issue I also had my fog lights turned On, is it possible the fault is with the switch for the fog lights and that is somehow causing a short?

Im not sure. It does sound likey. I would unplug the fog light switch and drive around for a while and see if the lights go wonky.

 

[Red Dog]

So now that its night out walked out to try your suggestion. Pulled back on the turn signal while the jeep and everything was off. Indicator on the instrument panel lit to indicate the brights were on but the lights themselves remained off. Pulled out the headlight switch to all three positions and no change.

What I did notice, probably because the Jeep was off and its quiet out, is a "click" coming from around the center of the dash area/around the ash tray. The click happens every time I pull back or push forward on the turn signal switch regardless of what position the headlight and fog light switches are in.

 

[Boinked]

So now that its night out walked out to try your suggestion. Pulled back on the turn signal while the jeep and everything was off. Indicator on the instrument panel lit to indicate the brights were on but the lights themselves remained off. Pulled out the headlight switch to all three positions and no change.

What I did notice, probably because the Jeep was off and its quiet out, is a "click" coming from around the center of the dash area/around the ash tray. The click happens every time I pull back or push forward on the turn signal switch regardless of what position the headlight and fog light switches are in.

Before tossing any more money at it i would disconnect the fog light switch.

It sounds like that might be causing the problems.

I will dig through the wiring diagram for the lights and see why?

 

[Red Dog]

Before tossing any more money at it i would disconnect the fog light switch.

It sounds like that might be causing the problems.

I will dig through the wiring diagram for the lights and see why?

I agree with you on waiting to spend more money before disconnecting the fog light switch.

If you do dig through the diagram and find something I would be very appreciative. Wiring diagrams are very confusing to me. As in they might as well be written in space alien.

 

[Red Dog]

Before tossing any more money at it i would disconnect the fog light switch.

It sounds like that might be causing the problems.

I will dig through the wiring diagram for the lights and see why?

So after a long Saturday and just as long feeling Sunday morning I was able to get access to a garage Sunday afternoon. Finally broke down and consulted with my brother-in-law who's an actual mechanic and described what was going on, when the issue started, what was going on when things went sideways, had him look at things and give me his opinion. Conclusion was probably a grounding issue, possibly fog light/light relays behind the glove box, then multiswitch.

First thing I did was a cursory check of grounds and headlight plugs. Found this on the driver side:

Replaced that plug with a new one that's supposedly built/designed specifically for H4 bulbs (which I have). New part looks/feels more heavy duty. Once everything was replaced, tested the lights and success!!!

Which lasted about all of 10 minutes

Driver side light is back and brighter than before. However the passenger light is now out completely so far, and the multiswitch has returned to acting goofy (fog lights/headlights only play nice if headlights are On first). At that point it had been a long afternoon/evening so I called it good (only a short drive back to my place so relied on the fog lights again. They seem brighter) and have plans to continue working on things tonight.

Best I can tell, I have a short (probably ground) somewhere between headlights and multiswitch on the steering column. Looks like replacing the plug on the driver side corrected one short but has caused the other to be noticeable. Haven't had a chance to pull the switch and look at it but going off its behavior guessing somewhere inside it is burnt out. Without looking further into things I probably would've just replaced the switch only to have a new one go out later on like the current one did.

I hate having to trace electrical issues. :BangHead:

 

[Red Dog]

Update:

Posting this for those who may someday find themselves in a similar situation as I was in hopes it will help them correct the issue quicker than I did. Those with more experience will possibly find the entire situation as a "no-brainer". Sometimes I have to learn things the hard way for them to "click" with me.

Symptom: Headlights stopped working, high beam indicator always lit. First thought was multiswitch on steering column was bad.

Actual Cause: The bulbs I was using drew too much from the factory lighting harness and melted where they plugged in. This in turn caused the symptoms that are common of a bad multiswitch.

Fix: Installed a wiring harness that draws power for the headlights direct from the battery while keeping them on the circuit for the factory On/Off switches. I used a kit from K Suspension. Came as pre-assembled as possible, heavier duty wiring, and very easy plug-and-play. Best $25 I ever spent on the Jeep.

How I Reached This Conclusion: Process of elimination and a well timed YouTube video actually.

Given the symptoms the first thing I did was replace the light switch, then the multiswitch. This brought the headlights back, but the driver side was dim (possible grounding issue). Checked ground, then checked wiring plug for the light bulb. Plug had signs of melting/being fried so replaced it. This brought the lights back to full strength, but after about 10 minutes of continuous use the passenger side went out completely and the original symptoms returned. Checked the ground, then checked the plug for the headlight. This one was in even worse condition than the driver side one was.

While looking into possible causes/reasons for what was going on I came across the Bleepin' Jeep video on the H4 upgrade wiring kit. Ordered the kit, installed it (near super simple), checked the lights, noticed the potential multiswitch issue had gone away, ran the lights for 10 minutes on low followed by 10 minutes on high beams. Tested again with various combinations of fog light use as well just to be sure. Took an hour plus drive last night out in the country and no issues.

Recommendation: Don't be like me. If you're going to upgrade your headlights to H4's or similar, even when the manufacturer claims they are direct plug-and-play with no further modification needed, install a separate harness kit for the headlights just to be on the safe side.