Frame swap question from a newbie

N

Newadventurer

New Member
Joined
Oct 20, 2017
Messages
16
Location
VA, United States
So, my husband and I bought a 1998 TJ last October. We looked at the frame before we bought it, and it looked fine. After driving it this winter we went to put a new exhaust on it, and it looked like a different Jeep underneath. There is now evidence of many repairs to the frame, some not done very well. We are told it will not pass inspection come October. ( It had been inspected the day before we bought it) Thankfully, we only paid $5000 for it, so things could be worse. We should just get rid of it, but we actually really love driving it. I found a frame for practically free from a TJ 4.0 automatic. It just needs a little repair, unlike ours, which needs about $2000 in repairs even with my very reasonably priced mechanic.
Questions...
Our TJ is manual. Is the auto frame compatible? The less rusty frame is pre-2002.
Is it worth it if I have to pay $2500 to swap the frame for an almost perfect but definately not new frame?
We can't afford a $4,000 TDK frame(plus swap $$$). Should we just sell the TJ and cut our losses?
Need advice from experience:)
 
Newadventurer said:
So, my husband and I bought a 1998 TJ last October. We looked at the frame before we bought it, and it looked fine. After driving it this winter we went to put a new exhaust on it, and it looked like a different Jeep underneath. There is now evidence of many repairs to the frame, some not done very well. We are told it will not pass inspection come October. ( It had been inspected the day before we bought it) Thankfully, we only paid $5000 for it, so things could be worse. We should just get rid of it, but we actually really love driving it. I found a frame for practically free from a TJ 4.0 automatic. It just needs a little repair, unlike ours, which needs about $2000 in repairs even with my very reasonably priced mechanic.
Questions...
Our TJ is manual. Is the auto frame compatible? The less rusty frame is pre-2002.
Is it worth it if I have to pay $2500 to swap the frame for an almost perfect but definately not new frame?
We can't afford a $4,000 TDK frame(plus swap $$$). Should we just sell the TJ and cut our losses?
Need advice from experience:)
Click to expand...
Most of that depends on the new frame condition. I wouldn't pay 2500 to swap in a less than pristine frame. To me, that's just throwing good money after bad. As for fitment, all 97-02 frames are interchangeable with regard to keeping same motor to same motor. The 4 and 6 cylinder frames are compatible with the exception of the frame motor mounts which can be carefully cut loose and moved from frame to frame.

With your 98, if you don't get another 98 frame, you will have to replace the snubbers under the corners of the grill with snubbers from any other year. The 98 has a small U shaped platform that requires a shorter snubber than the full length versions used on all other years.

I would keep looking for another frame in some condition that doesn't need repair. Bear in mind that if the frame is that bad, you'll wind up wanting to fix a whole bunch of other rusty crap once you get into the swap.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Chris and Newadventurer
Just to add to Mr Blaine's very good advice... Make sure to budget way more than $2500 for the swap. You are going to find other stuff that should be replaced while you have the vehicle stripped down.

The more you take apart, the more that will need replacing...
 
  • Like
Reactions: Newadventurer
Ranger_b0b said:
Just to add to Mr Blaine's very good advice... Make sure to budget way more than $2500 for the swap. You are going to find other stuff that should be replaced while you have the vehicle stripped down.

The more you take apart, the more that will need replacing...
Click to expand...
I've helped a few swap in rebuilt engines and trying to explain project scope creep to them is not always well received. Yes, your old water pump was working fine, do you really want a new engine with a used pump on it? How about new plugs, coil rail, radiator hoses, coolant, oil, radiator, thermostat, thermostat housing, serpentine belt, etc. that you would really enjoy having some confidence in?
 
  • Like
Reactions: Robert Bauer, Chris and Newadventurer
mrblaine said:
I've helped a few swap in rebuilt engines and trying to explain project scope creep to them is not always well received. Yes, your old water pump was working fine, do you really want a new engine with a used pump on it? How about new plugs, coil rail, radiator hoses, coolant, oil, radiator, thermostat, thermostat housing, serpentine belt, etc. that you would really enjoy having some confidence in?
Click to expand...
I totally get it. My lift took three months to install this winter...because the more I took apart, the more than needed to be fixed. Rust is a mother-effer. My friends all think I'm nuts...but they don't mind driving rusty junk. I do...I need to know if my wife wants to take the jeep for a spin with her girlfriends, that everything is going to work for her and she's not going to get stranded somewhere.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Robert Bauer, tquig01, Chris and 2 others
My rule of thumb when my jeep buddies ask, always double the cost. Like newadventure's cost of $2,500 for the frame, I will add another $2,500 for what mrblaine just mentioned.... (IF "the old water pump was working fine, do you really want a new engine with a used pump on it? How about new plugs, coil rail, radiator hoses, coolant, oil, radiator, thermostat, thermostat housing, serpentine belt, etc").
 
  • Like
Reactions: Newadventurer
I would potentially suggest selling it and finding one that costs more but has a clean frame.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Alex01
And take you time.
My '05 TJ Sport took me about 20 months to find it, rust free (almost) at a decent price.
I used to live in Chicago rust belt at that time.
 
did you take it to a mechanic or a welder. Some mechanics will just send it to a welder an charge you an extra 1000. Find a weld shop, an get a quote from them. watch out, some weld shops look dreary......like you dont want to go in, cause theirs slag particles everywhere.....:) an post some pictures up here on the damage if you could. :) an I would call up the inspection joint an ask them if they can show you, if anything wont pass, an have them circle the areas that need fixed, some may just be surface rust, an no big deal, an you only got a 500 bill from a welder....
 
