4BT vs 1.9 / 2.0 TDI

[Rhonda the jeep]

Another thing to consider with OP's questions about diesel swap is the price of fuel up in Canada. Now I know it can be all over the map for everyone in the US as well, but to make my point I pay $2.09 per litre for 87 octane fuel.

My TJ has the 4cyl and an ALH swap would just about double my fuel mileage so even just doing the swap for fuel cost alone is worth it IMO. Not to mention doubling the torque figures compared to the 4cyl gas engine in mine right now.

Gas price rn is 1.80/L for gas and 1.62/L for diesel and I also have cardlock and diesel is another 40-50cents cheeper at the cardlock

 

[Rhonda the jeep]

Did you regear to run 35" tires ? , explore the possibility of installing a larger gas tank ? I would think 12 mpg could be improved .
Swaps are cool but expensive , have fun with whatever you figure out !

I'm running 4.88s and a larger tank would cover the cost of a motor and trans for a swap not to mention that gas is 20 cents more per litter then diesel

 

[thedustyboot]

Kinda shocking how much of a price difference there is in the same province..... We haven't seen gas below $2/litre for almost a year now

 

[Gilby]

2007 jeep jku rubicon unlimited 4 door, 1.9 brm motor, pd 150 injectors, gtb1756vk turbo, tubular exhaust manifold, stage 4 tuning, ripp intercooler, arp studs, stage 2 cam, malone custom tuning, 37 inch tires 5:13 gears, 6 speed .
have over 35k on this build easy in my jeep and drive it daily for work between 4 plants for corporate maintenance people think im crazy driving a jeep on 37s daily but i love it and i will do it all over again i consistantly get 27mpg average and doesnt seem to change no matter how i drive it. i can tell you and anyone that knows me will tell you i am not nice to my vehicles and i beat on them all the time.. at this moment im selling the 1.9 to a friend for his jeep and im doing a 2.0 CR tdi swap and will be over the 300hp range this next build..

i had a 87 jeep yj i p-pump cummins swapped with a 4L80 , 9 inch read dana 44 front, was the funnest being the fastest for sure with all the engine mods but i needed a 4 door so that got sold averaged low 20's mpg

had 2007 jeep jku sahara unlimited 4 door i swapped a 4bt rotary pump tons of mods way to many to list with full one ton drive train and all the metal crossed the scale at 7,300 lbs.... averaged around 24mpg and had well over 40k miles driving a hour one way to work every day, sold it because it was starting to rust from all the winter driving and fun scares over the years.

i can tell you the simplicity of the TDI swap, power to weight ratio, fun factor, heads turning, and consistant mid 20mpg all the time and all my factory gauges work i will always own a TDI jeep i may even build a backup one i dont think i could go without it..

Jeremy,

 

[Gunnersmate]

I am doing a 4 BT swap right now, If you decide on a Cummins here is some info for you
A Cummins P-Pump (7100) Engine CPL No. 1839 is the Holy Grail of the Cummins Motors this is the motor you can really "Turn Up" just remember more Torque and HP Equally Shorter life span and more fuel burn) The CPL 1839 engines are out there but hard to find there is also a chinese version of this motor, they have no electronics. The Engine Electrical System consists of a Battery, Starter, Alternator and Fuel Solenoid. For a manual Transmission a Dodge NV 4500 1500.00 usd or Tremec 4050 about 5000.00 usd (see Quickdraw they have a complete kit for the 4 BT) both the NV 4500 and Tremec 4050 are 5 spds and good options. I am using the Quickdraw Tremec 4050 and a NP 205 transfer case for my swap. The Good Ole interwebs search reports Fuel mileage at about 25/30 mpg
Be prepared diesel swaps are not cheap even if you do all the work yourself. The following are some real world costs that apply to my build
Running 4 BT Cummins 2000 to 10000, if you rebuild it your self plan on another 3000 for Rebuild kit and Machine shop work. (Note be careful selecting a rebuild kit there are some real cheap ones and you get what you pay for
P-Pump Rebuild I ahve budgeted 1500 not sure on real cost
Transmission 1500 to 5000 if you pick up a used NV 4500 you may want to freshen it up More money
Motor mounts Farmstrong Inc. 350.00+/-
Advanced Adapters Transfer Case Adapter Np 205 to Tremec 4050 Part No. 50-0207
Engine to Trans Adapter 450 used 2000 new from cummins see below
Engine to Trans Adapter plate Cummins Part No. Old 3923045
Ebay 450.00
Engine to Tran Adapter plate Cummins Part No. New 3990139
Cummins 2000.00
Fluidampr Performance Damper (960311) for 89-98 6BT & 4BT Cummins 650+/-
NP 205 rebuild kit 200.00
Other stuff that you willl need that I do not know the price
Turbo and Plumbing
Aftercooler
Radiator
Suspension (springs) The 4 Bt is a heavy bitch
Tools Plan on some 3/4 drive and 1/2 drive impacts these engines are assembled by an 800 lb Gorilla with an unlimited supply of White Loc-tite
Welder your either going to need to be able to weld or know someone that can
Gauges I am ditching the Jeep Instruments and going aftermarket (Custom)
RPM can be set up from Alternator or Crankshaft
Fuel Supply, Return, Pickup and Sending Unit and Tank
Driveshafts
Dana 44's
Exhaust
Re-gearing
Hydroboost brakes 1500.00

