Bill Cosby to be released (conviction overturned)

[Jeffseven777]

You ever hear of anybody prosecuted for failing a background check?

Rarely hear of anybody doing something they shouldn't with a gun that didn't pass a background check or obtain it illegally to begin with.

Yes becasue those people who cant own the gun dont go to buy guns from places that have background checks. lol thats the point,

 

[Jeffseven777]

most commonly they use the straw man method which is much easier/safer than an illegal purchase from someone who might be trying to rob or kill you.

 

[Jeffseven777]

Straw men are caught via camera.

 

[Kevin Q]

Are you saying that if he was acquitted criminally the victim could not file a civil suit?

I was actually paraphrasing an article I read that explains Castor's actions. OJ already proved that you can lose a civil case despite acquittal. I believe the point of the article was that Castor tried to salvage some punishment via a civil trial since he didn't have enough to convict.

 

[mrblaine]

It took no time at all to find the government's constitutional violation. Defense counsel was screaming about it like stuck pigs at both trails.

It is not unusual for a criminal case to take three years to wind its way through a state's intermediate appellate courts to a state's supreme court. It frequently takes longer. Look at the dates of U.S. Supreme Court opinions and how many years earlier the actual incidents occurred. Many of those cases started in state courts and only moved into the federal system years later after all state court remedies were exhausted.

Things are better than they used to be, and far better than the British legal system of the 19th Century, the snail's pace of which is famously characterized in Charles Dickens's Bleak House,

“Jarndyce and Jarndyce drones on. This scarecrow of a suit has, in course of time, become so complicated that no man alive knows what it means. The parties to it understand it least, but it has been observed that no two Chancery lawyers can talk about it for five minutes without coming to a total disagreement as to all the premises. Innumerable children have been born into the cause; innumerable young people have married into it; innumerable old people have died out of it. Scores of persons have deliriously found themselves made parties in Jarndyce and Jarndyce without knowing how or why; whole families have inherited legendary hatreds with the suit. The little plaintiff or defendant who was promised a new rocking-horse when Jarndyce and Jarndyce should be settled has grown up, possessed himself of a real horse, and trotted away into the other world. Fair wards of court have faded into mothers and grandmothers; a long procession of Chancellors has come in and gone out; the legion of bills in the suit have been transformed into mere bills of mortality; there are not three Jarndyces left upon the earth perhaps since old Tom Jarndyce in despair blew his brains out at a coffee-house in Chancery Lane; but Jarndyce and Jarndyce still drags its dreary length before the court, perennially hopeless.”

I wasn't aware it went to the Supreme Court in that State, once I was aware, I understood.

 

[Brianj5600]

I have a feeling someone looking to shoot a cop isn't going to worry too much about background checks, universal or otherwise, when they go looking for a gun.

Your right. They will go buy one from someone on the street. Doing nothing won't help anything.

 

[Rick Flair]

Let’s blame criminal behavior and evil on objects used to carry out said crime.

You can’t fix evil in the world with law. It’s not possible.


This has been happening since the beginning of time, the best defense is self defense.

 

[mrblaine]

Your right. They will go buy one from someone on the street. Doing nothing won't help anything.

The giant disconnect from reality in all of the "common sense" gun controls that are passed and attempted to be put in place is they lack the actual common sense to not overlook the obvious. The rules only punish and affect law abiding citizens. The criminal looking to acquire and use a gun to commit a crime cares nary a whit about rules, laws, morality, or how their actions will perpetuate the erosion of our rights. Evil folks are going to do evil things and they do not care or worry about any laws that may be in place to stop them because they are not law abiding.

 

[L J]

What is the answer to reducing the numbers of police being killed?
Step #1 Lock up repeat violent offenders and career criminals for life
Step#2 Repeat

 

[mrblaine]

What is the answer to reducing the numbers of police being killed?

If we really want to reduce or slow that down, we have to go back many generations and figure out how to make the typical family unit with fathers who raise their children to respect the law the norm and keep it that way.

 

[chuck47]

There are far more police being murdered than alleged criminals, it's up 40% this year from last. Nobody seems to care about those numbers though.

