Pilot Bearing vs Pilot Bushing

Squatch

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I just finished doing a clutch job in my son's Chevy S10, and after removing the Oilite pilot bushing, I was surprised to find that the clutch kit contained a needle bearing replacement. While it nagged at me to do so, I installed the bearing in the end of the crank. Later that night, I found this site that cautioned against using a bearing where the bushing was once used:

https://www.crankshaftcoalition.com/wiki/Pilot_bearing_and_bushings

So, I decided to remove the bearing, and tried to find another Oilite bushing. As this vehicle was in a space that needed to be opened back up in a hurry, I did not have the luxury of ordering one online, but instead had to rely on the local parts stores. I found only three available (same chain), and picked one up. To my dismay, it was not Oilite at all, and had a high iron content (a magnet proved it). Being stuck between a rock and a hard place, I installed the bushing, greased the interior hole, and finished the clutch install.

My question here is twofold. First, does the TJ's 4.0 have a bushing or a bearing? When the time comes to do the clutch in my '98, I want to be sure and have the correct arrangement beforehand.

Secondly, what do you guys think? Did I screw the pooch by installing an inferior bushing in my son's truck, or do you think the likelihood of an issue developing is fairly minimal? Should I have used the bearing, instead? The input shaft on his truck was in good shape. Not great shape, to where I think a bearing would have been all that happy riding on it, but generally good shape. I did lube the replacement bushing, but I am uncertain just how much clearance the input shaft has between it and the bushing, and I wonder if I will have to worry about galling of the shaft. The truck has 224,000 miles on its 2.2 engine, so its continued life expectancy is somewhat in question, already. However, my son doesn't put that many miles on his vehicle in a year. Am I worrying over nothing?

If faced with the same situation on your TJ, what would you have done? Like I said earlier, I want to have the correct parts on hand when I do the clutch on mine, but I don't even know which it runs, at this point. Oh, and btw, I've noticed a lot of companies that refer to the bushing as a bearing. Is that a correct reference? Inquiring minds want to know!

Thanks, all.
Squatch
 
My TJ had a pilot bearing. It seized, and took out the input shaft.


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Here is how the bearing came out.

image-20170507_093639-jpg.jpg


As far as your situation, I probably would have run the bearing, but for no reason than I generally think bearings are superior to bushings. But they have been using bushings in transmission pilots for a long time, so hopefully your be fine.

I'm actually surprised you found that much variation in the parts you can put in...
 
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I just finished doing a clutch job in my son's Chevy S10, and after removing the Oilite pilot bushing, I was surprised to find that the clutch kit contained a needle bearing replacement. While it nagged at me to do so, I installed the bearing in the end of the crank. Later that night, I found this site that cautioned against using a bearing where the bushing was once used:

https://www.crankshaftcoalition.com/wiki/Pilot_bearing_and_bushings

So, I decided to remove the bearing, and tried to find another Oilite bushing. As this vehicle was in a space that needed to be opened back up in a hurry, I did not have the luxury of ordering one online, but instead had to rely on the local parts stores. I found only three available (same chain), and picked one up. To my dismay, it was not Oilite at all, and had a high iron content (a magnet proved it). Being stuck between a rock and a hard place, I installed the bushing, greased the interior hole, and finished the clutch install.

My question here is twofold. First, does the TJ's 4.0 have a bushing or a bearing? When the time comes to do the clutch in my '98, I want to be sure and have the correct arrangement beforehand.

Secondly, what do you guys think? Did I screw the pooch by installing an inferior bushing in my son's truck, or do you think the likelihood of an issue developing is fairly minimal? Should I have used the bearing, instead? The input shaft on his truck was in good shape. Not great shape, to where I think a bearing would have been all that happy riding on it, but generally good shape. I did lube the replacement bushing, but I am uncertain just how much clearance the input shaft has between it and the bushing, and I wonder if I will have to worry about galling of the shaft. The truck has 224,000 miles on its 2.2 engine, so its continued life expectancy is somewhat in question, already. However, my son doesn't put that many miles on his vehicle in a year. Am I worrying over nothing?

If faced with the same situation on your TJ, what would you have done? Like I said earlier, I want to have the correct parts on hand when I do the clutch on mine, but I don't even know which it runs, at this point. Oh, and btw, I've noticed a lot of companies that refer to the bushing as a bearing. Is that a correct reference? Inquiring minds want to know!

Thanks, all.
Squatch
The article you linked to is correct. The input shaft hardness isn’t correct for a bearing, needs an oilite bushing. What’s going to happen is the input shaft will begin brinelling and eventually the input shaft won’t stop spinning when you disengage the clutch. The first symptoms will be difficulty putting it in gear and eventually grinding every time you shift. Those steel pilot bushings are bad news.
 
