Anyone need a Gladiator?
- Thread starter Jmac00
- Start date
Sounds like I'm in the wrong business. I know engine swaps aren't cheap but they've got to have a ton of margin at that price.
I'll bet good money the margin is sub 15%. I see 130,000 in parts plus labor to make it look nice. That level of build if done correctly can burn up 40-50 grand before you can spit twice.
Looking into it some, I see it would take about 30 grand for the engine, trans and management system. Or at least you should budget that much. Axles are going to run 20-25,000. Tires and rims are another 4500. That's just basic parts laying in a pile adding up to around 60K or so. No suspension, no exhaust work, no wiring, engine mount fab, custom trans mount or anything else and all of that is on top of the JT purchase price. The little crap under the hood will burn up the better part of 5 grand in a hurry.
Put another way, I know an experienced shop will run about 100-125 grand to do a complete TJ Unlimited build with a crate LS drivetrain, wiring, coil overs, custom long arm, all turn key and ready to rock. That's starting with a 15 grand purchase price on the rig. I've been asked to look over a few quotes for friends and that's about what they run.
You are right on the money with the pricing, if anything on the lower side. If you look at any of the ICON 4x4 FJ40 builds that they with new cabs from Aqualu, crate LS motor/trans, custom frame from Art Morrison, Currie axles. Atlas TC, custom suspension and making the exterior and interior look really nice, they price is past 150k easily. It is not, and will not be cheap, to do it with everything done correctly and to high standards.
OP
Apples and oranges. The motorhome is a production line run with known options and pretty much plug and play once they iron out the production bugs and get the assembly "line" going. The first version of that motorhome was several million dollars in R&D which is more to the equivalent of the one off JT.
The MH company has more cost in figuring out how to make that slide out work properly than you could buy that JT for if you want a more accurate perspective.
OP
While I won't argue that my initial thought might have credited them with more profit than they actually get, if they're getting on the internet and ordering parts at retail like some random Joe then they're not as smart as they look.
They don't have a $25k cost in their axles unless they're also selling them for zero profit.
Have it your way. I'm not around enough of them to know the exact cost for a build like that. Nor do I do any big builds where there is a comparative amount of work.
I'm always a big fan of these builds and wish I had the skills, knowledge and funds to pull off some of the bigger stuff. I've been surprised at the prices these customs have been going for pretty regularly. Also it's so hard to get too much into a build before the build starts to change on its own IMO or if it's your vehicle, just to keep up with daily life.
I have some relatives that build some hot rods and they make a pretty good profit, but it's relatively low margin and they're sticking with used frames/bodies ie mixing frames with old bodies and keeping the fabrication to a minimum, though there's always some. From there most stuff are just known bolt ons that are solid and trouble free. Paint is a big deal when they do their stuff and they sub that out and pretty much they do the rest of the fab. I love those custom old dashes.
I have some relatives that build some hot rods and they make a pretty good profit, but it's relatively low margin and they're sticking with used frames/bodies ie mixing frames with old bodies and keeping the fabrication to a minimum, though there's always some. From there most stuff are just known bolt ons that are solid and trouble free. Paint is a big deal when they do their stuff and they sub that out and pretty much they do the rest of the fab. I love those custom old dashes.
if you were interested in doing that type of work, how many do you think you could do in a year? Not talking a first-time custom build, but something that you had figured out and just repeated the same build so the discovery and invention phase was done. To your earlier point comparing it to an RV, the discovery and invention takes a lot of it, but I think AMW probably has a lot of it nailed down and repeatable.
Look at ICON 4x4. They have made about 170 restomod FJs and about 100 Broncos to date - they have been in business for about 20 years doing this type of work. Things are constantly evolving, and anyone doing work like this to very high level of standards will want to carry over the learnings to future builds they do. Even if you have it nailed down and repeatable, it is a painstaking amount of time and work to it correctly.
This is no different to what the more extreme Toyota 79series are going for here in Aus. The difference with those is that they cut the rear half of the chassis off (on a new vehicle) and replace it with another so they can get the towing capacities from 3.5t to 4 or 4.5t. Then redo interiors, as 79 series Toyotas are like a work ute inside. Then add $50k canopy build and fit out.
I'd much prefer the Jeep. AMW sold a 1000hp Helliphant powered Gladiator with the works for $242k at a recent Barrett Jackson Auction so there's a market for them.
I'd much prefer the Jeep. AMW sold a 1000hp Helliphant powered Gladiator with the works for $242k at a recent Barrett Jackson Auction so there's a market for them.
I think the OEMs are making custom stuff like this more desirable than ever. I know the new trucks we have at work are very expensive and have to be towed fairly often and that future is looking dimmer and dimmer, especially with the bad idea fairy sprinkling a hefty dose of stupid all over new vehicles.
A bunch of people I know with newer cars are in the shop just as often I am with vehicles over 300k miles and my repair costs are much smaller. The future is fast approaching where rebuilding a vehicle might be the cheaper option since options at the dealers are more complicated and much more expensive. For those of us that do like the aesthetics of older vehicles and the comfort you get in 2000s vehicles, I can see this starting to be more viable for more and more people, especially when OEMs are getting closer to 6 figures especially for those of us that need 4 wheels under power to get to our destinations.
When you can build exactly what you want and have the same wait time and less taxes than the OEM, it'll make sense that more people will just shell out the cash to a custom shop that will ultimately have a cheaper and more reliable vehicle to drive for the future. Plus there's just more luxury spending in this sector. Of course vehicles are more than just tools and for many they're symbols, art, etc.
A bunch of people I know with newer cars are in the shop just as often I am with vehicles over 300k miles and my repair costs are much smaller. The future is fast approaching where rebuilding a vehicle might be the cheaper option since options at the dealers are more complicated and much more expensive. For those of us that do like the aesthetics of older vehicles and the comfort you get in 2000s vehicles, I can see this starting to be more viable for more and more people, especially when OEMs are getting closer to 6 figures especially for those of us that need 4 wheels under power to get to our destinations.
When you can build exactly what you want and have the same wait time and less taxes than the OEM, it'll make sense that more people will just shell out the cash to a custom shop that will ultimately have a cheaper and more reliable vehicle to drive for the future. Plus there's just more luxury spending in this sector. Of course vehicles are more than just tools and for many they're symbols, art, etc.
This, this was built for the multi-millionaire guy / pro athlete with a huge car collection who wants a toy that can melt 40’ tires when getting his coffee.
Iffen I was going to spend that kind of money, I'd much prefer to put that motor in one of the full custom Power Wagons they build with 4 doors.
Old ones or the new one, Blaine?
I would drive the hell out of an old one restomodded with 4 doors and done right.
That one right there will do just fine. The only thing that needs to change is the steel cable on the winch, stupid shackles as bumper jewelry, and the pod LED's need to go. Everything else is just fine barring it not having my motor choice which I can't determine.
That specific one has a modern Cummins. But the company that builds them offers several gas options. Heavy duty Dana/Dynatrac axles, Atlas TC, GM trans options. The interior is done nice and what is visible of the fit and finish seems good. Prices are well north of 200k though as is to be expected. The ones in dark red paint look really nice.