Poison Spyder Fully Welded Cage
- Thread starter Suunto
- Start date
I think we have different definitions of what a flop is. You can sorta derive a few things from those pics though. A grill hoop to protect the radiator wouldn't have fared very well. The collapse of the right side dash lower shows why you need very good support there and a bent angle stanchion isn't that. If the impact would have been focused at the top of the windshield instead of the grill and front of the rig, the passenger compartment would have been a bunch more compromised.
The single picture that is the most compelling case for why bent angle stanchions are a bad idea is the last one with the blue roll.
If you were in that seat, the way you would brace yourself once the roll started is to shove your feet hard into the floorboard and back into the seat. No one has the sense or wherewithal to pull their legs up so they can brace themselves for impact. Sadly our legs don't bend very well in the direction that lower part of the dash would have forced them to.
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Yeah flop was not the right word, not sure what happen here with this Jeep, but your insight is exactly what I was looking for. So in this case, a tube through the dash have helped to keep the passenger area better protected, based on how most react when bracing for a rollover. You’re right, it never crossed my mind to tuck the legs in the event of a rollover.
My Jeep came with the rock hard bolt in cage and those bent angle stanchions just mount to the firewall with the three dash mounting bolts. I’ve been wanting to change it out for something safer and more structurally sound. A through the dash sport cage is what I am thinking.
A quick search yielded this as what I think is a good starting foundation.
https://swracecars.com/product/10-point-cage-conversion-dom-jeep-tj-1-3-4/
Obviously it will need tweaks and have to be notched and welded in.
Apologies to the original poster for hijacking your thread.
My Jeep came with the rock hard bolt in cage and those bent angle stanchions just mount to the firewall with the three dash mounting bolts. I’ve been wanting to change it out for something safer and more structurally sound. A through the dash sport cage is what I am thinking.
A quick search yielded this as what I think is a good starting foundation.
https://swracecars.com/product/10-point-cage-conversion-dom-jeep-tj-1-3-4/
Obviously it will need tweaks and have to be notched and welded in.
Apologies to the original poster for hijacking your thread.
At the end of the day, it really doesn't matter much. In order to protect the passenger compartment, it will take more than a tube A pillar. The object is to prevent the firewall from moving closer to the B pillar. You want to stop lateral dislocation of the corners of the windshield opening. The only way to do that is with an X through the area below the door bar as a start. We aren't going to do that so the rest is just a "hope it doesn't land on the part we didn't brace" answer.
that's a bad example even by stanchion standards seeing it appears a good foot short of the floor. i'm not seeing a tear but instead what appears to be 2 nicely rounded corners. if that is indeed the case it had no chance of doing much of anything and actually could have contributed to the dash being moved. with no foot the A bar just pushed on the dash frame.
am i seeing that wrong?
You are seeing the same thing I am. The point is would a piece of 3/16" thick bent angle with 1 1/4" legs have done much to slow it down? The angle doesn't see straight down forces, look at the crinkle just past the lower front of the door. The forward part is at the firewall but nearer the opening, it would have tried to bend the angle forward at the bottom of the dash. If it had a constrained foot, it would bend very easily.
obviously it'd have some effect, but the amount is debatable...... b4 it failed......i think it would have bent as you described in this instance,
the tub bent in half is witness to the energy of that impact.
we cannot negate the fact that even this crap held something back, not much by appearance, but the OE support bars and windscreen would have taken that no better.
if one is going to bother, i'm for full length tube A pillars, if they bend, they should bend away from the occupants and toward the firewall. my bend can't move far (3/32") b4 it'll contact existing sheet metal.
the hard part is finding that just enough line. an optimist might be happy as is, while a pessimist could end up top heavy.
Sorta, the optimist believes he can predict the future, the pessimist knows you can't.
I think it'd be interesting to see how the stock cage in the JL (JLU, JT also) would compare to the stock cage in the TJ and the bolt in cages. On my JT (and in the JL/U) the A pillar cage cannot be removed... the windshield is just secured to it. When the windshield is folded, the A pillar and the support hoop is still all in place. I am by no means saying its a great system, but questioning if it's better than the TJ system.
Edit: searching for the structure, the front hoop connects to the tub behind the dash, and does not go to the floor up there either... would that be better to tie in a bar below the dash to the floor, and brace to the B pillar?
Edit: searching for the structure, the front hoop connects to the tub behind the dash, and does not go to the floor up there either... would that be better to tie in a bar below the dash to the floor, and brace to the B pillar?
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I am looking at these as well. Only thing I am curious about is if you would have to remove the whole cage in order to remove the dash (i Just had to do a heater core) and imagine at some point will have to do it again. Is it fairly simple to remove as a welded part without marking up all the dash panels etc? Can you get to your front speaker panel screws?
His pics show the defrost grill trapped by the dash bar. The cage is coming out to pull the dash.
Mr. Blaine reading through all the cage comments, whats your take on best AM weld in.
Never. More so looking for your specific overall opinion on Value of the PSC protection for the cost. Is it worth the money or no? I live in colorado. Lots of stepbacks and some tough trails. Nothing is going to stop rolling down a cliff. Lets say for the majority of falls you would see in Moab. Or a "flop" Is there a different one you would recommend over this one