Suspension upgrade questions

Most likely the bushings in the control arms, but it could also be the sway bar end links creaking as well.
 
I've been doing a bit more research on various options including what you guys have talked about. This is from CodaMan's Jeep. I think I'm trying to go a similar direction. Does anyone have any feedback on something like this or suggest doing any parts of this different or adding anything additional? Would I have any issue running sway bar disconnects with something like this setup? I admit I'm not terribly informed on what kind of setup you have to have or what you have to account for if you disconnect the front sway bar.

  1. Pro Comp 2" Springs (Front) — EXP55297
  2. Pro Comp 2" Springs (Rear) — EXP55298
  3. Rancho RS5000X Shocks (2 Front) — RS55239
  4. Rancho RS5000X Shocks (2 Rear) — RS55241
  5. OME Rear Track Bar Reloaction Bracket — ARB FKWTJ02
  6. Daystar.75" Spacers — KJ09108BK (note: only used above front springs for leveling)
  7. Rock Krawler Bump Stop Extensions (Front and Rear) --RKSRK05611 (note: Comes with 6 1" extensions. Glue or bolt 1 to each spring bucket at the bottom of the front springs; I used this RTV Adhesive and it worked great. Then bolt 1 above each bump stop cup on rear springs)

This is a pretty solid list. My lift is almost identical except I went with the OME springs. Either would be a great choice.

If I were to add anything, I would consider a Crown OE control arm set with bushings ($250-ish), an adjustable front track bar (Metalcloak or JKS $190-$225) and the ZJ steering upgrade ($100).

All that, including the list you have, would put you at $1100- $1200 depending on what kind of deals you got.

You would have a great, reliable lift which would work perfect with 32" tires, and you would have no problems at all with the type of off roading that you mentioned.

You could also add front sway bar disconnects to any of this no problem.
 
Really cool to hear from someone running something similar. Thanks for your feedback. I'm really excited to get this thing dialed in. I might need to do it in spurts but I'm visualizing the plan and getting parts of it done which will be awesome.

I might look into the control arm set you mentioned.

With this type of lift should the sway bar links be longer or does it not really matter?
 
The sway bars work best when they are parallel. A few degrees up or down is ok. The biggest issue you will face is the front sway bar end links are weak at the upper ball/socket joint. A few hard flexes on the trail may eventually liberate the ball from the socket and make the links useless, so plan for an upgrade there as well in your build. I have JKS disconnects on my front bar and adjustable, extended ones on the rear.

A little forklift flexing shows some of the advantages to disco'ing the front bar. The first pick is with the sway bar connected,
83240

Notice the angle that the body is leaning towards.
The opposite rear tire is stuffed into the fender well,
83241

As far as I can go without lifting the right rear tire off the ground,
83242

Now, with the sway bar disco'd,
83243

Notice how the body isn't leaning as badly as the prior pic?

Also notice how the left rear tire isn't nearly as stuffed into the wheel well,
83245

Roughly, 5 more inches of articulation was achieved disco'd.
83246


This is on 33" tires and a 3" lift. Stick with a smaller tire like 31's and you can get even more impressive numbers. Granted most of us don't need this kind of articulation for normal off roading, but it sure is nice to know you can if the need arose. I run a lot of forest service trails and the winters can tear them up, leaving huge washouts, so it's nice to have the flex when needed.
 
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Awesome. Yeah I've looked at the JKS front disconnects. I'll keep those on the mind for the front. Can you let me know more about what you have setup in the rear?
 
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The sway bars work best when they are parallel. A few degrees up or down is ok. The biggest issue you will face is the front sway bar end links are weak at the upper ball/socket joint. A few hard flexes on the trail may eventually liberate the ball from the socket and make the links useless, so plan for an upgrade there as well in your build. I have JKS disconnects on my front bar and adjustable, extended ones on the rear.

