Here we go @Northwood, it's at least stubbed out. Let me get on my pc at home so all the resources are at the ready!
Reloading for the rest of us
- Thread starter StG58
- Start date
OP
OK, here we go. More adventures with nitrates and lead!
The goal here is to re-manufacture .357 Magnum ammo in a safe and efficient manner with a set of quality reloading tools, all of which will fit into a shoe box for storage and transportation.
A couple of things right off the bat. Reloading is not particularly dangerous, complicated or expensive. It can be though, if you don't follow the rules strictly. A couple of things right off the bat. Don't reload when you are impaired in any way. That should go without saying, but I've known people... Don't reload when you are distracted or subject to interruption. Just stop and reload another day. Trust me on this one. Don't use any random reloading recipe from the internet. Just don't. Always use a manufacturers web site, a reloading manual or another authoritative source for your reloading recipes. If in doubt, send an e-mail off to the powder manufacturer and ask them for a load recipe. I've never had one yet that has ignored my request or given me bad information.
There's a few simple steps to reloading. Don't skip any. In a nutshell, here they are:
The goal here is to re-manufacture .357 Magnum ammo in a safe and efficient manner with a set of quality reloading tools, all of which will fit into a shoe box for storage and transportation.
A couple of things right off the bat. Reloading is not particularly dangerous, complicated or expensive. It can be though, if you don't follow the rules strictly. A couple of things right off the bat. Don't reload when you are impaired in any way. That should go without saying, but I've known people... Don't reload when you are distracted or subject to interruption. Just stop and reload another day. Trust me on this one. Don't use any random reloading recipe from the internet. Just don't. Always use a manufacturers web site, a reloading manual or another authoritative source for your reloading recipes. If in doubt, send an e-mail off to the powder manufacturer and ask them for a load recipe. I've never had one yet that has ignored my request or given me bad information.
There's a few simple steps to reloading. Don't skip any. In a nutshell, here they are:
- Collect and sort your spent shell casings
- Clean and inspect
- Deprime
- Resize
- Prime
- Add powder and bullet
- Inspect
I don't reload pistol any longer but, make sure you have enough crimp to keep the bullets from jumping the crimp and binding the revolver cylinder. Bullet setback can cause over pressure from mag fed/tube fed guns.
*corrected info*
*corrected info*
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OP
Collecting and sorting your brass.
A quick note on cartridge cases. They are a gasket. That's it. Well, they do hold all of the ammunition bits together, but functionally they are just a gasket. All they do is provide a seal to contain the pressure of the burning powder in the breach of the gun. Just like a head gasket in a 4.0 TJ engine.
Just like it says, collect up your brass. It's really not advisable to just pick up random brass and reload it, but it's done all the time. The issue with pick up brass is you don't know it's history or the history of the firearm it was shot in. It's never happened to me, but it could be defective and fail. That's a bad thing. A very bad thing.
When you get your brass collected up and thrown into a plastic freezer bag, haul it home. Spread it out on a work bench or table. Sort by caliber, brass manufacturer and condition. Toss anything that appears to be defective into the recycle bucket. Cracks, major dents, crushed mouths, bent rims or corrosion. Be ruthless at this stage, it pays off in the long run. Toss any steel, aluminum or plastic cases into the trash.
Put each sorted case into a plastic freezer bag for storage, if you want. It's convenient to bag the brass up in units of 50. Toss in a label that has a date, brass manufacturer, the number of times the brass has been used, if you know that, and toss it into a box for storage.
Now let's clean and inspect your brass to start the reloading process. Since we want to keep everything in a shoe box, cleaning is going to be a little different than usual. For home use, the typical cleaning method is to use a vibratory cleaner and cleaning medium. But here I'm going to recommend Iosso brass cleaner. It's a cleaning solution that does a good job of getting all the gunk off the inside and outside of brass. Here: https://iosso.com/products/case-cleaner-case-cleaner-kit/ It won't fit into the shoe box, but close enough. It is portable and does a good job. You can also use a rag, cartridge brush and hot soapy water. Those will fit into the shoe box. The idea is to get all of the contaminates off the brass inside and out so you can inspect for defects and resize the case without damaging the die.
