Handling characteristics of a wider rear axle than front axle

[Trevlaw]

I've been trying to find a good solution to my axle width problem for a while now. Currently I'm really close to a stock width axle in the rear (super 8.8) with 3.75 backspaced wheels. My tires rub the shit out of my shocks in the back, doesn't cause any damage besides some rubber on my shocks, but I don't like it. The front axle is fine for now, I don't have any rubbing issues with stock width there.

I've come up with a way to reuse my rear axle and solve several issues I have with my 8.8 at the same time, but I'd end up with around a 65"ish wide rear axle and I don't have the want or the time to screw around with my front axle right now. Does anyone have any experience with the differences between these two setups? All I could find info on was the opposite, a wider front for improved turning, which leads me to believe there might be some negatives to this idea

 

[pc1p]

Tracking is going to be a challenge and could cause some handling issues based on what I've seen the First Gen Dodge guys do when running First Gen front axles with wider Second Gen rear axles.

I'm assuming you're using an Explorer 8.8 at 58.5". Why not run a Super 88 kit that adds 1.5" and bring you up to the ~60" WMS width mark?

 

[JEEPCJTJ]

Is the question regarding on road, off road, or both?

Tricycles, the old fashioned style with two wheels in the rear, did tip over fairly easily. That was proven to be dangerous by the 3 wheelers (ATVs) in the '70s into the 80's. The four wheeler started in the early-mid 80s and the 3 wheeler was gone by the late '80s.

Even with all that danger available in a trike, there has always been some on road trikes available and now a couple different style trikes with two wheels in the front for driving on the road. All that leads me to believe a wider rear axle shouldn't be much, if any, of a problem for a TJ.

 

[Trevlaw]

Tracking is going to be a challenge and could cause some handling issues based on what I've seen the First Gen Dodge guys do when running First Gen front axles with wider Second Gen rear axles.

I'm assuming you're using an Explorer 8.8 at 58.5". Why not run a Super 88 kit that adds 1.5" and bring you up to the ~60" WMS width mark?

Already have the super 88 kit, it's not enough. My tires rub after after about the first 3" of my 8" of up travel on one side, so basically everytime I take a corner.

I found one old racedezert post that mentioned it might understand on low traction surfaces, but I don't know how that translates to daily driving

 

[Trevlaw]

Is the question regarding on road, off road, or both?

Tricycles, the old fashioned style with two wheels in the rear, did tip over fairly easily. That was proven to be dangerous by the 3 wheelers (ATVs) in the '70s into the 80's. The four wheeler started in the early-mid 80s and the 3 wheeler was gone by the late '80s.

Even with all that danger available in a trike, there has always been some on road trikes available and now a couple different style trikes with two wheels in the front for driving on the road. All that leads me to believe a wider rear axle shouldn't be much, if any, of a problem for a TJ.

Both, but I put quite a few on road miles on it. It's my DD, about 10k+ a year. Mainly just don't want to end up with something that's awful to drive, ideally something with minimal negative impacts as it's kind of a hard mod to reverse if it doesn't work out.

I don't really like the idea of spacers in the front with already just 3.75" of backspacing. Seems like a lot of leverage on the unit bearings and ball joints, I do more go fast wheeling and like to jump it when I can lol

 

[pc1p]

Already have the super 88 kit, it's not enough. My tires rub after after about the first 3" of my 8" of up travel on one side, so basically everytime I take a corner.

I found one old racedezert post that mentioned it might understand on low traction surfaces, but I don't know how that translates to daily driving

8" of uptravel?? What in the world are you running for a suspension setup??

How are your shock mounts setup? You should be roughly at the same WMS as a factory Dana 35/44; I can't imagine how you'd be rubbing the shock with just 3" of up travel without some very different geometry.

 

[Trevlaw]

8" of uptravel?? What in the world are you running for a suspension setup??

How are your shock mounts setup? You should be roughly at the same WMS as a factory Dana 35/44; I can't imagine how you'd be rubbing the shock with just 3" of up travel without some very different geometry.

Nope, savvy Mid arm, currie 4" LJ springs in the rear, 33's and outboarded 12" 2.5's. Originally had 14" 2.0 emulsions, but those sucked and the 2.5's were a direct bolt in. Axles pushed to the side a bit to help driveshaft angle issues, but both sides rub a lot.

