Top of the world is a lot of ledges, climb them on the way up and descend them on the way down. It’s not that bad and other than top there’s no steep cliffs to worry about.The Top of the World trail is looking really, really tempting. From what I keep reading about it, I'm leaning towards thinking it may be out of my skill level.
If you leave 'em on you'll snap your axles unless you are using automatic lockers designed to release under a certain tension threshold such as Detroit or Aussie lockers. Rubicon, ARB, OX, Eaton are selectable lockers and must be released before that threshold is met. Only use selectable lockers in straight ascents or straight flattish boulder fields. Rears can handle slight turning without snapping. Fronts not so. Moreover, turning increases friction. Have watched experts ascend locker recommended hills without lockers by merely steering left and right to distribute grabbing traction and maintain forward momentum. Lockers serve to simplify steep ascents and assure traction for diagonal two wheel/one wheel touches. Disconnecting the sway bar greatly assists traction and adds a great deal of safety to manage off camber terrain. Be sure not to use lockers when one wheel is going to be pinched between a cliff and a large rock; back off before getting pinched and take another line. Try to remember lockers are useless when none of the wheels are touching as in a rollover situation.Run the trails with your lockers on
That reminds me of a question I had. Do people usually disconnect only the front sway bar, or both?If you leave 'em on you'll snap your axles unless you are using automatic lockers designed to release under a certain tension threshold such as Detroit or Aussie lockers. Rubicon, ARB, OX, Eaton are selectable lockers and must be released before that threshold is met. Only use selectable lockers in straight ascents or straight flattish boulder fields. Rears can handle slight turning without snapping. Fronts not so. Moreover, turning increases friction. Have watched experts ascend locker recommended hills without lockers by merely steering left and right to distribute grabbing traction and maintain forward momentum. Lockers serve to simplify steep ascents and assure contact for diagonal two wheel/one wheel touches. Disconnecting the sway bar greatly assists traction and adds a great deal of safety to manage off camber terrain. Be sure not to use lockers when one wheel is going to be pinched between a cliff and a large rock; back off before getting pinched and take another line. Try to remember lockers are useless when none of the wheels are touching as in a rollover situation.
Only frontThat reminds me of a question I had. Do people usually disconnect only the front sway bar, or both?
Disconnecting will increase articulation, which can help keep the tires on the ground for traction. However, it does not help in off camber situations. The chassis is going to try to lean even more than the angle of the axles. Being connected prevents that, which is why the Antirock help with both.Disconnecting the sway bar greatly assists traction and adds a great deal of safety to manage off camber terrain.
Did it in a stock 2001 TJ with 30s. Top of the World is a solid level 3 trail.I did Top of the World on 33's.
Disconnecting allows the uphill wheel to be pushed up into the wheel well allowing the downhill wheel to EXTEND downward thus leveling the vehicle. Not disconnecting will tip the vehicle as the axle springs are constrained from flexing. Watch a few Youtube videos and you will soon see what I'm talking about. See photo attached. Notice I'm level. Notice the flex of the right wheel DOWN into the crack with the left wheel pushed UP. If I was connected, the vehicle would roll toward the camera, then roll the other direction as the right wheel would begin to climb and tip over to the left. Descend the uneven Z turn on the Rim without disconnecting. You'll roll all the way to Devil's Crack. I'm not disconnected in the avatar. If I turned right I would roll. If I did this again disconnected, and turned right, the right tire would be pushed down closer to the ground decreasing if not eliminating the possibility of a rollover.Disconnecting will increase articulation, which can help keep the tires on the ground for traction. However, it does not help in off camber situations. The chassis is going to try to lean even more than the angle of the axles. Being connected prevents that, which is why the Antirock help with both.
That is not what I would call off camber. Your rear axle is flat and it's your rear (connected) sway bar that is keeping the jeep flat.Disconnecting allows the uphill wheel to be pushed up into the wheel well allowing the downhill wheel to EXTEND downward thus leveling the vehicle. Not disconnecting will tip the vehicle as the axle springs are constrained from flexing. Watch a few Youtube videos and you will soon see what I'm talking about. See photo attached. Notice I'm level. Notice the flex of the right wheel DOWN into the crack with the left wheel pushed UP. If I was connected, the vehicle would roll toward the camera, then roll the other direction as the right wheel would begin to climb and tip over to the left. Descend the uneven Z turn on the Rim without disconnecting. You'll roll all the way to Devil's Crack. I'm not disconnected in the avatar. If I turned right I would roll. If I did this again disconnected, and turned right, the right tire would be pushed down closer to the ground decreasing if not eliminating the possibility of a rollover.
View attachment 140111
It sounds like we would only have one day (17th) that we would both be there. My plan was to do Finns & Things and Hells Revenge one day then do Top of the World and Poison Spider the other day. If you are interested in meeting up and wheeling together that day, let me know.April 10th thru 17th(?) - I have a 2 day drive back home and have to be back before that Monday (20th). Not sure exactly when we'll be heading back, we were thinking about taking the scenic route through El Paso. The 17th would definitely be my last chance for any wheeling that week though.
If you leave 'em on you'll snap your axles unless you are using automatic lockers designed to release under a certain tension threshold such as Detroit or Aussie lockers. Rubicon, ARB, OX, Eaton are selectable lockers and must be released before that threshold is met. ....
.... Run the trails with your lockers on. ...