In my mind, anybody being killed is not okay. Nobody wants to have their son/daughter/husband/wife not come home. But when someone becomes a police officer, part of that is taking an oath to serve and protect and understanding that they are putting their lives on the line for that cause. Civilians take no such oath. Is there any inherent reason why the life of a law officer is any more valuable than the life of a civillian? Any death is equally as bad from a moral standpoint, but the government only signs the paychecks on one side of the equation. We can't expect to control the actions of every individual but we should expect to have some control over the actions of public officials.

Do you happen to have a source for that data though? I'm seeing there were just over 1000 people killed by the police in 2020, and 368 officers that died in the line of duty.

 

[Rick Flair]

In my mind, anybody being killed is not okay. Nobody wants to have their son/daughter/husband/wife not come home. But when someone becomes a police officer, part of that is taking an oath to serve and protect and understanding that they are putting their lives on the line for that cause. Civilians take no such oath. Is there any inherent reason why the life of a law officer is any more valuable than the life of a civillian? Any death is equally as bad from a moral standpoint, but the government only signs the paychecks on one side of the equation. We can't expect to control the actions of every individual but we should expect to have some control over the actions of public officials.

Do you happen to have a source for that data though? I'm seeing there were just over 1000 people killed by the police in 2020, and 368 officers that died in the line of duty.

Yes, people sign on for the job. Yes the job risk is higher than a standard everyday Joe (police are civilians too), but the government is trying to discourage the killing of the law enforcement by making the punishment more harsh.


It goes back to old times of killing one of the kings men, got you a more stiff sentence than killing a neighbor.


This forces compliance on those who follow laws. It does nothing for those who Don’t give a fuck….



I see what you are saying and even being former LE, I agree. My life should not be worth more than yours.


Your numbers are flawed.


The people killed by police….did they provoke that response? Pull a gun, attack the officers, etc?


Compared to….how many police officers just flat out murdered folks for being at the wrong place?


Just saying.

 

[chuck47]

Yes, people sign on for the job. Yes the job risk is higher than a standard everyday Joe (police are civilians too), but the government is trying to discourage the killing of the law enforcement by making the punishment more harsh.


It goes back to old times of killing one of the kings men, got you a more stiff sentence than killing a neighbor.


This forces compliance on those who follow laws. It does nothing for those who Don’t give a fuck….

I totally agree with having additional penalties for attacking/killing an officer. I also get what you're saying though, "deterrent" type laws don't really seem to do much to deter crime from criminals, they just serve to instill fear in law-abiding individuals. Still though, that's at least worth something.

I see what you are saying and even being former LE, I agree. My life should not be worth more than yours.


Your numbers are flawed.


The people killed by police….did they provoke that response? Pull a gun, attack the officers, etc?


Compared to….how many police officers just flat out murdered folks for being at the wrong place?


Just saying.

I don't know if there are granular stats out there about that, so I think its fair to say that the majority of those police offers were not just murdering people for fun. And the media only really covers the 10-20 cases that suit their narrative. However, looking at the numbers from last year, there were 45 officers killed by gunfire in 2020, opposed to the 1000 people killed by the police. In fact, the vast majority of "line of duty" death's last year were from Covid-19 (240).

I feel like there are definitely legitimate issues when we examine the higher profile cases though, selective reporting aside. Things like shooting an individual who is running away from law enforcement, or using excessive force to the point of killing someone.

We can and should look at these instances to see how we can improve our society to reduce similar events in the future. How can we reduce public distrust in the police? How can we prevent officers from being struck down in the line of duty? How can we prevent loss of life across all demographics and areas? I don't think the answer is to shame law enforcement officers. I do think that we can work towards developing more accountability within the profession though.

 

[fourpointzero]

@chuck47 I truly believe that a lot of people lost respect for police officers because of what they see through all the forms of media. Be it someone's personal experience that they share on their socials or the large media outlets.

The above stated, If people just learned to control themselves and give benefit of the doubt to the PO's that stop or question them and give a little respect, they'll likely get that in return from the authorities. Yes, depends on the situation in question. But most cases, what I see very often is people resisting to comply or keeping things on a civil level. More often than not, it escalates into something that could have been avoided. I mean, there's plenty of videos! Just search YouTube.