If I can figure out for sure whether or not a wider rear axle would cause me any problems, then I can get rid of the rubbing, help my driveshaft out a bit, fix a most likely bent axle and several oil and air leaks all while making room for some 12" 3.0s I have for the back

 

[pc1p]

Nope, savvy Mid arm, currie 4" LJ springs in the rear, 33's and outboarded 12" 2.5's. Originally had 14" 2.0 emulsions, but those sucked and the 2.5's were a direct bolt in. Axles pushed to the side a bit to help driveshaft angle issues, but both sides rub a lot.

If I can figure out for sure whether or not a wider rear axle would cause me any problems, then I can get rid of the rubbing, help my driveshaft out a bit, fix a most likely bent axle and several oil and air leaks all while making room for some 12" 3.0s I have for the back

Are you just planning on running a full-sized 8.8? I mean that isn't a terrible idea to help with your packaging issues back there. Be cool to match that with a wider front axle for some trackwidth gains and plenty of room for suspension stuff.

 

[mrblaine]

Already have the super 88 kit, it's not enough. My tires rub after after about the first 3" of my 8" of up travel on one side, so basically everytime I take a corner.

I found one old racedezert post that mentioned it might understand on low traction surfaces, but I don't know how that translates to daily driving

Do do duallys drive, steer, and handle?

 

[Trevlaw]

Do do duallys drive, steer, and handle?

Honestly don't know, though I'd assume not that well. Biggest vehicle I've driven is a tacoma...

I do know the 09 F350 dually front axle I have is wide as fuck.

Maybe I should just make or buy some 2.5" spacers for the rear to drive around and see what it's like

 

[mrblaine]

Honestly don't know, though I'd assume not that well. Biggest vehicle I've driven is a tacoma...

I do know the 09 F350 dually front axle I have is wide as fuck.

Maybe I should just make or buy some 2.5" spacers for the rear to drive around and see what it's like

If there were issues with how they rode, drove, or steered, the internet would be rife with that info. It isn't because they drive just like normal vehicles. The only issue is one of paying attention to the track of the inside rear tire and keeping it off of curbs.

 

[Trevlaw]

Are you just planning on running a full-sized 8.8? I mean that isn't a terrible idea to help with your packaging issues back there. Be cool to match that with a wider front axle for some trackwidth gains and plenty of room for suspension stuff.

Not really. Was thinking I could pull the super 88 kit out, sell it. Cut off the axle ends, make some sleeve adapters to mount some 99-04 SD unit bearing ends and convert it to a wider full float axle while centering the pinion in the process. Machine and redrill the SD unit bearings to 5 on 5.5, buy new wheels with higher backspacing to make up for the adapters I'd need in the front. Haven't figured out brakes, but I feel like I remember seeing that explorer or jk brakes could be set up with the unit bearing ends a while ago

 

[Trevlaw]

If there were issues with how they rode, drove, or steered, the internet would be rife with that info. It isn't because they drive just like normal vehicles. The only issue is one of paying attention to the track of the inside rear tire and keeping it off of curbs.

Well that's good to hear. I thought the relationship between the two axles had some effect on the turning radius, but maybe not.

If it will drive normally that's all I really need, though would you think it would drive exactly the same or will there be some difference's?

 

[pc1p]

Not really. Was thinking I could pull the super 88 kit out, sell it. Cut off the axle ends, make some sleeve adapters to mount some 99-04 SD unit bearing ends and convert it to a wider full float axle while centering the pinion in the process. Machine and redrill the SD unit bearings to 5 on 5.5, buy new wheels with higher backspacing to make up for the adapters I'd need in the front. Haven't figured out brakes, but I feel like I remember seeing that explorer or jk brakes could be set up with the unit bearing ends a while ago

Seems like a metric fuck ton of work for a 65" axle...

Seems like you could pull the locker, install it in a full-size 8.8 and not have to worry about the lug pattern. I know a guy that matched a full-size 8.8 with D44HP front end and it worked really well for him (YJ on 37"s and 12" coilovers)

 

[Trevlaw]

Seems like a metric fuck ton of work for a 65" axle...

Seems like you could pull the locker, install it in a full-size 8.8 and not have to worry about the lug pattern. I know a guy that matched a full-size 8.8 with D44HP front end and it worked really well for him (YJ on 37"s and 12" coilovers)

Seems like the same amount of work to me, except I've gotta setup gears instead of doing some basic machine work in my spare time.

I'm no fan of this POS axle, but to me it seems like any other option leaves me building a whole new axle and leaving me with an expensive paperweight that nobody wants to buy. This way would at least fix all of that and leave me with a wider axle that will almost bolt in to a factory TJ suspension or a mid arm that actually has some resale value