Now that we have clean brass it's time to go over each case looking for defects. Again we are looking for cracks, big dents, bent rims, and pits. If it looks funky, recycle it.
Edited to add: A thought occurred to me that I should mention. Never use any cleaner that contains ammonia, even trace amounts, to clean your brass. The ammonia will chemically react with the zinc in cartridge brass and change the crystalline structure making the brass unsafe to use. A trivial tidbit with major safety repercussions.
A quick note on cartridge cases. They are a gasket. That's it. Well, they do hold all of the ammunition bits together, but functionally they are just a gasket. All they do is provide a seal to contain the pressure of the burning powder in the breach of the gun. Just like a head gasket in a 4.0 TJ engine.
Just like it says, collect up your brass. It's really not advisable to just pick up random brass and reload it, but it's done all the time. The issue with pick up brass is you don't know it's history or the history of the firearm it was shot in. It's never happened to me, but it could be defective and fail. That's a bad thing. A very bad thing.
When you get your brass collected up and thrown into a plastic freezer bag, haul it home. Spread it out on a work bench or table. Sort by caliber, brass manufacturer and condition. Toss anything that appears to be defective into the recycle bucket. Cracks, major dents, crushed mouths, bent rims or corrosion. Be ruthless at this stage, it pays off in the long run. Toss any steel, aluminum or plastic cases into the trash.
Put each sorted case into a plastic freezer bag for storage, if you want. It's convenient to bag the brass up in units of 50. Toss in a label that has a date, brass manufacturer, the number of times the brass has been used, if you know that, and toss it into a box for storage.
Now let's clean and inspect your brass to start the reloading process. Since we want to keep everything in a shoe box, cleaning is going to be a little different than usual. For home use, the typical cleaning method is to use a vibratory cleaner and cleaning medium. But here I'm going to recommend Iosso brass cleaner. It's a cleaning solution that does a good job of getting all the gunk off the inside and outside of brass. Here: https://iosso.com/products/case-cleaner-case-cleaner-kit/ It won't fit into the shoe box, but close enough. It is portable and does a good job. You can also use a rag, cartridge brush and hot soapy water. Those will fit into the shoe box. The idea is to get all of the contaminates off the brass inside and out so you can inspect for defects and resize the case without damaging the die.
Now that we have clean brass it's time to go over each case looking for defects. Again we are looking for cracks, big dents, bent rims, and pits. If it looks funky, recycle it.
Edited to add: A thought occurred to me that I should mention. Never use any cleaner that contains ammonia, even trace amounts, to clean your brass. The ammonia will chemically react with the zinc in cartridge brass and change the crystalline structure making the brass unsafe to use. A trivial tidbit with major safety repercussions.
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OP
De-priming and sizing your brass.
This is the part of reloading that most folks think of when they think reloading. It requires a press of some sort and dies. For our shoe box reloading kit I would recommend the Lee Hand Press. It's compact, light and much sturdier than it looks. Here: http://leeprecision.com/breech-lock-hand-press.html There are one or two other companies that make something similar, but they are expensive and complicated. Lee sells a kit that has a lot of what you need to reload in one box as well. It's worth a look. I prefer Lyman or RCBS dies, but the Lee dies work just fine and will get the job done for a reasonable price. Here: http://leeprecision.com/breech-lock-hand-press-kit.html Reloading dies here: http://leeprecision.com/3-die-set-357-mag-carbide.html Lyman: https://www.lymanproducts.com/brand...ie-sets/lyman-premium-carbide-3-die-sets.html RCBS: http://rcbs.com/Products/Dies-by-Ca...ide-Roll-Crimp-Set-Group-B-Popular-Pisto.aspx
I prefer carbide pistol dies in a portable kit because, theoretically at least, you don't have to use case lube to resize the pistol case. That means you don't have to clean the pistol case after de-priming and sizing. Theoretically. You haven't lived until you've had to remove a stuck case from a reloading die.
Let's de-prime and resize some cases. Adjust the die in the press according to the die manufacturers instructions. Follow those closely. You can screw up a press, a die and / or a lot of cases if you don't. Broken de-capping pins are common enough that it's a nice thing to order a couple of spares as time and money allow.
