Which Winch?

Have you had any issues with the steering fluid overheating? These were pretty popular 30 years ago and I always thought they worked well but most people ran an oil cooler to keep the hydraulic oil from becoming overheated...... thoughts/comments?
 
Have you had any issues with the steering fluid overheating? These were pretty popular 30 years ago and I always thought they worked well but most people ran an oil cooler to keep the hydraulic oil from becoming overheated...... thoughts/comments?
I have not had any issues with overheating, even under load it runs cool enough you can put your hand on the "motor". I'm just running a stock power steering pump with no cooler. If it ever does give me trouble, I'll probably replace the pump with a higher volume one.

I'm happy with it and if I had to buy a winch today I would get the same one. The biggest downside is just the cost, it looks like they are up to $1,100 (I bought mine 15 years ago and it was 'only' $700), but it's been on 2 Jeeps so far and still works like new, so....
 
I run a MileMarker 10,500lb hydraulic winch, I've had it since '03 and prefer the advantages over an electric winch. I think of it as a "PTO" winch, since it requires the engine to be running to use it. It's more expensive than a cheap electric, but around the same price as a premium electric.

Hydraulics have several advantages: No "duty cycle" - since they don't get hot, you can run them continuously - they also won't melt your synthetic rope. They only draw 2 amps (which is why they don't get hot) so you don't need a bigger alternator or dual batteries. They are sealed and can operate completely under water. Lighter and lower profile so they don't block the radiator. Hardly slows down even under full load.

There are also disadvantages: They run off the power steering pump, so if you don't have power steering or think moving the hoses on the pump is too complicated.... They require the engine to be running, so if you roll upside-down, you can't use it.

I don't want to start an "us vs. them" argument on which is best, they both have advantages/disadvantages. The OP wanted advice on which winch to buy, I just wanted to throw another idea into the mix.

Here is a nice review: http://www.4x4review.com/mile-markers-10500-lb-hydraulic-winch/

(note: I am not in any way connected with Mile Marker or any winch company. Just your normal Jeep nerd who does a lot of research before I buy anything, and don't always buy what everyone else does)

Very informative on covering the pros and cons, another reason I like steel cable over synthetic.

The duty cycle of hydraulic winches are unmatched.

The line speed and fact that it doesn't work without the engine running are major hits for me.

Sometimes driving and winching is necessary and a fast line speed on a high end winch allows this. As you said if you are upside down or if the engine has stalled out/cant be run in a real deep hole/stream (right side up) the electric will get you out of there.

Do you find that power steering system failures (like pumps and gears that begin to leak badly and are on the way out fast) cause the winch not to work if you keep adding fluid? Or will it still work at a reduced capacity like power steering does?

I only ask because Jeeps like to kill power steering components. I myself have lost a gear and a pump in a rather spectacular fashion. My PS pump locked up while driving and shot all of the PS fluid all over the engine bay. During a separate incident the seal on the steering gear input shaft let go and dropped all of the fluid very quickly.
 
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Very informative on covering the pros and cons, another reason I like steel cable over synthetic.

The duty cycle of hydraulic winches are unmatched.

The line speed and fact that it doesn't work without the engine running are major hits for me.

Sometimes driving and winching is necessary and a fast line speed on a high end winch allows this. As you said if you are upside down or if the engine has stalled out/cant be run in a real deep hole/stream (right side up) the electric will get you out of there.

Do you find that power steering system failures (like pumps and gears that begin to leak badly and are on the way out fast) cause the winch not to work if you keep adding fluid? Or will it still work at a reduced capacity like power steering does?

I only ask because Jeeps like to kill power steering components. I myself have lost a gear and a pump in a rather spectacular fashion. My PS pump locked up while driving and shot all of the PS fluid all over the engine bay. During a separate incident the seal on the steering gear input shaft let go and dropped all of the fluid very quickly.

I wasn't sure why my pros and cons supported using steel cable, is it because electrics get hot? Warn and other make high-temp winch ropes. Having had both, I prefer rope over steel. YMMV

Line speed: unloaded, electric is faster. Under load, hydraulic is faster. When I'm using a winch, it's usually under load.

