Dana 35 pinion end play, how deep is my trouble?

Brianj5600 said:
There is plenty of information on setting up gears. I don't think gears are really hard to do. The hardest part is not saying that's good enough when you are just tired of trying different shim combos.
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This, 1000%. Gears aren't really hard, if you know how to read mics and can understand some basic mechanics. Its just tedious and if you're impatient or a "good enough" kinda guy...you probably shouldn't do the job. I wouldn't try to do them laying on the ground. When I did my Jeep, I took the extra time to pull both the axles and get them up on a bench, so I was comfortable. I didn't want to fall into the trap of not wanting to check one more set-up, because I was tired of laying on the floor.

I'm contemplating doing the gears in my truck...but I'm not sure I want to go through the work of pulling the front differential on an IFS rig!
 
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Thanks to @machoheadgames for meeting me yesterday to spend 45 seconds using his clamshell puller to get my carrier bearings off. I wish I could remember what I used last time to allow my press to do the trick, but I need a longer pusher.

Got home and went about setting the new races. Of course I can't quite get the inner race set. Looks like it's gone in slightly crooked. I'm sure I can get it back out, but dang it's hard to make that thing be square with the gas tank & the fact that the race driver is only like 4" long. Very hard to get your hand in there but still out of the way, and hold it square, and hit it hard enough to do any good.
 
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Boom. New day & a clear head…drove the race back out, and then back in. No fuss no muss. Got the other race in, then realized I probably shouldn't go much further without re-watching that section of hosejockey's video. The project continues for another day.

Also found the old race after it had popped out and rolled across the garage floor. I can’t believe just rolling on the floor did this much damage.🥸

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hear said:
Boom. New day & a clear head…drove the race back out, and then back in. No fuss no muss. Got the other race in, then realized I probably shouldn't go much further without re-watching that section of hosejockey's video. The project continues for another day.

Also found the old race after it had popped out and rolled across the garage floor. I can’t believe just rolling on the floor did this much damage.🥸

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That race is TOAST! You're lucky your doing this now before it all got worse. Be sure to clean out the diff really good as there will still be free floating metal paste stuck in there. Dip a rag down in the deep spots too. Tubes as well.
 
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hosejockey61 said:
That race is TOAST! You're lucky your doing this now before it all got worse. Be sure to clean out the diff really good as there will still be free floating metal paste stuck in there. Dip a rag down in the deep spots too. Tubes as well.
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oh yeah, me & that black metal/gear oil/dirt/brake clean soup are well acquainted.
 
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I may have just got done setting the crush sleeve. It's currently at 20 inch-lbs of rotational torque, which I believe is right in the range. These are used gears but brand new bearings, crush sleeve, and pinion nut (all this was done with the carrier out). What I'm about to say may sound stupid, but it won't be the first time nor the last time for that. It feels like the 20 inch-lbs is a lot harder to rotate than I would have expected. I don't have a good basis for what that amount of torque is, but just comparing it to @hosejockey61's video near the end where he walks in front & then spins it from behind....feels like his spins way more freely than mine does. But the torque wrench probably isn't lying. And maybe it's more to do with the fact that he's a fireman and I'm in tech. Anyhoo, should I be concerned?

Also it's probably worth pointing out that in no way was I able to move that nut/crush the sleeve under my own power, even with a cheater bar on my breaker bar. I ended up marking the nut with a marker and hitting it with the impact very carefully, which worked pretty well despite probably being dangerously close to over-crushing it.
 
hear said:
I may have just got done setting the crush sleeve. It's currently at 20 inch-lbs of rotational torque, which I believe is right in the range. These are used gears but brand new bearings, crush sleeve, and pinion nut (all this was done with the carrier out). What I'm about to say may sound stupid, but it won't be the first time nor the last time for that. It feels like the 20 inch-lbs is a lot harder to rotate than I would have expected. I don't have a good basis for what that amount of torque is, but just comparing it to @hosejockey61's video near the end where he walks in front & then spins it from behind....feels like his spins way more freely than mine does. But the torque wrench probably isn't lying. And maybe it's more to do with the fact that he's a fireman and I'm in tech. Anyhoo, should I be concerned?