A little forklift flexing shows some of the advantages to disco'ing the front bar. The first pick is with the sway bar connected,
View attachment 83240
Notice the angle that the body is leaning towards.
The opposite rear tire is stuffed into the fender well,
View attachment 83241
As far as I can go without lifting the right rear tire off the ground,
View attachment 83242
Now, with the sway bar disco'd,
View attachment 83243
Notice how the body isn't leaning as badly as the prior pic?

Also notice how the left rear tire isn't nearly as stuffed into the wheel well,
View attachment 83245
Roughly, 5 more inches of articulation was achieved disco'd.
View attachment 83246

This is on 33" tires and a 3" lift. Stick with a smaller tire like 31's and you can get even more impressive numbers. Granted most of us don't need this kind of articulation for normal off roading, but it sure is nice to know you can if the need arose. I run a lot of forest service trails and the winters can tear them up, leaving huge washouts, so it's nice to have the flex when needed.

man that is the best illustration I've ever seen for how the sway bar affects articulation, levelness & how it even impacts the rear. Excellent!
 
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man that is the best illustration I've ever seen for how the sway bar affects articulation, levelness & how it even impacts the rear. Excellent!

It really was an eye opener for me as well. The Antirock sway bar can get even better results with more stability. One day I may get one.
 
Awesome. Yeah I've looked at the JKS front disconnects. I'll keep those on the mind for the front. Can you let me know more about what you have setup in the rear?

For the rear sway bar, you'll be fine with the factory end links on anything 2" or less of suspension lift.
The rear sway bar is quite a bit smaller and does not limit travel nearly as much as the big ass front one does.

If you plan on more lift down the road, these work well. I have them on mine.

https://jksmfg.com/i-8938523-wrangler-tj-1997-2006-adjustable-end-link.html
 
Also, check out Rubicon Express's front discos. They pretty are a carbon copy of the JKS quick discos for a bit less coin.
 
It really was an eye opener for me as well. The Antirock sway bar can get even better results with more stability. One day I may get one.

it would be interesting to see that forklift test with the antirock added as a third test group to the two you've got. I made the switch quite a while ago & while I cannot say how the numbers would come out I can say I've experienced better control. After reading some of @jjvw 's comments about the different settings I began experimenting over the winter by moving from the softest setting #5 to the mid-point #3 which turned out to be an excellent idea, it's almost unbelievable how level the jeep stays going through the wonkiest of trails. This was Saturday, maybe not the best illustration of it given the position of the driver's rear but it was really nice all day on that setting.

83260
 
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it would be interesting to see that forklift test with the antirock added as a third test group to the two you've got. I made the switch quite a while ago & while I cannot say how the numbers would come out I can say I've experienced better control. After reading some of @jjvw 's comments about the different settings I began experimenting over the winter by moving from the softest setting #5 to the mid-point #3 which turned out to be an excellent idea, it's almost unbelievable how level the jeep stays going through the wonkiest of trails. This was Saturday, maybe not the best illustration of it given the position of the driver's rear but it was really nice all day on that setting.

View attachment 83260

Imagine how close your mirror would have been to that stump had you not had that kind of control and stability.

@jjvw had a post in another thread we were conversing on where he had a pic of his rig earlier on in his build showing a fork lift flex and his front clearing a 28" tall trash can. Similarish setup on 33's at the time.
 
Imagine how close your mirror would have been to that stump had you not had that kind of control and stability.

@jjvw had a post in another thread we were conversing on where he had a pic of his rig earlier on in his build showing a fork lift flex and his front clearing a 28" tall trash can. Similarish setup on 33's at the time.

Mine can clear an even taller trash can now. The sway bars are not a limitation. :)
 
So I have determined that I’ll need new control arms. I got under there and rocked the Jeep up and down and they definitely were making the creaking sound.