I would Estimate 20k for my swap: Cummins 4Bt CPL 1839, Complete Overhaul, rebuild P-Pump, New Holset Super30 HX Turbo, New Tremec 4050 and rebuilt NP 205 and necessary brackets, mounts, cooling system, exhaust system, Turbo piping ect, Dana 44 Front Axle already have a Dana 44 in the back.

It can be done cheaper But Cheap shit aint cool and cool shit aint cheap

 

[Gilby]

I am doing a 4 BT swap right now, If you decide on a Cummins here is some info for you
A Cummins P-Pump (7100) Engine CPL No. 1839 is the Holy Grail of the Cummins Motors this is the motor you can really "Turn Up" just remember more Torque and HP Equally Shorter life span and more fuel burn) The CPL 1839 engines are out there but hard to find there is also a chinese version of this motor, they have no electronics. The Engine Electrical System consists of a Battery, Starter, Alternator and Fuel Solenoid. For a manual Transmission a Dodge NV 4500 1500.00 usd or Tremec 4050 about 5000.00 usd (see Quickdraw they have a complete kit for the 4 BT) both the NV 4500 and Tremec 4050 are 5 spds and good options. I am using the Quickdraw Tremec 4050 and a NP 205 transfer case for my swap. The Good Ole interwebs search reports Fuel mileage at about 25/30 mpg
Be prepared diesel swaps are not cheap even if you do all the work yourself. The following are some real world costs that apply to my build
Running 4 BT Cummins 2000 to 10000, if you rebuild it your self plan on another 3000 for Rebuild kit and Machine shop work. (Note be careful selecting a rebuild kit there are some real cheap ones and you get what you pay for
P-Pump Rebuild I ahve budgeted 1500 not sure on real cost
Transmission 1500 to 5000 if you pick up a used NV 4500 you may want to freshen it up More money
Motor mounts Farmstrong Inc. 350.00+/-
Advanced Adapters Transfer Case Adapter Np 205 to Tremec 4050 Part No. 50-0207
Engine to Trans Adapter 450 used 2000 new from cummins see below
Engine to Trans Adapter plate Cummins Part No. Old 3923045
Ebay 450.00
Engine to Tran Adapter plate Cummins Part No. New 3990139
Cummins 2000.00
Fluidampr Performance Damper (960311) for 89-98 6BT & 4BT Cummins 650+/-
NP 205 rebuild kit 200.00
Other stuff that you willl need that I do not know the price
Turbo and Plumbing
Aftercooler
Radiator
Suspension (springs) The 4 Bt is a heavy bitch
Tools Plan on some 3/4 drive and 1/2 drive impacts these engines are assembled by an 800 lb Gorilla with an unlimited supply of White Loc-tite
Welder your either going to need to be able to weld or know someone that can
Gauges I am ditching the Jeep Instruments and going aftermarket (Custom)
RPM can be set up from Alternator or Crankshaft
Fuel Supply, Return, Pickup and Sending Unit and Tank
Driveshafts
Dana 44's
Exhaust
Re-gearing
Hydroboost brakes 1500.00

I would Estimate 20k for my swap: Cummins 4Bt CPL 1839, Complete Overhaul, rebuild P-Pump, New Holset Super30 HX Turbo, New Tremec 4050 and rebuilt NP 205 and necessary brackets, mounts, cooling system, exhaust system, Turbo piping ect, Dana 44 Front Axle already have a Dana 44 in the back.

It can be done cheaper But Cheap shit aint cool and cool shit aint cheap

sounds about right, and extremely close to my build but i went with super 60 front sterling 10.5 rear artec truss kits , because i was concerned the dana 44s may not handle the power and added weight of the cummins, very curious how they do hold up though.

i used a hydro boost out of a astro minivan and adapted the mastercylinder out of the f350 doner axles came from worked amazing.. maybe 400$
also still have a pretty much new Super HX30 turbo laying around that i most likley will never use, great turbo.. very pricey...
to rebuild my p7100 pump last year in my f250 24valve cummins swap truck was 800$ just for refence and it needed all new barrels and everything.

also can say dont skimp on the intercooler, i did and didnt realize how much of a restriction i had till i ordered one From RIPP custom made for my jeep and was literally one of the best upgrades, 785$ for the CORE only.

i ran 3:73, 4:10, ended with 4:30 gears with 37 inch tires with my 4bt with the nv4500/np205 and it was perfect all around gearing and could still run the highway at 70 like it was made for it if curious.

i had 4 inch lift in rear and a total of 7 inch lift progressive in the Front just for reference and it say pretty level with the 4bt thats with winch and steel bumper and some body armor.

