Test Drove A 2021 Wrangler Today

[InOmaha]

If it was $37k, knock off $10k and you're in new TJ/LJ MSRP territory with a piss poor 4.0L (horsepower, emissions, other lacking etc) smaller frame, smaller axle housings and guts, cheaper feeling plain interior, less interior room, poor resale value(new Jeep Wranglers are #1 in resale value), smaller brakes, rear drum brakes, smaller wheels, smaller tires, smaller gas tank, less mpg’s, smaller console, no hood insulation, no outside temp guage,no steering wheel radio controls, tire pressure monitors, backup camera, inboard shocks vs outboard shocks, non highline, steel doors, and a steel hood.

Everytime I see someone bitch and moan about the price, I ask; what should the price be and how did you justify that asking price?

But I have a minivan for that stuff.

They could trade the bells and whistles for a better offroad package from the factory. Focus on drivetrain components.

We're looking to replace the minuvan with a Toyota, Hyundai, or Kia Hybrid or PHEV SUV. It's a better value long term as they get 35+ mpg versus the 17-25 of the Jeep. Those three are definately ahead of the Jeep SUVs.

Given what I've put into mine, I wouldn't start with anything that didn't have Rubicon on it. That way I'm not messing with axles when I could be adding lightbars.

I get the impression with a Jeep, the higher the cost, the less likely it is to go offroad. Which defeats the purpose for most here.

 

[Claytone]

I get the impression with a Jeep, the higher the cost, the less likely it is to go offroad. Which defeats the purpose for most here.

But they make for some good used units a few years down the road. My neighbor has a JL Rubi and I've never seen it dirty ever. I doubt it's been on more than a dirt road. I see that a lot here, maybe since the Rubi has some interior upgrades that are part of the package and people like bling and stickers.

 

[InOmaha]

But they still hold their value. So 10-15 years later you see basic 4 door Jeeps with 150,000 miles going for $20-25,000.

I've been reading up on the issues with soy based wiring deterioration and rodents. Honda now makes rodent tape to wrap your wiring if you have issues. One of my kids had mice move into the cabin filter. So I've wondered if a new vehicle with more new type wiring would cause more long term electrical issues.

Even our old tech has computer and wiring issues with much less technology.

 

[freedom_in_4low]

But they make for some good used units a few years down the road. My neighbor has a JL Rubi and I've never seen it dirty ever. I doubt it's been on more than a dirt road. I see that a lot here, maybe since the Rubi has some interior upgrades that are part of the package and people like bling and stickers.

a buddy of mine is about to buy a low mileage, late model JKU and he's looking at paying in the low-mid 30s for a Sport with a soft top (from Carmax). His plan is to use it when he wants, and make money with it on Turo. That's more than I've paid for any car I've ever owned, and it's not far from being more than any two cars I've ever owned (not counting Jeep mods, of course).

 

[Apparition]

But they still hold their value. So 10-15 years later you see basic 4 door Jeeps with 150,000 miles going for $20-25,000.

Will EV"s take over and make them worthless or worth more though?

 

[InOmaha]

I would consider this low mileage "Gladiator" but it is a little on the high side too.

 

[Artsifrtsi]

Imagine the TJ or LJ you could build with that kind of money...just sayin.

Not too relevant anymore. To get a decent base vehicle to start a build with you are at about half that money... Then take away about 10% of what's left to account for inflation... You'd have about $10k to build with realistically...

 

[RINC]

Not too relevant anymore. To get a decent base vehicle to start a build with you are at about half that money... Then take away about 10% of what's left to account for inflation... You'd have about $10k to build with realistically...

I have long since past $10k on my build.

 

[Artsifrtsi]

A lot of that is true and while the 3.6 is better on the highway I'll take the 4.0 on the trail every day of the week. I've rented JLs in Hawaii and SW Colorado and was appalled by how much more attention I had to put into keeping the revs up to climb hills that the 4.0 would almost idle up.

Difference in where the torque comes in on a I-6 vs V-6

 

[freedom_in_4low]

Difference in where the torque comes in on a I-6 vs V-6

I've heard that a lot and generally accepted it but I wish I better understood the physics behind it. Like, if you built a V6 and an I6 with the exact same pistons, rods, and stroke, same rod length, compression ratio, combustion chamber design, valves, cam profile, ports, and manifolds...would they perform any differently just by virtue of how the cylinders are arranged? Or is it something about the shape that dictates design decisions differ between the two?

 

[Artsifrtsi]

I've heard that a lot and generally accepted it but I wish I better understood the physics behind it. Like, if you built a V6 and an I6 with the exact same pistons, rods, and stroke, same rod length, compression ratio, combustion chamber design, valves, cam profile, ports, and manifolds...would they perform any differently just by virtue of how the cylinders are arranged? Or is it something about the shape that dictates design decisions differ between the two?

It’s all to do with the ability to transfer more grunt to the crank because each piston has it‘s own journal. A V engine shares journals with the opposing piston, so is able to make more horsepower.

 

[InOmaha]

I've heard that a lot and generally accepted it but I wish I better understood the physics behind it. Like, if you built a V6 and an I6 with the exact same pistons, rods, and stroke, same rod length, compression ratio, combustion chamber design, valves, cam profile, ports, and manifolds...would they perform any differently just by virtue of how the cylinders are arranged? Or is it something about the shape that dictates design decisions differ between the two?

You don't get the same stroke. That's why one is 3.6L and one is 4.0L. The lever arm is longer on the 4.0.

Other things to consider are transmission, transfer case, and axle gearing.

The 5 speed, 6 speed, and automatic transmissions all have different low gear ratios.

 

[RINC]

Low end torque is what twists the cap off your beer bottle.

 

[Artsifrtsi]

You don't get the same stroke. That's why one is 3.6L and one is 4.0L. The lever arm is longer on the 4.0.

Other things to consider are transmission, transfer case, and axle gearing.

The 5 speed, 6 speed, and automatic transmissions all have different low gear ratios.

Yes, but all things being equal, the question is why does an I motor make more low end torque than a V motor.

 

[freedom_in_4low]

You don't get the same stroke. That's why one is 3.6L and one is 4.0L. The lever arm is longer on the 4.0.

Other things to consider are transmission, transfer case, and axle gearing.

The 5 speed, 6 speed, and automatic transmissions all have different low gear ratios.

I get all that, I'm addressing the perception that inline motors are more torquey.

 

[RINC]

I get all that, I'm addressing the perception that inline motors are more torquey.

I asked my dad, he didn't know either. I grew up thinking inline motors had more low end torque. My world view is now messed up.

 

[InOmaha]

For the engines it just is. The people designing them did what they did based on costs and management decisions. Engines are cross platform designed to maximize profits. Like the GM 3.1L and 3.8L used everywhere. So Jeeps got a minivan engine already in production.

The I6 4L was a basic truck engine used everywhere. Ford and Chevy had a version. Low end torque, low first gear to get you moving.

 

[Apparition]

I asked my dad, he didn't know either. I grew up thinking inline motors had more low end torque. My world view is now messed up.

I happen to have a V8 with 1050 lb ft of torque.

 

[Artsifrtsi]

I get all that, I'm addressing the perception that inline motors are more torquey.

Ok, I read more into the engineering side of it. If all things were equal, to include the stroke, they'd be nearly identical. Because the I motor has all the pistons connected independently, not sharing journals, you can get away with more stroke than the V that shares journals. The actual cylinders can also have a higher deck height also allowing more stroke.