Looking for advice on snorkel and waterproofing

[PaperTowels]

I Have a 2000 4.0 sport that I have already been working on for a while. After a recent adventure(when I got stuck) I noticed some water spraying out through my hood louvers and decided it was time to get a snorkel. After some research i learned this would not be enough to keep my jeep safe from possible water damage. And after waiting over 4 months for a snorkel to be delivered from morris4x4 I canceled the order. I was wondering of anyone could help me out with a new option that would fit my jeep as well as possible options and advice to waterproof everything else that's needed to insure my jeep doesn't end up getting destroyed because the water may have been a little to deep.

This jeep is my daily driver and is already decently modified. I'm just trying to be ready for most things that come my way during a weekend out in the woods without the fear of having to buy a new vehicle due to something that can be prevented.

 

[Claytone]

I’d go with some sort of cowl air intake vs a snorkel.
If you’re in water that deep the ignition system or other sensors will be your failure point.
A cowl intake should keep you from hydro locking in that situation and you don’t have to put holes in your exterior panels.

 

[Jramos013]

Even with a snorkel I would never go to depths higher than the bottom of the headlights. Considering that, I would forget about the snorkel and move all the difs and trans vents higher than the headlights. Also waterproof all the connections if you plan to go fording often.

 

[ColoJeep]

Additionally, Your entire ignition system and charging system and PCM are lower than the stock air intake on a 4.0.

 

[PaperTowels]

What I'm hearing so far is I got pretty lucky. Do you have any suggestions for a cowl air intake? I'll definitely be looking I to moving the vents as well.

 

[billiebob]

Then there is this,

 

[billiebob]

Yes, number one is keeping water out of the intake, hydro locking will kill the engine. wet ignition just stops the engine. There are hundreds of threads on snorkels and cowl intakes which will protect the engine internals. I quit water crossings as I realized even without ingesting water I had to oil change the diffs, tranny and transfer case every time. Wranglers are not built for water crossings above the diffs. Google military Jeeps like the M38..... the waterproofing was incredible. And that is what you need for preventing damage.

The military Jeeps which ran submerged had ALL vents routed to the air intake. Plus waterproofed O-Rings and fine threads on every spark plug. Same for every electrical connection. Nothing was "plug in" I sold my M38 because the maintenance was unaffordable. And altho I loved that one stream crossing completely submerged with a real snorkel plus exhaust extension.... Doing water crossings is an expensive game.

PS, one more thing. Industrial users do not do water crossings any more. They build bridges. Many municipalities have laws prohibiting water crossings because it destroys fish habitat. And if you live where that law exists.... crossing a stream will result in a road closure, a gate, a pile of gravel blocking access.... Tread Lightly is a real thing. Fish habitat and watersheds are sacred. Stay out of stream beds and rivers if you love wheeling.

 

[LONGJP2]

I believe most of the factory plugs are waterproof now.

 

[Goatman]

I would never knowingly put my Daily Driver in a creek that I'm thinking I need a snorkel for. Find some soft muck in the water and get stuck and I doubt the boss will understand on monday. There must be some other way of crossing that water that dosen't endanger your Daily Driver.
Also, here in NY there are strict rules about water pollution. You could be fined out of a house for that type of thing. Find a bridge or a road to cross then enjoy the other side of the creek knowing you will be able to drive to work on Monday.

 

[Kid Mechanic]

I’ve heard that submarines are good for going in deep water.

 

[Jerry Bransford]

I'd never do a trail that potentially had water so deep a snorkel might be needed. Never. If I got to a surprise point with water that deep I'd turn around. Its just not worth the risk. No matter if others were pushing me to do so... peer pressure is a bitch and I won't respond to it.

 

[RubiconRic]

In my experience, there are three scenarios with deep water: 1) brief crossings (like in the video above), 2) sustained duration, and 3) getting stuck. In the above video, the water isn't even that deep; they are just entering (too) quickly and nose-diving. With a stock intake, for #1, assuming you enter slowly and apply throttle as you reach the trough / low point, you should be fine up to the headlights area. For #2, you should also be fine up to headlights area as long as you maintain a bow wake and don't stop. This implies you are in an appropriate gear, have applied appropriate locker(s) before entering, are going appropriate speed to create and maintain a bow wake, and have sufficiently waited your turn to make sure your buddy in front of you doesn't get stuck in "that bad part" causing you to have to stop in the middle. For #3, that is where you get into trouble... the bow wake will stop and the water will rush back into you, potentially overflowing your stock intake, your belt-driven fan will need to push through the water and very likely ruin your fan clutch, water pump, etc...

As Jerry said above, best bet is to understand your rig's limitations, and if you are unsure and nobody in your group has a "superior" rig to test deep water first, you should either walk it first or go a different way.

