I digress. I don’t want to steer you the wrong way. I have not read that, but I don’t know.
Two tummy tuck questions relating to transmission and driveshaft
- Thread starter Thunder Mass
- Start date
OP
By the time the drive shaft disconnect and fall out few other things on the LJ has been compromised. Maybe some stories around but will likely have few pages missing.
Mine is an LJ with all the LJR stuff on it when I bought it. I do think it was stolen and the person who get it from the insurance just put Rubicon parts. But now is just an LJ, I sold the 241 TC and the front Dana 44 axle, install a Dana 30 and a 231 TC until the Atlas and Rubicrawler are installed with the 1 tons.
On the first edition of Trails magazine was feature "Elmo the LJ", try to get copy of that edition and read about it, very nice LJ built article. Elmo the LJ seem to match the use you looking to do to your LJ.
I do run KO2's 33 x 10.5 without issues for long time, in and/or offroad. 35 x 12.5 is other subject. That why i suggest to deal with the tire size demon first.
I do install an 3.5 hybrid OME / JKS suspension from DPG Offroad on the LJ, the OME coils yield 4" of lift maybe a hair more, also install 33 x 10.5 tires on it using the OEM control arms. Never have any issue beside the shovel.
Once I do the TT I went ahead and do the SYE as I do have it in a box on the shop, it has to be done as TC is been lifted toward the tub and the output shaft end up too high for the OEM driveshaft set up. Axle rotation os a must so adjustable control arms comes to play.
For the LJ's Savvy has an Mid Arm suspension that has been used on a KOH winner LJ. Check it out on the Savvy website plus search a little about it. Pretty sure your LJ with long arm picture will become blurry.
I will like to tell you to go ahead and install the 4" lift with short arms. If BML and MML are in budget does it at the same time. Your current driveshaft setup will work just fine.
Correct I mean the gears. Lockers rarely handle issues.
If you trust the Shop on subject and has the funds, I will run the risk and get all done at the same time but just after been sure the lift kit and tire size to be use.
OP
I'll look to see if any stories back it up. But if it'll take that much to have the driveshaft fall out, I should be safe. Thanks.
That's quite the story with your LJ! When you do tons, what're you planning on doing suspension and tire wise?
I'll take a look for that article, thanks.
I like the idea of OME suspension, it's what my girlfriend has in her Toyota. My only objection is I've heard it's a bit stiff for a Jeep. That, and I want the adjustable control arms from the Currie. The mid arm is something I know of, but not a lot about. It looks like you can add it to an already existing Currie/Savvy short arm? If so, that's something I'd maybe consider doing later. I definately plan on doing the motor mount lift, and while I didn't plan on the body lift unless I was going with 35s, I figure I'd might as well do it with the motor mount. Especially if the combo will help my driveshaft.
I intend on regearing, chromolly shafts, and probably Currie steering and Black Magic brakes with 35s, and probably most of that with 33s too. So I kinda figure just do 35s, so I only have to gear once. My only fear with the 35s is that since they only come in 12.5, they won't perform well as my daily on wet and snowy roads in Washington. And, though I know good MPG isn't really something you expect with a Jeep, it is still my daily. So despite wanting 35s, maybe 33s are the way to go. More to consider. There is a 34x11.5, which would be good, but it's on a 17 rim, which I really don't want.
Thanks for the advice.
The combo won't help your driveshaft, but the MML alone will. I still think doing both is a good thing, especially to fit 35's if you're going with a 4" Currie/Savvy short arm. But a lot of people don't like the look of a body lift, so if you stay at 4" you'll be golden for 33's and the MML will help the driveline angle.
If you get above 33's you might think hard about going with a 17" wheel. The reason is you get the bigger brake kit from BMBrakes. You'll want to stop those bigger tires and the bigger brake kit will do it. As for myself, I'll probably just stay with 33's and get the brake pads. Saves lots of coin and I can go anywhere in WA I think. Also have those 33x10.5r15 tire choices as well as 33x12.5r15.
I would do a lot more research before you pull the trigger on anything. Use reliable sources for your research. For example, one thing I’ve found is that Facebook groups are full of opinionated people who don’t really understand what they are saying (IE I ran 37’s on stock axles /gears for years and never had a problem). The forums are usually more reliable than some random guy on Facebook.
I would also try to understand what the long term costs associated with your end goal are and compare different routes to get there. I’ve been lucky in that very few things I’ve put on have needed to be removed for future upgrades. Typically, the cheapest way to do things is all at once. If you really want to end up with 35’s, lockers, gears, a TT, axle shafts, etc... the cheapest way to get there is to do it all at once. Buying parts twice sucks and can make your long term cost much higher than it needs to be.
