Death wobble with new steering components

[rasband]

Can anyone please tell me what grease fittings have to do with DW?

For me I don’t believe I ever experienced real DW (nor do most people that seem to describe the “symptoms”), however often people describe front end chatter or shakes as “DW”. So when I see it, I ask about the same misconceptions I had.

In my case of chatter, the boots being low allowed more movement between the various involved linkages which I could feel. Mistakenly I would have described it as the infamous problem of Jeeps when really I just didn’t provide proper maintenance. I also balanced my wheels to eliminate another factor, which I steer people to.

Do you have other things for the OP to check?

 

[04wrangler77]

I’d start with the tire balance (at your on-road PSI), and proceed to greasing the zerk fittings on your front end. The zerk is a grease fitting you can fill.

If I remember right: Pitman to drag link, drag link to passenger knuckle, tie rod to driver knuckle, and both the top and bottom sway bar links. If you pop under there you will see small “nipples” that are called “zerks”. I use Lucas red n tacky to fill those up and noticed a big difference.

If you had true “death wobble” you’d likely need to stop before it could recover.

Pitman to drag, drag link to passenger knuckle, and tie rod to driver knuckle was greased up. However, I dont think I have zeros on on the top or bottom of the sway bar links. Strange. It was the first time DW ever happened to me ever and my heart sank to my stomach. The wheels were batting right and left and the steering wheel/Jeep was completely out of control. I managed to get into the emergency lane and bring it to a stop.

 

[rasband]

Pitman to drag, drag link to passenger knuckle, and tie rod to driver knuckle was greased up. However, I dont think I have zeros on on the top or bottom of the sway bar links. Strange. It was the first time DW ever happened to me ever and my heart sank to my stomach. The wheels were batting right and left and the steering wheel/Jeep was completely out of control. I managed to get into the emergency lane and bring it to a stop.

Sorry, there’s also the ball joints to check. I have zerks on the top of my factory sway links (not the bottom). From there I’d check the tire balance and torque specs in the linkages

 

[04wrangler77]

Sorry, there’s also the ball joints to check. I have zerks on the top of my factory sway links (not the bottom). From there I’d check the tire balance and torque specs in the linkages
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Okay. Thanks for your input and I’ll get back to you guys tomorrow with an update. Wish me luck !!

 

[AndyG]

First , be sure you have correct pressure , 26-28 is optimal . A low tire is essentially an unbalanced tire.

secondly , be sure you don't have a warped rim or something freaky like that .

third, the balance has to be dead on . Big tires, small jeep.


I'd swap back tires with fronts if needed to see if that takes tires out of play .

From there , the above posts are where you need to look ,if anything is loose ,it's going to be all or part of the problem..by that I mean it's typically tires and loose/worn parts ..not always ,but typically.

How much it is of each varies , but if it has DW ,it has enough ,and that's all that matters.

Forget steering stabilizers as far as a cure .

 

[AndyG]

You will be fine .

Just keep an open mind .

It can be one thing whacky, or several things slightly worn working together, or anything in between .

Most of these issues seem to revolve around the track bar and tire balance, and there certainly seems to be a higher percentage of these with rigs running oversized tires.

It's not a specific defect some jeeps have and others don't , it can happen on any vehicle , but tends to happen more on light trucks with straight axles it seems ...but that's a guess on my part.

Just remember , something is setting it off , and if it is speed specific , that means the rotation is allowing something that's out of balance to present itself , and that leads strongly to a tire , wheel or tire wheel combo .

If all else is new and the track bar is secure , focus hard on the tires and wheels.

 

[04wrangler77]

You will be fine .

Just keep an open mind .

It can be one thing whacky, or several things slightly worn working together, or anything in between .

Most of these issues seem to revolve around the track bar and tire balance, and there certainly seems to be a higher percentage of these with rigs running oversized tires.

It's not a specific defect some jeeps have and others don't , it can happen on any vehicle , but tends to happen more on light trucks with straight axles it seems ...but that's a guess on my part.

Just remember , something is setting it off , and if it is speed specific , that means the rotation is allowing something that's out of balance to present itself , and that leads strongly to a tire , wheel or tire wheel combo .

If all else is new and the track bar is secure , focus hard on the tires and wheels.

Hey man thanks a bunch for all your advice. I’ll be getting it looked at later today but for now I have to get into work so I’m sorry to have to cut this short. Wish me luck man and I’ll get back to yaw later tonight !!

 

[JMT]

First. Tire balance. Needs to be perfect on our TJ’s

Second, if that doesn’t work. How old are your tires? They could be out of round. May need new.

 

[04wrangler77]

First. Tire balance. Needs to be perfect on our TJ’s

Second, if that doesn’t work. How old are your tires? They could be out of round. May need new.

I’m going to get them balanced here either tomorrow or Saturday and I really hope that fixes it. Trying to diagnose this issue is so exhausting. As for the tires they have about 75% life left on them. They were bought brand new about a year and a half ago when I got the TJ. How exactly do I go about checking to see if their out of round ?

 

[JMT]

I’m going to get them balanced here either tomorrow or Saturday and I really hope that fixes it. Trying to diagnose this issue is so exhausting. As for the tires they have about 75% life left on them. They were bought brand new about a year and a half ago when I got the TJ. How exactly do I go about checking to see if their out of round ?