Disconnecting allows the uphill wheel to be pushed up into the wheel well allowing the downhill wheel to EXTEND downward thus leveling the vehicle. Not disconnecting will tip the vehicle as the axle springs are constrained from flexing. Watch a few Youtube videos and you will soon see what I'm talking about. See photo attached. Notice I'm level. Notice the flex of the right wheel DOWN into the crack with the left wheel pushed UP. If I was connected, the vehicle would roll toward the camera, then roll the other direction as the right wheel would begin to climb and tip over to the left. Descend the uneven Z turn on the Rim without disconnecting. You'll roll all the way to Devil's Crack. I'm not disconnected in the avatar. If I turned right I would roll. If I did this again disconnected, and turned right, the right tire would be pushed down closer to the ground decreasing if not eliminating the possibility of a rollover.
View attachment 140111
If you look closer the left rear is barely touching 12-15 inches downhill from the right. How would you think that is possible on flat terrain? The leafs do flex somewhat. One does not disconnect rear axle leafs; that is asking for trouble. There's nothing flat about this crossing. I didn't intend to get into a pissing match here; only been doing this for 40 years...never rolled one driving a lot of off cambered terrain. One is much less tippy disconnected going around the up side of Black Hole on Hell's Revenge. That's off camber for at least 50 yards. Then there's Tip Over Challenge. You'll tip over connected. It's an off camber climb.That is not what I would call off camber. Your rear axle is flat and it's your rear (connected) sway bar that is keeping the jeep flat.
Have broken axles using lockers when I shouldn't have been. Auto lockers are best on trails; require attention in rain, lots of attention in snow. For those who recommend keeping switchable lockers constantly engaged running trails, then why don't you just wheel with spooled front diffs? A whole lot cheaper setup if changing out axles is your thing?"... Run the trails with your lockers on. ...
This is correct'
.... For those who recommend keeping switchable lockers constantly engaged running trails, then why don't you just wheel with spooled front diffs? A whole lot cheaper setup if changing out axles is your thing?
Most do have stock shafts. Polychrome alloys are also breakable, Just gotta try harder. I enjoy open diffs on 98% of every trail I've driven. I use lockers on the other 2%. Potato Salad Hill is another matter.FWiW, I leave my axles locked most of the time on any trail that warrants lockers. I also don't have stock shafts anymore.
Simply not true. I’ve even run spooled rear Dana 44 stock shafts with a damaged pinion gear (before I got it) as a DD without issue on 33’sIf you leave 'em on you'll snap your axles unless you are using automatic lockers designed to release under a certain tension threshold such as Detroit or Aussie lockers. Rubicon, ARB, OX, Eaton are selectable lockers and must be released before that threshold is met. Only use selectable lockers in straight ascents or straight flattish boulder fields. Rears can handle slight turning without snapping. Fronts not so. Moreover, turning increases friction. Have watched experts ascend locker recommended hills without lockers by merely steering left and right to distribute grabbing traction and maintain forward momentum. Lockers serve to simplify steep ascents and assure traction for diagonal two wheel/one wheel touches. Disconnecting the sway bar greatly assists traction and adds a great deal of safety to manage off camber terrain. Be sure not to use lockers when one wheel is going to be pinched between a cliff and a large rock; back off before getting pinched and take another line. Try to remember lockers are useless when none of the wheels are touching as in a rollover situation.
Hi y'all!
I'm planning on making my pilgrimage to the holy land at Easter Jeep safari this year, and I'd like your input on two questions I have:
1. What difficulty rating of trails can my TJ (and myself with not much offroad experience) handle at Moab? (without damage, because it's my ride home too)
It's a Rubicon with a 3" coil lift, 265/70 17 Duratracs, otherwise stock.
and 2. What equipment should I seriously consider bringing with me or adding to my Jeep to be better prepared for the trails?
-tool set, water, recovery points, recovery straps, CB radio?, oil, coolant, ATF for PS, fire extinguisher already on the list
I don't want to miss anything, and as I'm doing my homework for the trip, I'd like to hear some advice from people with experience at Moab/EJS. Thanks!
Your rig should be capable of everything you are comfortable doing on the trail and then some. I’m sure you will be checking fluids and under the Jeep to make sure everything is in working order for this big of trip. Get the portable air source as suggested. Not a bad idea to bring extra spark plugs, ujoints, brake fluid, and even a set of front axle shafts. Don’t worry about SYE and clearance concerns until you wheel it enough to know it will make a difference. You should only need the lockers briefly on certain parts of the trail and utilize 4 low. Study the lines the other rigs take and you’ll know who to follow... Enjoy!Hi y'all!
I'm planning on making my pilgrimage to the holy land at Easter Jeep safari this year, and I'd like your input on two questions I have:
1. What difficulty rating of trails can my TJ (and myself with not much offroad experience) handle at Moab? (without damage, because it's my ride home too)
It's a Rubicon with a 3" coil lift, 265/70 17 Duratracs, otherwise stock.
and 2. What equipment should I seriously consider bringing with me or adding to my Jeep to be better prepared for the trails?
-tool set, water, recovery points, recovery straps, CB radio?, oil, coolant, ATF for PS, fire extinguisher already on the list
I don't want to miss anything, and as I'm doing my homework for the trip, I'd like to hear some advice from people with experience at Moab/EJS. Thanks!