Assemble the press, shell holder and die into the press and adjust according to the manufacturers directions. Put a clean case into the shell holder and slowly but firmly squeeze the handles together. Cycle the handles open and you should have a sized and de-primed case ready to stuff a primer in!
Look the case over to make sure the rim isn't bent and the case didn't crack or split while resizing. Put the case into a loading block or baggie.
This is the part of reloading that most folks think of when they think reloading. It requires a press of some sort and dies. For our shoe box reloading kit I would recommend the Lee Hand Press. It's compact, light and much sturdier than it looks. Here: http://leeprecision.com/breech-lock-hand-press.html There are one or two other companies that make something similar, but they are expensive and complicated. Lee sells a kit that has a lot of what you need to reload in one box as well. It's worth a look. I prefer Lyman or RCBS dies, but the Lee dies work just fine and will get the job done for a reasonable price. Here: http://leeprecision.com/breech-lock-hand-press-kit.html Reloading dies here: http://leeprecision.com/3-die-set-357-mag-carbide.html Lyman: https://www.lymanproducts.com/brand...ie-sets/lyman-premium-carbide-3-die-sets.html RCBS: http://rcbs.com/Products/Dies-by-Ca...ide-Roll-Crimp-Set-Group-B-Popular-Pisto.aspx
I prefer carbide pistol dies in a portable kit because, theoretically at least, you don't have to use case lube to resize the pistol case. That means you don't have to clean the pistol case after de-priming and sizing. Theoretically. You haven't lived until you've had to remove a stuck case from a reloading die.
Let's de-prime and resize some cases. Adjust the die in the press according to the die manufacturers instructions. Follow those closely. You can screw up a press, a die and / or a lot of cases if you don't. Broken de-capping pins are common enough that it's a nice thing to order a couple of spares as time and money allow.
Assemble the press, shell holder and die into the press and adjust according to the manufacturers directions. Put a clean case into the shell holder and slowly but firmly squeeze the handles together. Cycle the handles open and you should have a sized and de-primed case ready to stuff a primer in!
Look the case over to make sure the rim isn't bent and the case didn't crack or split while resizing. Put the case into a loading block or baggie.
OP
Now it's time to dig out the reloading manual. You have at least one, right?! I'm going to assume that you have read the reloading instructions in the front of the manual at least twice. Seriously, it's important. Don't sit down in front of the TV and browse it; read it for content!
Go to the section that lists loads for the .357 magnum. Read the introductory information at the top of the page. That stuff is important as well. (more on that information later) Get out a pencil and a piece of paper. Browse through the loads and select a load that you think is interesting and that will work for what you are trying to accomplish. Write down the bullet, bullet weight, powder, and primer that the powder manufacturer used in developing the load. Write down the minimum and maximum powder charge weights. Write down the case used. Even better, get a small notebook and write the information down in that. Put a date on it. You can thank me for this later... That list is your shopping list for reloading components.
Head out in your TJ, preferably on a sunny day with the top down, and hit up the local gun shops and sporting goods stores until you locate those exact components as listed in the reloading manual. (I know, I know...you don't need the exact bullet and primer listed in the reloading manual. BUT, I'm trying to keep someone starting out safe and give them the best chance of producing a quality reload.)
As you gain experience in reloading, the critical items are bullet weights and style, primer type and exact powder listed. Don't vary those from the reloading recipe until you get a lot of years and thousands of rounds under your belt. Please don't.
When you have accumulated your reloading treasures, cruise on home and read the cautions on the boxes. Store your powder and your primers separately. Leave the powder in it's original container, and leave the primers in their original sleeve. There's a lot more safety technology in those plastic bottles and paper and plastic sleeves than you can imagine.
Now for some miscellaneous reloading information and thoughts. Might as well put it here as anywhere else.
Bullet weights and powder charges are measured in grains. (grns) There are 7,000 grains in a pound. We will be working to a precision of at least 1/2 grain. That's 1/14,000th of a pound. Contemplate that for a bit. As an aside, I typically work to 1/10th grain and 0.0005" with my cast bullet precision ammunition. The tools I use reflect that level of precision. That's not needed here, but it gives you something to think about.
