Issues with wheel adapters and lug nuts

TrueMainiac

TrueMainiac

New Member
Joined
Feb 12, 2019
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2
Location
Oreland, PA
I just bought a manual 2006 Rubicon Unlimited with 90k miles (No rust!). The Jeep already had a 2 inch coil spacer lift and 17” JK rims with a 1.5 inch spacer adapter. The front was still rubbing on hard turns ( has 285 17R 70 KO2’s) so I ordered new 2 inch spacer/adapters. The shop took off the back tires and told me 3 studs on each side only had about 2 or 3 turns of the lug nut....not safe. Wondering if prior owner might have shortened the lug bolts to make the spacer fit...I want to put new lugs all around, but want to ensure I buy the right size. Suggestions? What I have read makes me believe I should not be having issues with stock lug bolt lengths with my spacer, but want other opinions. Thank you.
 
Are they wheel spacers or wheel adapters? For instance, I know you have to have an adapter to convert to a JK lug pattern (I have them on mine), but did someone add a spacer on top of that adapter that's causing the lugs to be too short?

My JK wheel adapters have studs that are plenty long.

I feel like some photos might help in this case if you could take some.
 
Chris said:
Are they wheel spacers or wheel adapters? For instance, I know you have to have an adapter to convert to a JK lug pattern (I have them on mine), but did someone add a spacer on top of that adapter that's causing the lugs to be too short?

My JK wheel adapters have studs that are plenty long.

I feel like some photos might help in this case if you could take some.
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I will have to get pictures tomorrow. Is still in shop. The adapter studs are not the problem, but the studs on the Jeep itself. I had read the rubicon studs may be different as well from normal TJ’s....
 
TrueMainiac said:
I will have to get pictures tomorrow. Is still in shop. The adapter studs are not the problem, but the studs on the Jeep itself. I had read the rubicon studs may be different as well from normal TJ’s....
Click to expand...

That's what I meant - have the shop change the studs on the jeep to studs that will work with your adapters.
 
TrueMainiac said:
I just bought a manual 2006 Rubicon Unlimited with 90k miles (No rust!). The Jeep already had a 2 inch coil spacer lift and 17” JK rims with a 1.5 inch spacer adapter. The front was still rubbing on hard turns ( has 285 17R 70 KO2’s) so I ordered new 2 inch spacer/adapters. The shop took off the back tires and told me 3 studs on each side only had about 2 or 3 turns of the lug nut....not safe. Wondering if prior owner might have shortened the lug bolts to make the spacer fit...I want to put new lugs all around, but want to ensure I buy the right size. Suggestions? What I have read makes me believe I should not be having issues with stock lug bolt lengths with my spacer, but want other opinions. Thank you.
Click to expand...
I had an '06 Rubicon previously owned that had wheel spacers, and the PO had replaced the axle shafts in the rear Dana 44 axle, but apparently used non-Rubicon axle shafts, if that is possible. What I was told by a shop is that the drum brake Dana 44 shafts use shorter wheel studs than the disk brake Rubicon shafts...I never did confirm that they are actually different like that, but in that case, the wheel studs did not work well with the wheel spacers on that Rubi, some threads on the nuts holding the spacers to the wheel hubs were still showing...

@mrblaine, can you confirm or deny that the rear axle shafts are different as far as wheel stud length on a drum brake Dana 44 vs. on a disk brake Rubicon Dana 44?
 
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glwood said:
I had an '06 Rubicon previously owned that had wheel spacers, and the PO had replaced the axle shafts in the rear Dana 44 axle, but apparently used non-Rubicon axle shafts, if that is possible. What I was told by a shop is that the drum brake Dana 44 shafts use shorter wheel studs than the disk brake Rubicon shafts...I never did confirm that they are actually different like that, but in that case, the wheel studs did not work well with the wheel spacers on that Rubi, some threads on the lug nuts were still showing...

@mrblaine, can you confirm or deny that the rear axle shafts are different as far as wheel stud length on a drum brake Dana 44 vs. on a disk brake Rubicon Dana 44?
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Disc brake wheel studs are longer.
 
TrueMainiac said:
I just bought a manual 2006 Rubicon Unlimited with 90k miles (No rust!). The Jeep already had a 2 inch coil spacer lift and 17” JK rims with a 1.5 inch spacer adapter. The front was still rubbing on hard turns ( has 285 17R 70 KO2’s) so I ordered new 2 inch spacer/adapters. The shop took off the back tires and told me 3 studs on each side only had about 2 or 3 turns of the lug nut....not safe. Wondering if prior owner might have shortened the lug bolts to make the spacer fit...I want to put new lugs all around, but want to ensure I buy the right size. Suggestions? What I have read makes me believe I should not be having issues with stock lug bolt lengths with my spacer, but want other opinions. Thank you.
Click to expand...
So I just put spacers on and they used nuts to mount spacer to hub. Not sure what lug nuts have to do with your problem since they mount wheel to spacer. If lug nuts don’t go on 8 turns then the spacers are not designed right, especially if only a few are too short.
 