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The article you linked to is correct. The input shaft hardness isn’t correct for a bearing, needs an oilite bushing. What’s going to happen is the input shaft will begin brinelling and eventually the input shaft won’t stop spinning when you disengage the clutch. The first symptoms will be difficulty putting it in gear and eventually grinding every time you shift. Those steel pilot bushings are bad news.
Oy. Well, we'll just have to see how it plays out, I guess. Maybe I'll pick up an Oilite bushing, and toward the end of the summer when I have some time off, I'll drop the tranny again and swap out the pilot bushing. For now, I'd like a break from laying under that truck. Did the clutch, rear main seal, and oil pan gasket. My son was quite amused by removing the original bushing with an English muffin, and the bearing using a spinach tortilla shell. :) I told him that old guys know shit. ;)
 
Wait!
Can I hear more about this?
5/8" diameter inside hole dimension. Pack it full of some sort bread product, get a bolt that will pass through the hole, and smack the bolt with a hammer. Keep packing it until the bread forces the bushing or bearing out onto the bolt. Works like a charm!
 
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Oy. Well, we'll just have to see how it plays out, I guess. Maybe I'll pick up an Oilite bushing, and toward the end of the summer when I have some time off, I'll drop the tranny again and swap out the pilot bushing. For now, I'd like a break from laying under that truck. Did the clutch, rear main seal, and oil pan gasket. My son was quite amused by removing the original bushing with an English muffin, and the bearing using a spinach tortilla shell. :) I told him that old guys know shit. ;)
Waste of time, it’s an s10 and probably won’t be on the road in 10 years when it might fail, key word is might!
 
I used a pilot bearing from National in my TJ clutch replacement. The Luk clutch came with a pilot bearing as well. I bought 2 of the National ones in case I screwed it up but I the first went in fine.

I know the clutch wasn't the original but the PO said he didn't change the bearing when he did the clutch. Since he was the original owner, that pilot bearing was the original with 197k miles. It was in perfect condition when I took it out.
 
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I used a pilot bearing from National in my TJ clutch replacement. The Luk clutch came with a pilot bearing as well. I bought 2 of the National ones in case I screwed it up but I the first went in fine.

I know the clutch wasn't the original but the PO said he didn't change the bearing when he did the clutch. Since he was the original owner, that pilot bearing was the original with 197k miles. It was in perfect condition when I took it out.
I pulled the original bushing on the S10 without even thinking about that I might not be able to get a quality replacement. Had I known then what I know now, I likely would have just left the original in there. Oh, well. Such is life.
 
Many times the choice depends upon the o.d. and i.d. of the pilot hole. Many engine/ trans are bolted up with little r&d. If there is no room for a bearing to fit, use a bushing. Wear on input shaft should last till past warentee. Given a choice I like a bushing. Little to fail. Lasts twice as long.
Either should last as long as a typical clutch, but some can make a clutch last 300,000 miles and more. Starting to babble...go bushing if you get a choice. Can always make your own.
 
Many times the choice depends upon the o.d. and i.d. of the pilot hole. Many engine/ trans are bolted up with little r&d. If there is no room for a bearing to fit, use a bushing. Wear on input shaft should last till past warentee. Given a choice I like a bushing. Little to fail. Lasts twice as long.
Either should last as long as a typical clutch, but some can make a clutch last 300,000 miles and more. Starting to babble...go bushing if you get a choice. Can always make your own.
I also believe that a bushing would be preferable. Fewer parts to fail, as you noted. Thanks for the input!
 
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Many times the choice depends upon the o.d. and i.d. of the pilot hole. Many engine/ trans are bolted up with little r&d. If there is no room for a bearing to fit, use a bushing. Wear on input shaft should last till past warentee. Given a choice I like a bushing. Little to fail. Lasts twice as long.
Either should last as long as a typical clutch, but some can make a clutch last 300,000 miles and more. Starting to babble...go bushing if you get a choice. Can always make your own.
most never check the axial or radial position either, 0.004" or less to keep everything quiet...
 
5/8" diameter inside hole dimension. Pack it full of some sort bread product, get a bolt that will pass through the hole, and smack the bolt with a hammer. Keep packing it until the bread forces the bushing or bearing out onto the bolt. Works like a charm!
That's awesome. I always just used axle grease, next time I'm gonna hit the fridge & one up you.
 
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The bread trick isn't as messy as using grease, which is why I do it. It also cleans out of the hole in the end of the crankshaft quite easily, which is a plus. :)
Maybe next time I'll shove a Cobb salad in there and see what happens.
 
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Use pepperoni and it will help lube the hole for easier bushing/bearing install. Plus makes every clutch engagement smell like lunchtime! 😊
 
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