Never go under a reloading manual's minimum charge weight, and never, ever, go over. Modern powders are safe within the range specified, but can go completely sideways on you outside of their pressure ranges. This is another "seriously, just don't go there" thing. Low charges can be just as dangerous as high charges.
A note on different powders. Powders are informally rated on how fast they generate pressure. Pistol powders are generally considered fast powders. Shotgun powders are usually considered fast as well, but not as fast as pistol powders. Rifle powders are usually slower than both. There are charts out there, all over the place, that reputedly compare the speeds of various powders. Those are for entertainment use only. You can select a likely powder from them to investigate for your use, but don't ever use them to substitute one powder for another in a load recipe. Those charts don't work that way. When selecting a load from a manual, select a slower powder instead of a faster powder. (man, I'm going to get push back on that!) A slower powder will fill the case more for a given charge, making it safer for the reloader starting out. There are also technical benefits to slower powders that come into play when you are trying for gilt edged accuracy.
Not all primers are the same. A small pistol primer from one company will have different ignition characteristics that the same named primer from another company. Just a heads up. It can drastically change the way a reload shoots.
I have found the best accuracy and the best economy in reloading from selecting charge weights at the lower end of the powder weight range. That's not a hard and fast rule, but it's rare that a rip snorting load gives the best accuracy. Always start out with the minimum load and work up, usually in half grain increments until you find your best accuracy for that combination of bullet, primer, case and powder in your firearm. Sometimes a powder or bullet weight just doesn't work out well in your firearm. Shrug and try something different. It happens all the time.
Go to the section that lists loads for the .357 magnum. Read the introductory information at the top of the page. That stuff is important as well. (more on that information later) Get out a pencil and a piece of paper. Browse through the loads and select a load that you think is interesting and that will work for what you are trying to accomplish. Write down the bullet, bullet weight, powder, and primer that the powder manufacturer used in developing the load. Write down the minimum and maximum powder charge weights. Write down the case used. Even better, get a small notebook and write the information down in that. Put a date on it. You can thank me for this later... That list is your shopping list for reloading components.
Head out in your TJ, preferably on a sunny day with the top down, and hit up the local gun shops and sporting goods stores until you locate those exact components as listed in the reloading manual. (I know, I know...you don't need the exact bullet and primer listed in the reloading manual. BUT, I'm trying to keep someone starting out safe and give them the best chance of producing a quality reload.)
As you gain experience in reloading, the critical items are bullet weights and style, primer type and exact powder listed. Don't vary those from the reloading recipe until you get a lot of years and thousands of rounds under your belt. Please don't.
When you have accumulated your reloading treasures, cruise on home and read the cautions on the boxes. Store your powder and your primers separately. Leave the powder in it's original container, and leave the primers in their original sleeve. There's a lot more safety technology in those plastic bottles and paper and plastic sleeves than you can imagine.
Now for some miscellaneous reloading information and thoughts. Might as well put it here as anywhere else.
Bullet weights and powder charges are measured in grains. (grns) There are 7,000 grains in a pound. We will be working to a precision of at least 1/2 grain. That's 1/14,000th of a pound. Contemplate that for a bit. As an aside, I typically work to 1/10th grain and 0.0005" with my cast bullet precision ammunition. The tools I use reflect that level of precision. That's not needed here, but it gives you something to think about.
Never go under a reloading manual's minimum charge weight, and never, ever, go over. Modern powders are safe within the range specified, but can go completely sideways on you outside of their pressure ranges. This is another "seriously, just don't go there" thing. Low charges can be just as dangerous as high charges.
A note on different powders. Powders are informally rated on how fast they generate pressure. Pistol powders are generally considered fast powders. Shotgun powders are usually considered fast as well, but not as fast as pistol powders. Rifle powders are usually slower than both. There are charts out there, all over the place, that reputedly compare the speeds of various powders. Those are for entertainment use only. You can select a likely powder from them to investigate for your use, but don't ever use them to substitute one powder for another in a load recipe. Those charts don't work that way. When selecting a load from a manual, select a slower powder instead of a faster powder. (man, I'm going to get push back on that!) A slower powder will fill the case more for a given charge, making it safer for the reloader starting out. There are also technical benefits to slower powders that come into play when you are trying for gilt edged accuracy.