Pdest said:
So I just put spacers on and they used nuts to mount spacer to hub. Not sure what lug nuts have to do with your problem since they mount wheel to spacer. If lug nuts don’t go on 8 turns then the spacers are not designed right, especially if only a few are too short.
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I'd like to see a bit more than 8. 8 is just enough under a 1/2" of thread engagement to worry me. I'd like to see at least 10 turns to be safe. 10 turns is only 1/2" of engagement and the recommended engagement is to have the depth equal the diameter. In this case the diameter is 1/2-20 or 20 threads per inch so 10 would get you there.
 
I use a 1 1/4 wheel adapter for my JK wheels with no problems one thing I do caution is to make sure the adapters are "Hub Centric" this allows the hub to support the wheel instead of the lug nuts. I had to order rings to fit my DC wheels but all is snugged up. Good Luck
 
Bamacon said:
I use a 1 1/4 wheel adapter for my JK wheels with no problems one thing I do caution is to make sure the adapters are "Hub Centric" this allows the hub to support the wheel instead of the lug nuts. I had to order rings to fit my DC wheels but all is snugged up. Good Luck
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No, the hubcentric part does not support the wheel instead of the lug nuts. The pilot centers the wheel until the lugs are tightened and then they work in conjunction with each other to do the job. The pilot never really comes into play unless the lugs work loose.
 
My disc brake 44 had short studs. The solution was Dorman 610-449 lugs from rock auto. These are Dana 30 studs and will be the same length as the front when installed in the rear axles. I guess our Jeeps were built on Saturday. With acorn style lugs most people don't know or care the length of their wheel studs. Did a write up of it on the other forum "Short stock rear Dana 44 wheel studs"
 
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pagrey said:
My disc brake 44 had short studs. The solution was Dorman 610-449 lugs from rock auto. These are Dana 30 studs and will be the same length as the front when installed in the rear axles. I guess our Jeeps were built on Saturday. With acorn style lugs most people don't know or care the length of their wheel studs. Did a write up of it on the other forum "Short stock rear Dana 44 wheel studs"
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I'd guess that someone swapped in some different axle shafts. I don't see the factory making that mistake.
 
mrblaine said:
I'd guess that someone swapped in some different axle shafts. I don't see the factory making that mistake.
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The solution is all that matters. Both Mopar and Dorman list the short stud as the replacement for my studs, Dorman 610-234 and Mopar 4762841. This is for my 2004 LJ which only came from the factory with disc brakes and a 44. I guess my example, Chrysler and Dorman are confused. I see the factory saving money or just plain lazy and using the wrong studs, after all they work fine with the acorn nuts.

Edit: more I think about it the short studs make sense from a production standpoint, the short studs work with both and so they can have just one Dana 44 on hand for both setups. If they put long studs in the 44 it wouldn't work in a drum brake Jeep so it would have to be swapped or sit.

And by the way, this probably is a totally isolated incident and could be due to axle shafts that were broken on mine. I did buy it really young and did remove the wheels for what I though was the first time but you've seen about a million more of these.

Edit edit: and replace both axle shafts? Nevermind, just talking to myself at this point.
 
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mrblaine said:
I'd like to see a bit more than 8. 8 is just enough under a 1/2" of thread engagement to worry me. I'd like to see at least 10 turns to be safe. 10 turns is only 1/2" of engagement and the recommended engagement is to have the depth equal the diameter. In this case the diameter is 1/2-20 or 20 threads per inch so 10 would get you there.
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I understand what you are saying and intuitively it makes sense. However, I believe the documented Jeep specs say 8 turns.
 
mrblaine said:
I'd like to see a bit more than 8. 8 is just enough under a 1/2" of thread engagement to worry me. I'd like to see at least 10 turns to be safe. 10 turns is only 1/2" of engagement and the recommended engagement is to have the depth equal the diameter. In this case the diameter is 1/2-20 or 20 threads per inch so 10 would get you there.
Click to expand...

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Pdest said:
I understand what you are saying and intuitively it makes sense. However, I believe the documented Jeep specs say 8 turns.
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http://www.mcgard.com/customer-service/installationremoval/
https://www.moderntiredealer.com/ar...efresh-your-knowledge-of-this-serious-subject
http://www.prestigewheel.com/Catalog/Do_Donts.pdf
https://www.autoserviceprofessional...g-the-nuts-and-bolts-of-wheel-clamping?Page=3

I dug around a fair bit and the only exception to the diameter = thread engagement is Prestige who wants to see 10 turns which is correct for 1/2" but not any larger.

I would for my personal uses be okay with anything more than 6 since I understand how fasteners work. I would never tell anyone else to do it that way.
 
mrblaine said:
I'd guess that someone swapped in some different axle shafts. I don't see the factory making that mistake.
Click to expand...
I just purchased the American made Revolution axle shaft for my 04 Rubicon, installed lug bolts with red loctite and went to install only to find out the wheel studs they sent are too long to work with the Spidertrax hub centric 1.25"spacers. The bolts are 2" and i need 1.75". Revolution says they have never had that problem and told me to go to any auto parts store and pick up shorter ones or just cut them off?? Nobody has a bolt like the one they sent! Now i am trying to track down some thin head lug bolts 1.75" and having a heck of a time finding them. has anyone else had this issue?
 
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