Another Sloppy Steering Thread

Breto31

Breto31

TJ Enthusiast
Joined
Nov 30, 2020
Messages
398
Location
Kentucky
Hey Everyone! Just got home from a quick trip on the parkway, and I noticed on that my steering seems a little sloppy - maybe wanders is a better term - at higher speeds (like 60+). I don’t get it on the highway much, so I don’t really notice it until I do.... It doesn’t feel unsafe, but definitely forces you to fight the wandering. It feels fine around town. It almost feels like the typical wind resistance/blowing on the highway is exacerbated and the wander is worse from time to time. It’ll drive fine for a half mile, then seems like it’ll pull to one side or the other and you have to get it back on track.

Anyway, it’s an 05, 4.0/6-speed, 4” suspension lift, 33x10.50 BFG KO2, 15x8 steel rims. Here’s some pics of my tie rods/drag link, etc.. just wanted to know if anything jumped out in the pics. I recently did new front upper/lower CA’s and new upper/lower ball joints with an alignment. The only other upgrade done to the front end is a new Spicer U-Joint in the driver side axle shaft.

I just ordered the ZJ tie-rod, tie-rod end, and connector today for that upgrade so that should be here next week.

EDIT: there is some SLIGHT play in the steering wheel each way. Maybe an half-inch to an inch.

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Bluegrass parkway? I just did this with my jeep. Spent about an hour so on this forum and pieced it together. my steering felt "flighty" when was at highway speeds and over bumps on the overpasses.

I checked my castor on the front axle. It was 4 degrees, I moved it to 6 degrees and it helped it out a bit. I have a 3.5" lift. I don't have vibes either. Do you have adjustable uppers?
 
Boomhauer said:
Bluegrass parkway? I just did this with my jeep. Spent about an hour so on this forum and pieced it together. my steering felt "flighty" when was at highway speeds and over bumps on the overpasses.

I checked my castor on the front axle. It was 4 degrees, I moved it to 6 degrees and it helped it out a bit. I have a 3.5" lift. I don't have vibes either. Do you have adjustable uppers?
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Not the Bluegrass. I’m in Owensboro, so it was on the bypass here that runs thru town.

I do have adjustable front uppers/lowers, but like a dummy, I didn’t do enough research and bought the tier 1 from Core 4x4, so they’re not so easy to adjust.
 
First thing to do ASAP is to get rid of that dropped Pitman arm and replace it with the factory non-dropped factory Pitman arm. Your dropped Pitman arm is causing bump steer which is the steering being pushed/bumped left/right as your front suspension moves up/down when driving over bumps/dips on the road.

Your track bar is mounted on the stock non-dropped driver's side mount. When the track bar mount is non-dropped, the Pitman arm must be non-dropped. They must match... both must be dropped or non-dropped. Bump steer is the result when one is dropped and the other is not. No, the alternative answer is not to drop the driver's side tray bar mount.

Dropped Pitman arms were generally always required after a suspension lift was installed on 1995 or older Wranglers but that changed with the introduction of the TJ.

Check your caster and toe-in angles too. Make sure you have at least 5.5 to 6 degrees of Caster angle. I suffer Caster angle will cause steering wander. The more Caster angle the better it will track and the better the steering return-to-center will be too. Improper toe-in will contribute to unsteady steering too.
 
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@Jerry Bransford is it possible that the ZJ tie-rod upgrade might help the wander? I’ll get the drop pitman arm removed ASAP.

I had an alignment done about a month ago when I got the ball joints replaced, but I honestly don’t know if they checked the caster or not. They told me I needed new joints or otherwise the alignment wouldn’t hold.
 
Yeah I have savvy uppers front and rear. Pricey but well worth not having to take them off to adjust angles.

Didn't see your pictures. Jerry has some good advice, I followed his posts and pics and that's how I dialed in my pinion angles. Get rid of the drop pitman arm. Your draglink should be close to parallel with the track bar.
 
Boomhauer said:
Yeah I have savvy uppers front and rear. Pricey but well worth not having to take them off to adjust angles.

Didn't see your pictures. Jerry has some good advice, I followed his posts and pics and that's how I dialed in my pinion angles. Get rid of the drop pitman arm. Your draglink should be close to parallel with the track bar.
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Yea after getting those things in there, I never plan on removing them. I’d pay someone to do it before I do it again myself.

Just ordered a stock pitman arm. So all I need to do is remove the drop-arm, and replace it with the stock one? The existing drag link/hardware will just bolt right up to the new arm?
 
The new ZJ tie rod is only stronger, it won't change the steering feel unless its length is set to a different length. It's length is what determines your toe-in angle. You will need to adjust the drag link's length to be slightly longer after installing the non-dropped Pitman arm.
 
Breto31 said:
Yea after getting those things in there, I never plan on removing them. I’d pay someone to do it before I do it again myself.

Just ordered a stock pitman arm. So all I need to do is remove the drop-arm, and replace it with the stock one? The existing drag link/hardware will just bolt right up to the new arm?
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Yes, just unbolt it and put the new arm in. Use the existing hardware. Spray some PB blaster to help loosen it up and you will need a pitman arm puller to old arm pull out.
 
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Boomhauer said:
Yes, just unbolt it and put the new arm in. Use the existing hardware. Spray some PB blaster to help loosen it up and you will need a pitman arm puller to old arm pull out.
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I actually ordered one today when I ordered my ZJ tie rod, so that’s good news.
 
Jerry Bransford said:
The new ZJ tie rod is only stronger, it won't change the steering feel unless its length is set to a different length. It's length is what determines your toe-in angle. You will need to adjust the drag link's length to be slightly longer after installing the non-dropped Pitman arm.
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Thanks! I may be opening a can of worms, but how do I know what the toe-in angle should be, and what it currently is? I really just want to reduce the wandering. Is this something a basic tire shop would adjust correctly during a standard alignment after I install the new pitman arm and tie-rod?

The wandering is really only “bad” at higher speeds, and it’s not awful, but it’s enough to be annoying when I’m rolling at 55-60. Especially on a narrow backroad.
 
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Breto31 said:
Thanks! I may be opening a can of worms, but how do I know what the toe-in angle should be, and what it currently is? I really just want to reduce the wandering. Is this something a basic tire shop would adjust correctly during a standard alignment after I install the new pitman arm and tie-rod?

The wandering is really only “bad” at higher speeds, and it’s not awful, but it’s enough to be annoying when I’m rolling at 55-60. Especially on a narrow backroad.
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I saw a pic on one of jerry's or Blaine's posts. You take the wheels off and put the jeep on jack stands. With the brake rotors still attached with lugnuts, you put 2 pieces of aluminum square tubing clamped to the rotors. One tube on each side. With the wheel straight, you measure the width and that's how you determine the toe alignment. If I had a picture it will make more sense. Needs to be an 1/8 to 1/16 toe in.

Or go to the alignment shop when you put the tie rod on. Drive it to the shop for alignment. Another thing to consider is your steering box is going bad.
 
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