I have also kind of noticed something when driving so I thought I’d check with you guys As I’m not sure if it is steering or suspension related. Primarily when I’m turning even slightly (bend in the road is enough), if I hit a bump the front is fine but when the rear goes over it I almost get a sensation that the rear is stepping out a bit. Not in the sense of losing traction or wheel spin but rather that it almost feels like the rear is trying to go another direction than where the front of the rig is going. It’s not enough to cause me to swerve or counter steer or anything but it just feels odd for a second before it straightens right up. Anyone had that? Is there anything remotely normal about it? Anything to check for? Thanks
 
So I have determined that I’ll need new control arms. I got under there and rocked the Jeep up and down and they definitely were making the creaking sound.

I have also kind of noticed something when driving so I thought I’d check with you guys As I’m not sure if it is steering or suspension related. Primarily when I’m turning even slightly (bend in the road is enough), if I hit a bump the front is fine but when the rear goes over it I almost get a sensation that the rear is stepping out a bit. Not in the sense of losing traction or wheel spin but rather that it almost feels like the rear is trying to go another direction than where the front of the rig is going. It’s not enough to cause me to swerve or counter steer or anything but it just feels odd for a second before it straightens right up. Anyone had that? Is there anything remotely normal about it? Anything to check for? Thanks

You talking about the butt "wiggling" or shaking side to side? If so, yes I have it and I've read that it's normal to an extent but that it can be made worse by a variety of things.

I'll let others with more experience chime in regarding the specifics. I do think worn bushings in the control arms can be a contributing factor but not necessarily the only one.
 
You talking about the butt "wiggling" or shaking side to side? If so, yes I have it and I've read that it's normal to an extent but that it can be made worse by a variety of things.

I'll let others with more experience chime in regarding the specifics. I do think worn bushings in the control arms can be a contributing factor but not necessarily the only one.

Yeah you might be describing that better. It does kind of feel like a shimmy or wiggle off to the side. Yeah the rear control arms are worn too so I’ll plan to replace them as well.
 
I did end up finding another thread on it and they too talked about control arms. All of mine have cracked and worn bushings so I know I need those. I definitely get a creak in at least one of the fronts and I do hear creaking when the rear tires back off the curb at the end of y drive way as well. So Yeah they are probably just not holding as strong as they should on those turns with bumps. I was going to work on the front first but i’ll Probably try and get them all done. If there is anything else that contributes to that, let me know.
 
Well I'm getting started! I ordered some truck lite knockoffs I read about in the forums that others are using so those will be here Monday and I just ordered 8 replacement Moog control arms and front and rear upper bushings. Shipped will be $232 from rock auto. Thought that was a pretty good deal as it was going to be at least $310 for those on amazon. This weekend I'm planning to do some steering tests on the jeep and check the ball joints as well so I can make decisions on what to replace there.

Next week I'll be changing fluids on everything I haven't finished yet including front diff and replacing the pinion seal. I'l be replacing the oil pan gasket as well as I've got a light leak there. Also planning to do a brake job as well! Jeep will be like new soon :) I appreciate your support on all this guys. My favorite part is how much of this I'm doing myself with the help of my neighbor and father in law. A bunch of that is thanks to your guidance and all the information out here.
 
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Well I'm getting started! I ordered some truck lite knockoffs I read about in the forums that others are using so those will be here Monday and I just ordered 8 replacement Moog control arms and front and rear upper bushings. Shipped will be $232 from rock auto. Thought that was a pretty good deal as it was going to be at least $310 for those on amazon. This weekend I'm planning to do some steering tests on the jeep and check the ball joints as well so I can make decisions on what to replace there.

Next week I'll be changing fluids on everything I haven't finished yet including front diff and replacing the pinion seal. I'l be replacing the oil pan gasket as well as I've got a light leak there. Also planning to do a brake job as well! Jeep will be like new soon :) I appreciate your support on all this guys. My favorite part is how much of this I'm doing myself with the help of my neighbor and father in law. A bunch of that is thanks to your guidance and all the information out here.

Just Empty Every Pocket...Sounds like a pretty solid start!
 
Well on my way to that result but in the end it'll be a heck of a lot cheaper than paying someone else to do it which bodes well when you explain the costs to the wife :)