What makes a good shock for an outboard?

[jjvw]

That puts things in perspective, much appreciated.

That means I need to figure out my spare tire situation first. And figure out my trail carry situation second.


I seemingly recall you mentioning in another thread, that you dropped your tire carrier bumper after the outboard, which changed your travel bias. Did you end up restoring it back to 50/50?

And you mention the 50/50 configuration, is that based on build philosopy or the position of the flutter stacks?

Enough has changed between then and now that both ends are within a fraction of an inch from 50/50. That includes moving and raising my rear upper spring seats during the initial rear outboard as high as possible to allow the use of spacers to adjust the ride height after sizable weight changes. My guess/recollection is that I changed the rear to a thinner spacer after removing the huge weight of the old bumper and tire carrier.

50/50 is part of a build philosophy that values up travel for both rig stability and to give the shock valving time and distance to work properly.

Within reason, the flutter doesn't know or care where in the travel bias it is. It still does what it does wherever there is a change in piston direction. What does matter in the travel bias is the main valving. On a 12" shock, 6" of up travel can be valved lighter than 2" of up travel because the longer travel gives the valving more distance and time to slow the piston travel speed before full compression. Less travel distance would require additional damping to prevent the shock from crashing into full compression.

 

[jjvw]

I wasn’t planning on outboarding until I after my axles were built and new 35s.

However, I am very disappointed in the Black Maxes I got for the rear. The valving feels horrible compared to the front 5000X, every speed bump the rear gets blown through hard.

It’s now also very clear how limited the travel is in the rear, though this hasn’t been a particular problem for me yet.

I did the outboard when I had 33s. While it was well worth the effort, I got lucky in a few areas of the tower placement that there wasn't more interference with the change to a larger and wider tire.

 

[bluescapegoat]

Are you folks adapting the Poly Performance mounts for the front as well, or what's the move there?

nvm, just found this thread.

 

[GTTJ]

Enough has changed between then and now that both ends are within a fraction of an inch from 50/50. That includes moving and raising my rear upper spring seats during the initial rear outboard as high as possible to allow the use of spacers to adjust the ride height after sizable weight changes. My guess/recollection is that I changed the rear to a thinner spacer after removing the huge weight of the old bumper and tire carrier.

Did you make the change to the spring seat location and then figure out what spacer you needed to get the ride height back where you wanted it? Or, can I try and measure the move and get close enough?

 

[tworley]

Are you folks adapting the Poly Performance mounts for the front as well, or what's the move there?

nvm, just found this thread.

Poly mounts work well
https://www.polyperformance.com/fab...y-performance-universal-tj-lj-shock-mount-kit

 

[jjvw]

Did you make the change to the spring seat location and then figure out what spacer you needed to get the ride height back where you wanted it? Or, can I try and measure the move and get close enough?

I shaved the seat down to fit as high up into the arch as it could. The round portion is touching the frame rail on both ends. There is enough variety in thin spacers that getting the ride height has not been a problem.

 

[bluescapegoat]

I shaved the seat down to fit as high up into the arch as it could. The round portion is touching the frame rail on both ends. There is enough variety in thin spacers that getting the ride height has not been a problem.

I just ran mine up to full bump for the first time with the mid arms a couple days ago and was initially pretty bummed when the arms hit the floor before the bump stops then kind of ran through that in my head and figured spacers were a totally legit way to handle it, vs cutting the perches back off. I never gave it much thought when I was locating them initially.

Then again I'm not beyond clearancing the floor in the future, either.

 

[jjvw]

I just ran mine up to full bump for the first time with the mid arms a couple days ago and was initially pretty bummed when the arms hit the floor before the bump stops then kind of ran through that in my head and figured spacers were a totally legit way to handle it, vs cutting the perches back off. I never gave it much thought when I was locating them initially.

Then again I'm not beyond clearancing the floor in the future, either.

For the mid arms, it is a given that the step in the rear foot well needs to be dented. On mine, I just lifted the entire rear end up by the axle and hit the tub deform around the upper arms.

 

[bluescapegoat]

For the mid arms, it is a given that the step in the rear foot well needs to be dented. On mine, I just lifted the entire rear end up by the axle and hit the tub deform around the upper arms.