I would not worry about 12.5 versus 11.5 versus 10.5 in the snow and rain. I drove around with 12.5 wides on terrible snowy / icey roads for years with no problem. I would assume the roads you have in Washington would be much better than what I was dealing with just due to the fact that you’re in a more populated area than I was. If you remember that you’re driving a lifted Jeep on mud tires through snow and drive accordingly, you’ll be 100% fine.
I would also try to understand what the long term costs associated with your end goal are and compare different routes to get there. I’ve been lucky in that very few things I’ve put on have needed to be removed for future upgrades. Typically, the cheapest way to do things is all at once. If you really want to end up with 35’s, lockers, gears, a TT, axle shafts, etc... the cheapest way to get there is to do it all at once. Buying parts twice sucks and can make your long term cost much higher than it needs to be.
I would not worry about 12.5 versus 11.5 versus 10.5 in the snow and rain. I drove around with 12.5 wides on terrible snowy / icey roads for years with no problem. I would assume the roads you have in Washington would be much better than what I was dealing with just due to the fact that you’re in a more populated area than I was. If you remember that you’re driving a lifted Jeep on mud tires through snow and drive accordingly, you’ll be 100% fine.
Something to think about, If you do your research you'll find a huge amount of differences with so-called tummy tucks. Some will give you a totally flat to the chassis result others will give you a better shaped skid with maybe a small amount of lift.
The higher you make the "tummy tuck" the more issues you'll run into. I'd suggest you sit down, plan the total build based on required tire size. Then work your way through suspension lift and then make tummy tuck decisions based on that.
Sean Allen
Member
Another option would be to buy the lift first and space the t-case down while you're saving/planning for your tummy tuck. That way you don't have to wait to do it all at once and you would only need to replace the driveshaft once. My LJR currently has a 3.5" lift from rock krawler with the t-case drop and stock driveshaft. I don't like it, but I can still use it. I've had the TT from undercover fab, a 3.5" short arm kit from metal cloak, spring relocation brackets and outboard shock kit sitting in a pretty pile waiting to be installed for quite a while. My plan is to do the suspension and TT at the same time so I can measure for the drive shaft. But also tackle the outboard rears at the same time. Waiting has been agony but there is a convenience to doing it all at once. I saved up, bought a part. Saved up, bought something else etc. over a couple years. THE STRUGGLE IS REAL! But Im getting really close now. The trick is to have a plan and stick to it!
OP
^ I'm not sure if you wrote something, but I don't see it.
I don't care for bodylifts either, but it sounds like it'll be useful in making the motor mount work with the radiator? No, if I did 33s, I'd prefer no body lift. But if it helps with the radiator and the tummy tuck that I will do someday, though not necessarily with this project, I'll end up just doing it. Also because I'll be doing the gas tank fix, and I only wanna do that once.
I'd rather do 16s than 17s. There is a 34x11.5R17 (285x75R17) that is tempting, though. I did consider going with the 17s for the sake of the larger brakes. But I like having more sidewall and less expensive rims and tires. But, it's still a posability.
I haven't asked much on facebook, only the LJ group about needing a new driveshaft with 4" of lift. I got mixed responses.
That's why the build is getting so pricey, to be honest. I thought just do 33s without regearing, but once I realized I probably will have to regear, figured I'd might as well gear for and get 35s and chromollys. And while I'm in there, might as well add the lockers. Save something like $1K in labor in the future. That's why, if I can get by without a new driveshaft on my LJ, I'll hold off on the tummy tuck for now. If not, might as well only get the driveshaft once. I'm only a little hesitant on building up my axles if I wanna swap them out. But... there's an XJ in the family I can donate my axles to in the future, if I do the swap. I'll likely do the shafts as well with 33s, just cuz I wanna make it stronger.
I just worry a bit with road traction, cuz I already slip a bit with my 9.5's. But I see so many 12.5's around here anyway. I figured tall and thin would help with deeper snow, and help handling and what little MPG can be salvaged on the street.
I guess I'd go as tall as possible on the tummy tuck, without causing too much of a headache. So long as I can get by with my current driveshaft, I think I've made up my mind and I'll hold off on it for now. And you're right; gotta commit to a tire size and stick with it.
Did you try to run your LJR without the transfer case drop? Or did you it on right away? I'd like to avoid dropping it, though it would still be a net gain with the tires and lift.
I've had my LJ for 6 years now, and all I've done is a new top. After mine got cut open. But I'm getting anxious now!