If you are in water deep enough for the engine to stop running, your winch will probably be under water also. So, neither winch will be working. I never put myself in a situation where there is any chance of rolling over unless I'm with another Jeep with recovery equipment. Every rollover recovery I've participated in didn't use the rolled-over vehicle's winch. (again, just my personal experience, YMMV)

I don't know what the statistics are for Jeep power steering failures, all I can say for sure it that in over 40 years of 'wheeling, I've never personally saw anyone have a failure (of any brand, not just Jeeps). I've had a couple of friends buy hydraulic winches after they've seen mine perform, and none of them have had problems with their stock PS systems, so I can't answer you hypothetical questions. Sorry to hear you've had bad luck in that area.

As I tried to state in my first post, there are advantages/disadvantages to both types of winches. Just pick the one that fits the type of 'wheeling you do. The important thing is to get out and 'wheel.
 
I wasn't sure why my pros and cons supported using steel cable, is it because electrics get hot? Warn and other make high-temp winch ropes. Having had both, I prefer rope over steel. YMMV

Line speed: unloaded, electric is faster. Under load, hydraulic is faster. When I'm using a winch, it's usually under load.

If you are in water deep enough for the engine to stop running, your winch will probably be under water also. So, neither winch will be working. I never put myself in a situation where there is any chance of rolling over unless I'm with another Jeep with recovery equipment. Every rollover recovery I've participated in didn't use the rolled-over vehicle's winch. (again, just my personal experience, YMMV)

I don't know what the statistics are for Jeep power steering failures, all I can say for sure it that in over 40 years of 'wheeling, I've never personally saw anyone have a failure (of any brand, not just Jeeps). I've had a couple of friends buy hydraulic winches after they've seen mine perform, and none of them have had problems with their stock PS systems, so I can't answer you hypothetical questions. Sorry to hear you've had bad luck in that area.

As I tried to state in my first post, there are advantages/disadvantages to both types of winches. Just pick the one that fits the type of 'wheeling you do. The important thing is to get out and 'wheel.

I don't think ive owned a jeep that didn't have a power steering failure at some point to be honest with you. My YJs, XJ, and TJ all lost a power steering pump or gears at some point, plenty of friends who lost them as well; big tires, lockers, and slow going is hell on them. Hell the Mercedes box jeeps practically have a reputation for failure. It wasn't meant to be a far fetched hypothetical question.

A good electric winch will run in water, especially ones with relocated solenoids or potted contactors. Not sure where this fear of water with quality electric winch setups comes from. It hasn't bit me yet at least haha.

I agree on the one man rollover recovery, but usually the winch on the rolled over vehicle is used to anchor it off to something while its flipped back over (especially if still on a slope).

Synthetic is great for weight savings but IMO steel trumps synthetic rope in just about every other category.

A high end electric winch is pretty fast under load, they just don't have 100% duty cycle like your beast mode hydraulic. Also when you are driving and winching there is much less load on the winch...

Get out and wheel indeed, I enjoy the discussion.
 
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I don't think ive owned a jeep that didn't have a power steering failure at some point to be honest with you. My YJs, XJ, and TJ all lost a power steering pump or gears at some point, plenty of friends who lost them as well; big tires, lockers, and slow going is hell on them. Hell the Mercedes box jeeps practically have a reputation for failure. It wasn't meant to be a far fetched hypothetical question.

A good electric winch will run in water, especially ones with relocated solenoids or potted contactors. Not sure where this fear of water with quality electric winch setups comes from. It hasn't bit me yet at least haha.

I agree on the one man rollover recovery, but usually the winch on the rolled over vehicle is used to anchor it off to something while its flipped back over (especially if still on a slope).

Synthetic is great for weight savings but IMO steel trumps synthetic rope in just about every other category.

A high end electric winch is pretty fast under load, they just don't have 100% duty cycle like your beast mode hydraulic. Also when you are driving and winching there is much less load on the winch...

Get out and wheel indeed, I enjoy the discussion.

Well, like I said, I didn't want to start another electric vs. hydraulic or steel vs. rope discussion, there are already plenty out there for those that enjoy that type of thing. I'm glad you're happy with what you bought, and I'm happy with what I bought. Keep 'wheeling and having fun, that's what it's all about.
 
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Well, like I said, I didn't want to start another electric vs. hydraulic or steel vs. rope discussion, there are already plenty out there for those that enjoy that type of thing. I'm glad you're happy with what you bought, and I'm happy with what I bought. Keep 'wheeling and having fun, that's what it's all about.

If I make points I am prepared to discuss and compare their validity.

Honestly there aren't too many hydraulic vs electric winch arguments, it was entertaining and informing for all who read.

No one searches lol...