  • Like
Reactions: Newadventurer
An after reading that again, take it back to that same inspection joint, an ask them. I can't imagine, in that amount of time, it got that bad.....something sounds fisheee, with this one. :)? just saying. an find a jeep club in your area, an try to consult with some of them.:) now, you want it safe, but, you dont want to get ripped off either, by someone wanting to make acouple thousand off you.
 
weldedcambolt said:
did you take it to a mechanic or a welder. Some mechanics will just send it to a welder an charge you an extra 1000. Find a weld shop, an get a quote from them. watch out, some weld shops look dreary......like you dont want to go in, cause theirs slag particles everywhere.....:) an post some pictures up here on the damage if you could. :) an I would call up the inspection joint an ask them if they can show you, if anything wont pass, an have them circle the areas that need fixed, some may just be surface rust, an no big deal, an you only got a 500 bill from a welder....
Click to expand...
Good suggestion. We did get my mechanic to look at it, he is a welder and a fabricator. The price I had for him to swap it was $2000 but I added $500. He said for him to fix it would be about $2000 also. His prices are usually really cheap. We got a proper Jeep shop to quote us a price for the swap. They wanted $5000 and we had to provide the frame!
 
Newadventurer said:
Good suggestion. We did get my mechanic to look at it, he is a welder and a fabricator. The price I had for him to swap it was $2000 but I added $500. He said for him to fix it would be about $2000 also. His prices are usually really cheap. We got a proper Jeep shop to quote us a price for the swap. They wanted $5000 and we had to provide the frame!
Click to expand...
That is because they know what is involved and (hopefully) would return the Jeep to you needing nothing related to the swap/rust fix. As Mrblaine stated, the frame and it's actual swap is not big deal, it is all of the things you will find along the way that will add to it.

As far as $$$$ is concerned, lets think about this for a moment, $5,000 original purchase price, $2500 (your quoted price) for a frame replacement (with a frame that is better but certainly not pristine....), add in another $500 minimum for ancillary things you did not think about and you are now $8,000 into this jeep with no mods or enhancements. Now take a look around and see if you can find a better jeep for the same money (assuming you can get the original purchase price back for your's when you sell it). Where are you in VA?
 
Newadventurer said:
Good suggestion. We did get my mechanic to look at it, he is a welder and a fabricator. The price I had for him to swap it was $2000 but I added $500. He said for him to fix it would be about $2000 also. His prices are usually really cheap. We got a proper Jeep shop to quote us a price for the swap. They wanted $5000 and we had to provide the frame!
Click to expand...

ya, i just dont see, two thousand dollars worth of work, if it was just inspected in october, without looking at pictures, an you know, unless you didnt jump a bridge, fell in a sinkhole....off a cliff:) rust is fast but not that fast in virginia.....:). ? ya, i see all that money in a swap, an probably more if your wantin it right, but, inspected in october, an it was fine?......something aint right....... crawl under, or have someone snap pictures of the damage an post em on here if you can. run it up to the inspector, have em cirlce the stuff in chalk, an bring the inspector the chalk stick :) then people on here can get a better idea:) then people can say.....ohhhh, ya thats 2000 dollars worth of work...or naaaaaa:)
 
weldedcambolt said:
ya, i just dont see, two thousand dollars worth of work, if it was just inspected in october, without looking at pictures, an you know, unless you didnt jump a bridge, fell in a sinkhole....off a cliff:) rust is fast but not that fast in virginia.....:). ? ya, i see all that money in a swap, an probably more if your wantin it right, but, inspected in october, an it was fine?......something aint right....... crawl under, or have someone snap pictures of the damage an post em on here if you can. run it up to the inspector, have em cirlce the stuff in chalk, an bring the inspector the chalk stick :) then people on here can get a better idea:) then people can say.....ohhhh, ya thats 2000 dollars worth of work...or naaaaaa:)
Click to expand...
When we bought it it had been really "prettied up". The rust and repairs were somehow hidden and it had a brand new top, new tires, carpet, and newly painted flares. But the damage was already there, it didn't suddenly come this past winter. Maybe the place that inspected it just glanced at it. We certainly didn't look hard enough. My husband intends on getting under it to clean it up and put some rustproofing on it to slow down the deterioration. I'll see if he can take some pics.
Around my area rust free TJ's 4.0s are going for $8-12k depending on mileage (this time of year).
 
  • Like
Reactions: weldedcambolt
Newadventurer said:
When we bought it it had been really "prettied up". The rust and repairs were somehow hidden and it had a brand new top, new tires, carpet, and newly painted flares. But the damage was already there, it didn't suddenly come this past winter. Maybe the place that inspected it just glanced at it. We certainly didn't look hard enough. My husband intends on getting under it to clean it up and put some rustproofing on it to slow down the deterioration. I'll see if he can take some pics.
Around my area rust free TJ's 4.0s are going for $8-12k depending on mileage (this time of year).
Click to expand...


maybe ther's someone telling inspectors to pass, jeep frames so jeep dont get sued:) an on the recall hit list.......dododododododo.....:) everybodys waitin for damage pics......i can sense it.....:)
 
  • Like
Reactions: Newadventurer
newadventurer- I am in the same boat with my 97 sahara. Body is pristine, low miles, all original, BUT the frame is less than desired. I plan on getting Safe-T-Caps and welding them in. Again this is what I am doing as I cant part with my Sahara.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Newadventurer and CBRacerX
I've looked into frame repair for "that day" when my 4 season driven TJ will need it. It would be great to see some pics of the damage you are dealing with, but sight unseen I would pay to get the current frame fixed with parts from https://www.autorust.com/product-category/jeep/jeep-tj/ - there is less fabrication time and more just patching in the ready to weld sections that need replacement. And possibly (no guarantees) less "while you are in there" issues. Good luck!
SafeTCap_JeepChart_www_800x1035.png
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: Newadventurer
Top Bottom
Back