Thanks for all of the help so far you guys, I really do appreciate it. At this point, I'm leaning towards not doing the tummy tuck yet, but setting myself up for it with the adjustable control arms and body lift. The lockers will depend on the budget. If I can't afford them just yet, I'll have to deal with double labor costs in the future. But if my stock driveshaft doesn't work, I'll have to decide from there if I can do the full tummy tuck, or just have to pay for two driveshafts. We'll see.
I don't care for bodylifts either, but it sounds like it'll be useful in making the motor mount work with the radiator? No, if I did 33s, I'd prefer no body lift. But if it helps with the radiator and the tummy tuck that I will do someday, though not necessarily with this project, I'll end up just doing it. Also because I'll be doing the gas tank fix, and I only wanna do that once.
I'd rather do 16s than 17s. There is a 34x11.5R17 (285x75R17) that is tempting, though. I did consider going with the 17s for the sake of the larger brakes. But I like having more sidewall and less expensive rims and tires. But, it's still a posability.
I haven't asked much on facebook, only the LJ group about needing a new driveshaft with 4" of lift. I got mixed responses.
That's why the build is getting so pricey, to be honest. I thought just do 33s without regearing, but once I realized I probably will have to regear, figured I'd might as well gear for and get 35s and chromollys. And while I'm in there, might as well add the lockers. Save something like $1K in labor in the future. That's why, if I can get by without a new driveshaft on my LJ, I'll hold off on the tummy tuck for now. If not, might as well only get the driveshaft once. I'm only a little hesitant on building up my axles if I wanna swap them out. But... there's an XJ in the family I can donate my axles to in the future, if I do the swap. I'll likely do the shafts as well with 33s, just cuz I wanna make it stronger.
I just worry a bit with road traction, cuz I already slip a bit with my 9.5's. But I see so many 12.5's around here anyway. I figured tall and thin would help with deeper snow, and help handling and what little MPG can be salvaged on the street.
I guess I'd go as tall as possible on the tummy tuck, without causing too much of a headache. So long as I can get by with my current driveshaft, I think I've made up my mind and I'll hold off on it for now. And you're right; gotta commit to a tire size and stick with it.
Did you try to run your LJR without the transfer case drop? Or did you it on right away? I'd like to avoid dropping it, though it would still be a net gain with the tires and lift.
I've had my LJ for 6 years now, and all I've done is a new top. After mine got cut open. But I'm getting anxious now!
Thanks for all of the help so far you guys, I really do appreciate it. At this point, I'm leaning towards not doing the tummy tuck yet, but setting myself up for it with the adjustable control arms and body lift. The lockers will depend on the budget. If I can't afford them just yet, I'll have to deal with double labor costs in the future. But if my stock driveshaft doesn't work, I'll have to decide from there if I can do the full tummy tuck, or just have to pay for two driveshafts. We'll see.
I have a2006 LJR with a 4" lift plus 1" body lift... Stock skids... No vibs or issues that I can tell with stock driveline. I expect to get the new drive line when I install the Tummy Tuck though.
They do, but not so much for the 2" higher fender. Most of the travel increase is from moving the wheel well opening further back, like 4" back.
This is the only photo I have, but compare it too stock.
And this, of my beat up AEV Highline
HighLines include a triangular cutout of the factory inner fender too. This is what makes them work better than lifts.
Regardless of any other mod, lockers will deliver the biggest performance mod possible.... unless you need "flotation" like a SEEP.
this is a great book
Looks like I won’t be that far from you in Spokane. Looks beautiful on the Kootenay’sForest
Sean Allen
Member
Just realized I ordered the LOPRO mount when I got my UCF skid a few years back. I have a 6 speed. Guess the mount will be on the for sale board soon! Lol.
OP
Did you do a motor mount lift as well? I'm not too sure how the slip yoke I have and your fixed yoke would differ, regarding the driveshaft at flex. I'll be looking into that next.
But that's good news, thanks. I guess I'll do the same; new drive shaft with the tummy tuck.
That AEV highline is hour I wish TJs came from the factory. Also wish AEV still made stuff for TJs, but it looks like they don't.
I don't think that the Smittybilt tube fenders really do much for the wheel well opening back; MAYBE a little up travel. But the ones from Metal Cloak, Poison Spyder, and Genright seem to, maybe. That's where I'd wonder, with that gain, what tire could be run with those fenders and a 4" short arm lift? For if/when I do an axle swap in the future.
I'd be interested in tube fenders, as long as I can get the necessary tire coverage for legal reasons. My only objection to highlines is needing to relocate what's under the hood, especially since I intend to run a supercharger; if that takes up more room?
Yeah, or add the hovercraft package.
Alright, lockers will be bumped up higher on the to do list. Thanks.