Interesting, I thought the idea behind Blaine's placement was that the floor shouldn't interfere. Anyway as it sits my short-arm paired RS9000XLs in the stock locations compress fully about when the arms make contact with the tub floor so I just bump stopped for that.

But when I do the outboard I'll do whatever clearancing needs done. I've simply run out of time and have a trip coming up, so regular inboard shocks for now.

 

[jjvw]

Interesting, I thought the idea behind Blaine's placement was that the floor shouldn't interfere. Anyway as it sits my short-arm paired RS9000XLs in the stock locations compress fully about when the arms make contact with the tub floor so I just bump stopped for that.

But when I do the outboard I'll do whatever clearancing needs done. I've simply run out of time and have a trip coming up, so regular inboard shocks for now.

Shouldn't interfere with the frame mounts. The rear upper arms denting the floor a bit has been known since I installed one of the very first Savvy kits in 2016. Blaine certainly knew about it years before that when building his own versions.

 

[bluescapegoat]

Shouldn't interfere with the frame mounts. The rear upper arms denting the floor a bit has been known since I installed one of the very first Savvy kits in 2017.

So are you saying the weight of the Jeep was enough to just self-clearance without tweaking anything else? I figured I'd need to take a sledge to it or cut them out and cope in some tube all sexy-like

-sorry for taking the thread off topic

 

[jjvw]

So are you saying the weight of the Jeep was enough to just self-clearance without tweaking anything else? I figured I'd need to take a sledge to it or cut them out and cope in some tube all sexy-like

-sorry for taking the thread off topic

Correct. The weight of the tub and frame dropped with a floor jack is enough to make room for 6"+ of up travel from ride height on a 4" spring lift.

 

[psrivats]

Shouldn't interfere with the frame mounts. The rear upper arms denting the floor a bit has been known since I installed one of the very first Savvy kits in 2016.

These photos have been floating around forever, I think of it no different to denting the tub a bit for the tuck with the Savvy underarmor.

 

[bluescapegoat]

These photos have been floating around forever, I think of it no different to denting the tub a bit for the tuck with the Savvy underarmor.

View attachment 447855

View attachment 447856

I've got plenty of clearance directly above the mount, that's not where the contact is. At full compression the arms run uphill to the rear axle so it contacts further back on the tub.

Here's a still from a video I took. That's with it sitting on the original Currie 4" SA lift bump stops plus an additional hockey puck (with the perches moved flush to the top of the arch), or otherwise at what would be full compression on a properly sized short-arm paired inboard shock.

I'm really looking forward to doing this outboard. So much more potential

 

[psrivats]

I've got plenty of clearance directly above the mount, that's not where the contact is. At full compression the arms run uphill to the rear axle so it contacts further back on the tub.

Here's a still from a video I took. That's with it sitting on the original Currie 4" SA lift bump stops plus an additional hockey puck (with the perches moved flush to the top of the arch), or otherwise at what would be full compression on a properly sized short-arm paired inboard shock.

I'm really looking forward to doing this outboard.

Oh, interesting. This I was not aware of.

 

[jjvw]

One thing I can tell you is that the area to be dented is double walled. The deformation barely transfers into the passenger compartment under the carpet. And if you have a proper 1.25" body lift like BMB or Savvy, then that deformation will be a bit less than mine done at the time with a squishy JKS body lift.

 

[psrivats]

One thing I can tell you is that the area to be dented is double walled. The deformation barely transfers into the passenger compartment. And if you have a proper 1.25" body lift like BMB or Savvy, then that deformation will be a bit less than mine done at the time with a squishy JKS body lift.

JKS is the gift that seems to keep on giving. During install, post install, post install over time ...

 

[jjvw]

JKS is the gift that seems to keep on giving. During install, post install, post install over time ...

The more one learns about how things work, the more idiotic some things become.

 

[bluescapegoat]

JKS is the gift that seems to keep on giving. During install, post install, post install over time ...

I've got one for sale if you're interested in receiving said gift.

j/k I'm not selling that shit to anyone, I have morals. That said, I did sell my Poison Spyder sliders lol

 

[GTTJ]

Since most people do modifications over time and you had to do either the front or the back first, which one would you typically see the most benefit from?

From reading here, it looks like more people outboard the rear than add 11" RR shocks to the front. Is that because the rear is easier or because that's where the most gain is?