Ask the tire tech to check it, not the guy behind the counter, but the actual tech. You’ll want a place that uses a roadforce balancer

 

[S.McArthur]

I dropped my wheels off this morning to swap to a new set of KO2's, I had cheap Mud Claws balanced 3 times and still presenting a drive-line vibration and serious death wobble.
Yesterday evening I measured rotor to rotor (making sure hubs are straight) and got those centered then set toe. One of my wheels was pointing outwards more than the other, my fault, I'm the one that installed the currie currectlync; I should have measured better when installing it.
Centered the axle within 1/4" of each side and re-torqued everything related to steering. Test drove around the hood under 35mph and no issues, steering felt tighter yet still had a slight shake in the wheel.
This morning I thought I'd be able to drive to the tire store and was greeted promptly by DW, turned around and put those wheels in the back of my truck.
I will update this afternoon, but I am betting it's the tires. DW changed as tires were rotated.

 

[AndyG]

I dropped my wheels off this morning to swap to a new set of KO2's, I had cheap Mud Claws balanced 3 times and still presenting a drive-line vibration and serious death wobble.
Yesterday evening I measured rotor to rotor (making sure hubs are straight) and got those centered then set toe. One of my wheels was pointing outwards more than the other, my fault, I'm the one that installed the currie currectlync; I should have measured better when installing it.
Centered the axle within 1/4" of each side and re-torqued everything related to steering. Test drove around the hood under 35mph and no issues, steering felt tighter yet still had a slight shake in the wheel.
This morning I thought I'd be able to drive to the tire store and was greeted promptly by DW, turned around and put those wheels in the back of my truck.
I will update this afternoon, but I am betting it's the tires. DW changed as tires were rotated.

If its speed sensitive... It's most likely going to be the tires.

 

[S.McArthur]

It's most likely going to be the tires

I believe it will be, that's why I've thrown in the towel and dropped $1k on tires. I just picked them up and they look super nice, can't wait to mount them on the Jeep and see the difference.
I still needed to get under there and get all the other stuff straight, if new tires are not the solution, I'm going to the boat docks.

 

[AndyG]

I believe it will be, that's why I've thrown in the towel and dropped $1k on tires. I just picked them up and they look super nice, can't wait to mount them on the Jeep and see the difference.
I still needed to get under there and get all the other stuff straight, if new tires are not the solution, I'm going to the boat docks.

Let us know man , I think you will be amazed at the new rubber. Mine are really smooth.

 

[Jerry Bransford]

I believe it will be, that's why I've thrown in the towel and dropped $1k on tires. I just picked them up and they look super nice, can't wait to mount them on the Jeep and see the difference.
I still needed to get under there and get all the other stuff straight, if new tires are not the solution, I'm going to the boat docks.

Still keep in mind that even with new tires that not all tire shops will get the balance good enough the first or sometimes even the second time. I was at my local Discount Tire shop 3x in one day before they finally relented and spent enough time on my tire balance to get it perfect.

The bigger the tire, the easier it is for even a minor tire balance to cause shimmies and/or DW. Tire shops are used to balancing significantly smaller tires where perfect balance is seldom required like it is on our Jeeps running much bigger tires.

 

[AndyG]

Still keep in mind that even with new tires that not all tire shops will get the balance good enough the first or sometimes even the second time. I was at my local Discount Tire shop 3x in one day before they finally relented and spent enough time on my tire balance to get it perfect.

The bigger the tire, the easier it is for even a minor tire balance to cause shimmies and/or DW. Tire shops are used to balancing significantly smaller tires where perfect balance is seldom required like it is on our Jeeps running much bigger tires.

Well said .

I truly believe the reason we talked about death wobble on this forum as much as we do, is the scale of tire that were putting on such a small vehicle.

Heavier vehicles fight back.

A good example is the death wobble I had on my f250 would not present itself until about 75 or 80 miles per hour... It was track bar related.

I think it took that amount of speed to get whatever imbalance in the tires to generate enough movement.

Man if you're going to have death wobble I promise you you don't want it at 75 or 80 mph.

It seems the equipment that make work easier can cause technicians to trust the equipment and pay less attention , and possibly prevent them from even learning some of the nuances of their trade.

Air tools and speed are a good example of that in the construction industry.

 

[S.McArthur]

Still keep in mind that even with new tires that not all tire shops will get the balance good enough the first or sometimes even the second time. I was at my local Discount Tire shop 3x in one day before they finally relented and spent enough time on my tire balance to get it perfect.

The bigger the tire, the easier it is for even a minor tire balance to cause shimmies and/or DW. Tire shops are used to balancing significantly smaller tires where perfect balance is seldom required like it is on our Jeeps running much bigger tires.

They also put 36psi in them, they are Load C 285/70R17 BFG KO2, I'm assuming 26-28psi is still the sweet spot.
My stabilizer was struck by the tie rod clamp bolt and is leaking, I bought cheap autozone Gabriel one to get by even though the consensus is that should not be the contributing issue.
I will not be returning to Firestone unless I just want a computer print out, the ol tape measure is quite reliable, and they have cause some issues stripping bolts and not checking clearances.

 

[S.McArthur]

New tires on: DW
New stabilizer
Take wheels off, re-measure hubs to see if they are equal. Adjust accordingly; set toe 3/16”; No DW. Seems like going past the 1/8” mark did a little better.
I still can feel some shake when I hit some bigger holes/bumps, but it’s driveable and pleasant. I purposely hit a big bump with 1 wheel and the Jeep recovered on its own, quite nerve racking doing it on purpose.

 

[S.McArthur]

New tires are a crap ton better, rides smooth and quiet, well worth the money.

 

[AndyG]

New tires are a crap ton better, rides smooth and quiet, well worth the money.

If it shakes bad on a hard hit ,I'd really see what the track bar is doing .

I know you have been all over it (and under it)

If it's a rough country track bar , replace the bushings with the OEM replacements o Reilly's sells , the rough country rubber compound is way to soft in my opinion.