Bottom line, I enjoy my stock setup and wouldn't change it out for a snorkel, electric fan, etc.

 

[Vinman]

I’ve crossed many, many streams, creeks, and other bodies of water where the level was headlight height or higher and while I’ve had water enter the front diff exactly once I’ve never had water enter the engine, tranny, rear diff or had any electrical issues. That includes the hundreds of times I power washed the entire engine compartment without covering a single component.

A lot of people on here seem to think that getting water in the engine compartment compromises the electrical system yet we very rarely hear about somebody that has issues from corroded connections or other water caused issues

 

[Jerry Bransford]

A lot of people on here seem to think that getting water in the engine compartment compromises the electrical system yet we very rarely hear about somebody that has issues from corroded connections or other water caused issues

My take on that is that we "rarely" hear about such issues because it's rare that Jeepers take their Jeeps into deep water. Not to mention it's a bigger problem with earlier TJs that use the AX-5, AX-15, 30RH, and 32RH transmissions since those four transmissions do not have remoted vents. Get in water deep enough to wash over them and water is going to get inside them. Water in a manual transmission is not a huge deal since it can easily drained and refilled but it's a huge deal if it gets into either of those two automatics.

 

[Stevo64]

Ideas to improve PCM water resistance? WranglerFix PCM is water resistant, but susceptible to water intrusion.

I recently upgraded to a WranglerFix PCM. It has performed great until my last trip to the Mammoth Lakes area. We had some heavy afternoon showers during a week there. I had some water in the passenger footwell, so need to check the airbox drain (which I have in the past year). I mention it to calibrate the level of rain. On a trail day after the rain, I went through some 6" deep puddles with enough speed to get splash on the windshield. I then had the CEL on, CEL blinking, engine quit. (no evidence when I lifted the hood that the PCM was externally wet. I was towed 15 minutes, restarted and returned to camp (a 45 minute freeway drive). I went to have the codes read, but no code reader would communicate. Then the CEL went off.

To get the mud off before the drive home, we went to a car wash with a wand. I did my normal routine removing mud, spraying under the wheels etc. no direct shot at the PCM. Of course the problem re-occurred! We waited about an hour and was able to return to camp from Mammoth.

The next day we drove home 7 hours to San Diego. after an hour the CEL went off and stayed off. I am/was more suspect of the Crank Position Sensor (CPS) being fouled as it is lower on the bell housing at about “four o’clock” versus the “11:30” position of my other 4.0 jeeps. The symptoms I experienced could be consistent with this… but I could not confirm with a code reader. I have now noted that the CPS connector has no gasket seal. Hence, I have filled with dielectric grease to hopefully make it more robust to puddles (if that was it).

I sent the PCM to WranglerFix as it could not read codes, and i noted when removing it that it appeared as though hot melt glue was coming out of the unused connector port - see pic. He told me it had water inside and that they are water resistant - not water proof. Fair enough. He has warrantied it and has my respect and appreciation for that.

Sometimes one thing hides another. It could be moisture got in the PCM and fried part of it that did not allow codes to be read. Certainly something got hot and leaked out. Rain as root cause? ( I live in San Diego, so my jeep does not get much rain!)

Recall, it was working otherwise... I just did not want to go on the trail in the future unable to read codes. With the leaking "hot melt", it also need to be looked at. I still wonder about the the CPS, as it is more likely I got water there both from the puddle and car wash. I have replaced CPS on a 92 wrangler and 2001 cherokee, so I am familiar with the symptoms they produce.

In the pic below, you see the seam on the WranglerFix PCM. I am inclined to RTV it. (there is a breather membrane i will not touch, but you get the idea). The WranglerFix PCM is in the mail to me right now. He indicated he is working to improve the water performance - So I will visually look to see if the externals are different. I want him and my jeep to be a success - I have never before been the one broken down before and I try to avoid that.

Thanks for reading and thoughtful feedback.

 

[NskLJ]

I Have a 2000 4.0 sport that I have already been working on for a while. After a recent adventure(when I got stuck) I noticed some water spraying out through my hood louvers and decided it was time to get a snorkel. After some research i learned this would not be enough to keep my jeep safe from possible water damage. And after waiting over 4 months for a snorkel to be delivered from morris4x4 I canceled the order. I was wondering of anyone could help me out with a new option that would fit my jeep as well as possible options and advice to waterproof everything else that's needed to insure my jeep doesn't end up getting destroyed because the water may have been a little to deep.

This jeep is my daily driver and is already decently modified. I'm just trying to be ready for most things that come my way during a weekend out in the woods without the fear of having to buy a new vehicle due to something that can be prevented.

View attachment 248735

I figured you being from Florida this would be easy.
https://www.motortrend.com/features/1408-swamp-buggy-racing-ultimate-waterproofing/