End of day, policing has certainly come a long way from back in the early 90's pre-smart phones era and even earlier. Of course it can still be improved. Call it a WIP. But the it goes both ways. The public needs to retain their patience and take steps to avoid letting officer / civilian interactions escalate into negative confrontations. Its really common sense, in my opinion.

 

[chuck47]

@chuck47 I truly believe that a lot of people lost respect for police officers because of what they see through all the forms of media. Be it someone's personal experience that they share on their socials or the large media outlets.

The above stated, If people just learned to control themselves and give benefit of the doubt to the PO's that stop or question them and give a little respect, they'll likely get that in return from the authorities. Yes, depends on the situation in question. But most cases. What I do see very often is people resisting to comply or keeping things to some civil level. Then, often than not, it escalates into something that could have been avoided. I mean, there's plenty of videos! Check YouTube too.

100% agree with you. I had a high school teacher who was an ex cop and told us every statement should start and end with a "yes sir" or "yes ma'am". Every time I've ever been pulled over I've complied with every question/request and every time I've gotten minimal tickets. Cops are human beings too, and at the end of the day most cops are just trying to do their job and make their communities a better place.

End of day, policing has certainly come a long way from back in the early 90's pre-smart phones era or earlier. And it can still be improved as a WIP. But the it goes both ways. The public needs to retain their patience and take steps to avoid letting officer / civilian interactions escalate into negative confrontations. Its really common sense, in my opinion.

100% agree with you. I couldn't say it better myself. The way I see it, a bit of common sense from both parties would diffuse 99% of fatal interactions.

 

[mrblaine]

100% agree with you. I had a high school teacher who was an ex cop and told us every statement should start and end with a "yes sir" or "yes ma'am". Every time I've ever been pulled over I've complied with every question/request and every time I've gotten minimal tickets. Cops are human beings too, and at the end of the day most cops are just trying to do their job and make their communities a better place.

100% agree with you. I couldn't say it better myself. The way I see it, a bit of common sense from both parties would diffuse 99% of fatal interactions.

Regardless of all else there is one rule to live by that everyone should take to heart that would solve all of the issues.

The best chance anyone has for having a positive outcome from any interaction with Law Enforcement is to never have one.

 

[fourpointzero]

The best chance anyone has for having a positive outcome from any interaction with Law Enforcement is to never have one.

Absolutely, of course. But if you live in an urban area, as I do and grew up in, its inevitable that you will have some type of encounter with a person of the law. Not always because you brought intentionally upon yourself, but because you happen to be at the wrong place at the wrong time.

 

[Rick Flair]

I totally agree with having additional penalties for attacking/killing an officer. I also get what you're saying though, "deterrent" type laws don't really seem to do much to deter crime from criminals, they just serve to instill fear in law-abiding individuals. Still though, that's at least worth something.

I don't know if there are granular stats out there about that, so I think its fair to say that the majority of those police offers were not just murdering people for fun. And the media only really covers the 10-20 cases that suit their narrative. However, looking at the numbers from last year, there were 45 officers killed by gunfire in 2020, opposed to the 1000 people killed by the police. In fact, the vast majority of "line of duty" death's last year were from Covid-19 (240).

I feel like there are definitely legitimate issues when we examine the higher profile cases though, selective reporting aside. Things like shooting an individual who is running away from law enforcement, or using excessive force to the point of killing someone.

We can and should look at these instances to see how we can improve our society to reduce similar events in the future. How can we reduce public distrust in the police? How can we prevent officers from being struck down in the line of duty? How can we prevent loss of life across all demographics and areas? I don't think the answer is to shame law enforcement officers. I do think that we can work towards developing more accountability within the profession though.

I see what your saying and don’t disagree.


I will say…say for the 1000 people shot/killed, how many 100’s of thousands of interactions occurred without harm to folks? More than likely, millions. Policeone.com has the stats if you want them.



Point being, when you are dealing with criminals and the general public, in a country of 400 million people.


We should be questioning our health care system that kills MANY more people due to negligence and malpractice more than….police shootings.


But that doesn’t sell on the news does it? And big pharma won’t allow their bread and butter to be looked at. But LE…hell, we had elected politicians calling to defund them.



I left for many reasons, that is one. Nobody has your back for doing a thankless job.