Also it's probably worth pointing out that in no way was I able to move that nut/crush the sleeve under my own power, even with a cheater bar on my breaker bar. I ended up marking the nut with a marker and hitting it with the impact very carefully, which worked pretty well despite probably being dangerously close to over-crushing it.
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Did you lube up the bearings at all? That will make a bit of difference and smooth out the rotations. I think as long as you’re at 15-20 you’ll be good. The factory spec of 15-35 or 20-40 is pretty high.
 
machoheadgames said:
Did you lube up the bearings at all? That will make a bit of difference and smooth out the rotations. I think as long as you’re at 15-20 you’ll be good. The factory spec of 15-35 or 20-40 is pretty high.
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I did put some gear oil on them before I seated those bearings. They run smooth, just more resistance than I expected for 20 in-lbs. I definitely don't want to tighten it any further, and I know I can't really loosen it without starting over with a new crush sleeve. So I guess I'm calling it good because either direction is incorrect.
 
Be sure to measure the rotational torque not to include the break away torque. If it's 20, then you're good to go.
 
hear said:
I did put some gear oil on them before I seated those bearings. They run smooth, just more resistance than I expected for 20 in-lbs. I definitely don't want to tighten it any further, and I know I can't really loosen it without starting over with a new crush sleeve. So I guess I'm calling it good because either direction is incorrect.
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Yeah, run it. Keep in mind the seal adds a small bit of drag as well, so the actual torque on the bearings is a bit less. The spicer seals I use are pretty tight, not sure what you used.
 
hosejockey61 said:
Be sure to measure the rotational torque not to include the break away torque. If it's 20, then you're good to go.
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yeah its 20 as it's spinning. I used whatever seal came with the kit, which was slightly different from what I removed. Not the lack of the outer flange. Not that it matters, the seal bottomed out & is pretty much flush with the snout.


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Well fudge. I wasn’t expecting to have to shim anything since all I did was replace the bearings, but the backlash is 15 thou. Preload was a little light too. I guess I need to add like 8-10 thou to the ring side?
 
The current shims are the thick factory ones. I have a 9, can I slide it inside the thick shim and leave the factory shim on the far side? I figure that will improve my carrier preload too.
 
My guess is the backlash is not as tight as stock because like said above the gears are a bit worn, but also if you didn’t use factory bearings there might be a small variance. I’m sure you probably removed Timken, what went back in there? That said I’d run it too.
 
hear said:
No markings on the ones I took out. Timken are what I put in.
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Odd. The few axles I’ve taken apart were all Timken. Either way I’d send it. You did all you can really do. With how easy that one bearing came off there is a chance someone else has been in there before which might explain no markings on the bearings. Might explain why the pinion bearing was so bad too.

Just to confirm you remembered to keep the shim (somewhere around 0.040”) on the pinion under the bearing correct? And didn’t happen to set it aside or something and forget about it.
 
machoheadgames said:
Odd. The few axles I’ve taken apart were all Timken. Either way I’d send it. You did all you can really do. With how easy that one bearing came off there is a chance someone else has been in there before which might explain no markings on the bearings. Might explain why the pinion bearing was so bad too.

Just to confirm you remembered to keep the shim (somewhere around 0.040”) on the pinion under the bearing correct? And didn’t happen to set it aside or something and forget about it.
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I didn’t measure it, but it never came off the pinion except to wipe it down and went right back on.

Also, those spider gears are a whip and a half if you try to go rogue, rather than just following hosejocky’s video. I fought with them for like 30 minutes, and once I rewatched that section I had them in in like 30 seconds. 🤦‍♂️

All buttoned up now, gonna make sure the gasket doesn’t leak overnight, then we finna go on a jeep ride!!
 
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Actually took it out on the road tonight!! I was so concerned about the rear end & all my amateur work that I completely forgot I had rebuilt the transmission and hadn't yet tested it. And the steering box and the brakes...

Anyway, rear end made zero noise & performed beautifully. Thanks to everyone who helped.

Then in testing the transmission I went WOT to see where the shift points were and all that.....and I realized just how bad those 3.07's are. Would've been super convenient to do them right now but new gears wasn't in the budget at the momen, but it's definitely something that needs to happen.
 
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