i ran all glowshift gauges on the 4bt jeep jku build but only because i bought the jeep burned and the computer and harness were fried, i was pretty impressed with how even the glowshift gps speedo worked great.

just FYI ran 5x14 injectors in my p7100 4bt YJ build, 18 degrees timing , Studs etc.. all the goodies, that motor had so much power i ate 3 hx35 turbos a hy35, and a hx30w with it... the only turbo that lasted on that motor with the power it put down was a super B single 58MM., i never installed the super HX30 turbo on it because the hx30w that came on the motor i over spun and snapped the shaft almost hydrolocking the motor sucking all the oil through the drain pipe from the turbo into the intake, only reason it couldnt run away on me is because the compressor wheel wedged itself into the housing blocking all the intake air. i ran hx35w with 12cm housings on my p7100 4bt build and they spooled and ran great. the 45psi wastegate on the super b single was a big bonus though on the road over the hx35.

sorry i dont post much or visit forums at all normally so hope some info was helpful , just thought it was interesting and thought would join for a bit.

 

[Gunnersmate]

sounds about right, and extremely close to my build but i went with super 60 front sterling 10.5 rear artec truss kits , because i was concerned the dana 44s may not handle the power and added weight of the cummins, very curious how they do hold up though.

i used a hydro boost out of a astro minivan and adapted the mastercylinder out of the f350 doner axles came from worked amazing.. maybe 400$
also still have a pretty much new Super HX30 turbo laying around that i most likley will never use, great turbo.. very pricey...
to rebuild my p7100 pump last year in my f250 24valve cummins swap truck was 800$ just for refence and it needed all new barrels and everything.

also can say dont skimp on the intercooler, i did and didnt realize how much of a restriction i had till i ordered one From RIPP custom made for my jeep and was literally one of the best upgrades, 785$ for the CORE only.

i ran 3:73, 4:10, ended with 4:30 gears with 37 inch tires with my 4bt with the nv4500/np205 and it was perfect all around gearing and could still run the highway at 70 like it was made for it if curious.

i had 4 inch lift in rear and a total of 7 inch lift progressive in the Front just for reference and it say pretty level with the 4bt thats with winch and steel bumper and some body armor.

i ran all glowshift gauges on the 4bt jeep jku build but only because i bought the jeep burned and the computer and harness were fried, i was pretty impressed with how even the glowshift gps speedo worked great.

just FYI ran 5x14 injectors in my p7100 4bt YJ build, 18 degrees timing , Studs etc.. all the goodies, that motor had so much power i ate 3 hx35 turbos a hy35, and a hx30w with it... the only turbo that lasted on that motor with the power it put down was a super B single 58MM., i never installed the super HX30 turbo on it because the hx30w that came on the motor i over spun and snapped the shaft almost hydrolocking the motor sucking all the oil through the drain pipe from the turbo into the intake, only reason it couldnt run away on me is because the compressor wheel wedged itself into the housing blocking all the intake air. i ran hx35w with 12cm housings on my p7100 4bt build and they spooled and ran great. the 45psi wastegate on the super b single was a big bonus though on the road over the hx35.

sorry i dont post much or visit forums at all normally so hope some info was helpful , just thought it was interesting and thought would join for a bit.

My Dana 44 Front Axle Donor is from a 70's era Ford, it is the HD High Pinion Dana 44 that takes the Thicker Axle Tubes same as a Dana 60 other than the Ring and pinion you can use Dana 60 inner and outer axles along with the Knuckles. This particular axle came from a US Forest Service Snow Plow Truck
What year Astro Van did you get the Hydro Boost from

 

[Gunnersmate]

Here is a Link to my build if your interested
PM if your interested in or have any questions
https://wranglertjforum.com/threads/2004-jeep-tj.44387/

 

[Gilby]

My Dana 44 Front Axle Donor is from a 70's era Ford, it is the HD High Pinion Dana 44 that takes the Thicker Axle Tubes same as a Dana 60 other than the Ring and pinion you can use Dana 60 inner and outer axles along with the Knuckles. This particular axle came from a US Forest Service Snow Plow Truck
What year Astro Van did you get the Hydro Boost from

Ok so yes same front high pinion 44 I had on the front of my yj build with the 4bt, sorry was thinking of the newer jk 44 front, I upgraded that to a j8 axle housing (thicker tube) for my TDI build .. much cheaper than other options..
Good choice on axle.
I believe the hydroboost came out of a 93-94 astro. Had to make mounting plate and modify pin length.

 

[Gunnersmate]

Ok so yes same front high pinion 44 I had on the front of my yj build with the 4bt, sorry was thinking of the newer jk 44 front, I upgraded that to a j8 axle housing (thicker tube) for my TDI build .. much cheaper than other options..
Good choice on axle.
I believe the hydroboost came out of a 93-94 astro. Had to make mounting plate and modify pin length.

Thanks for the Info FYI my Rear Dana 44 came off of an LJ