Not all primers are the same. A small pistol primer from one company will have different ignition characteristics that the same named primer from another company. Just a heads up. It can drastically change the way a reload shoots.
I have found the best accuracy and the best economy in reloading from selecting charge weights at the lower end of the powder weight range. That's not a hard and fast rule, but it's rare that a rip snorting load gives the best accuracy. Always start out with the minimum load and work up, usually in half grain increments until you find your best accuracy for that combination of bullet, primer, case and powder in your firearm. Sometimes a powder or bullet weight just doesn't work out well in your firearm. Shrug and try something different. It happens all the time.
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egclassic
TJ Enthusiast
I would suggest de-priming the brass before cleaning if you are going to use liquid cleaner, it will help clean the primer pockets also.
This really isn't as big a concern with pistols as it is when reloading rifle cartridges.
Also, make sure the brass is completely dry before charging them with powder. (brought to you by Capt'n obvious!)
Edit: I always clean and de-prime all my brass before storing. That way, if your are going to use a single stage press like the one mentioned, you don't have to keep changing the dies out every load.
This really isn't as big a concern with pistols as it is when reloading rifle cartridges.
Also, make sure the brass is completely dry before charging them with powder. (brought to you by Capt'n obvious!)
Edit: I always clean and de-prime all my brass before storing. That way, if your are going to use a single stage press like the one mentioned, you don't have to keep changing the dies out every load.
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OP
That is the preferred way to do that, but it involves one more die, a generic de-priming die. That's what I do. I also run a primer pocket cleaning tool into the primer pocket to get all the hardened scunge out. Well, it's actually the the uniformer, with the cutting edges on it. It's the only thing I've found that gets all the corruption out of the primer pocket.
egclassic
TJ Enthusiast
Actually, I was assuming you were using the three die sets. Brass prepping is the most tedious part of reloading. I realize you are keeping it on the smaller scale here, but after years of using the hand primer pocket tool, I finally bought one of those prep stations that holds 5 tips and they all turn at the same time.
OP
Isn't it though? Going through and prepping new brass for the first time is a time consuming thing. Needs to be done though if you want that last little bit of accuracy. Surprising how little is required for generic blasting ammo. For my 45 ACP blasting ammo, I don't even polish it any more. Just inspect it, wipe it off and load it. Mixed cases and all...
Wow, awesome info so far.
So, @StG58 or anyone with experience, do any of you actually use and enjoy a portable press? The more I think about it the whole portable thing seems to look more like a pain in the ass than any sort of advantage. I dont see myself doing any of this without a solid working space, which would mean a work bench of some sort, so maybe a bench mount makes a lot more sense?
So, @StG58 or anyone with experience, do any of you actually use and enjoy a portable press? The more I think about it the whole portable thing seems to look more like a pain in the ass than any sort of advantage. I dont see myself doing any of this without a solid working space, which would mean a work bench of some sort, so maybe a bench mount makes a lot more sense?
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egclassic
TJ Enthusiast
Mine are all securely mounted to a bench.
The portable ones would be good to take to a range if you wanted to work up a load one by one to find out what works best in your gun. Then you could go home and crank out a shit ton on your turret or progressive press.
But I think StG58 was trying to keep it simple and space saving for those who may not have room for a bench.
He was indeed, per my request. Just second guessing myself now that i look into it more and more. That is a very good point i hadnt thought about that benefit to it
OP
Yup, for the very reason that @egclassic stated. Load development at the range. I have done some loading in the field, just for giggles and to prove it could be done. Once or twice I've done the whole cycle...shoot, dig the bullets out of the berm, cast, reload, shoot. A muzzle stuffer is vastly better if you want to do that though.
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OP
Now that doesn't sound half bad! I saw something of the sort by Lee but it didn't have much work space. Essentially just a portable mount for your press
OP
I suppose that and a good chunk of wood would make something that could work out pretty well
OP
Something along these lines...
http://www.outdoorlife.com/blogs/gun-shots/diy-how-build-compact-reloading-bench
http://www.outdoorlife.com/blogs/gun-shots/diy-how-build-compact-reloading-bench