Novak Conversions Jeep Wrangler TJ engine mounts

High travel, high clearance & high octane, a streetable adventure LJ story

fixmysix said:
Ooohh. That's the ring that came from the UK. If you can get me dimensions I can dirty fab it to that hose. I think inner ring is all I'll need.
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I actually only have the gas cap and hoses. I have now also ordered the ring to see if that helps (thankfully I was able to get it with 2 day shipping... as long as corona virus doesn't shut down the borders). I can't find a diagram for it but I think the standard hole size is 7/8". I'll let you know once I have it.
 
toximus said:
Thank you! I'm curious what you find out!

  1. https://www.newton-equipment.com/aero-300-filler-cap-model-A36NS1.html
  2. https://www.carbuilder.com/uk/unleaded-insert
  3. https://www.fillernecksupply.com/gas-tank-fuel-filler-hose-transfer-elbow/

I'm considering that this may be a better product for my uses:
https://www.newton-equipment.com/Angled Neck_NewtonEquipment.pdf(With the hard walled angles of this neck I'm curious if I won't need a unleaded insert)
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So I didn't have time to check out that link when I replied the first time, but that looks CA compatible. Based on depth and angle. I'll still check the other one when you get me dimensions.
 
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I added Dynamat Xtreme sound deadening to the fuel cell to quiet the pump and fuel splashing noises. It helped a lot with removing the splashing and squirting sounds but there is still pump noise. I'd say the noise is now tolerable. I still plan to add a cover over the fuel cell and will add another layer of sound deadening to the inside of the cover once I get to that.

20200323_sound-deaden-fuel-cell.jpg
 
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I rigged up a remote filler neck. I was able to place the gas cap further forward so that the window isn't blocked when looking in the blind spot. The downside is that means the driver's seat can't fully recline. I tested it with a gas can and it worked well. Next I'll test it at the station pump before committing a hole in my window.

20200324_filler-neck-mockup.jpg
 
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toximus said:
I rigged up a remote filler neck. I was able to place the gas cap further forward so that the window isn't blocked when looking in the blind spot. The downside is that means the driver's seat can't fully recline. I tested it with a gas can and it worked well. Next I'll test it at the station pump before committing a hole in my window.

View attachment 148307
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What happened to your side mirror?
 
The gas station pump filled 8 gallons for a total of roughly 13 gallons in the cell and then gas puked out the filler neck. I checked the fuel line and there's room for another ~8 gallons (roughly 6" from the top) so I don't think it was simply overflowing.

I noticed that the roll over valves aren't venting when fueling and instead air is rushing up the filler neck so my theory is that I need a separate vent for fueling to prevent escaping air from pushing fuel up.

20200325_testing-fillerneck.jpg
 
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I'm sure you are planning on it toximus but just in case not--make sure the new filler cap is well grounded so your Jeep and the fuel dispenser are at the same voltage before fuel flows. The station nozzle is intended to ground to your filler and your hose does not appear to have static wire thus your mount must be conductive and bolted to something grounded to your frame. Just making sure no one gets burned in a gas fire.

Yes i know that that insures a spark when the vehicle and pump are at different voltages but it is better to occur while vapor concentration is less and no liquid is there yet.
 
Phil Younger said:
I'm sure you are planning on it toximus but just in case not--make sure the new filler cap is well grounded so your Jeep and the fuel dispenser are at the same voltage before fuel flows. The station nozzle is intended to ground to your filler and your hose does not appear to have static wire thus your mount must be conductive and bolted to something grounded to your frame. Just making sure no one gets burned in a gas fire.
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I was thinking about if that would be required the other day and I remembered that on the later TJ models they removed the grounding strap. So I'm inclined to think that it's not necessary.

Another thing to consider is that my fuel cell is not grounded to the chassis now that it's wrapped in sound deadening. I wonder if that could be a safety issue too...?
 
Generally gas pump fires are started by women. Especially in cold climates and dry ones like where we live. This is generally not from static build up from tires nor flowing fuels like big fuel haulers experience. The women thing comes from the polyester, wool, etc the wear and the vehicle seat material generating static as they slide in and out of the seat while filling so they stay warm--when they get out after the valve clicks off they grab the nozzle without touching both the pump and vehicle first. Usually fire is after the fill not before.
Men start fires by sliding plastic fuel cans across the pickup plastic bed liner and filling on the tailgate.
Tanker truck fires usually start when they pump #1, kero, or jet fuel thru hoses and they are not grounded--those fuels generate static. I never studied how static build up occurs with those fuels but one of my guys did that very thing when he violated grounding policy.

It is your choice and since you own the vehicle, are only driver and know the hazards you likely will be fine. I don't have time to look it up but it might be an interesting study to review race car fueling system grounding, roll over venting and internal hose explosion screen use. Do recognize that if researching this pay more attention to fuel type in racing since alcohols are different in conductivity and vapor explosive limits. Perhaps Nascar is more appropriate since they use E15. And if you are really interested explore why Indy stopped using gasoline in the 60's when Eddie Sacs and Dave MacDonald were killed in a horrific crash. This was not a filling caused fire but the final nail in the coffin for gasoline at the track.http://indymotorspeedway.com/v1/500d-64.htm
A fire is an awful way to get hurt though they are extremely rare- so rare that is why people don't know.
 
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toximus said:
The gas station pump filled 8 gallons for a total of roughly 13 gallons in the cell and then gas puked out the filler neck. I checked the fuel line and there's room for another ~8 gallons (roughly 6" from the top) so I don't think it was simply overflowing.

I noticed that the roll over valves aren't venting when fueling and instead air is rushing up the filler neck so my theory is that I need a separate vent for fueling to prevent escaping air from pushing fuel up.

View attachment 148308
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the long inverted loop is a long way to vent that pressure that quick. you got those 2 plugged bungs that could be adapted to a larger vent tube
 
someguysjeep said:
the long inverted loop is a long way to vent that pressure that quick. you got those 2 plugged bungs that could be adapted to a larger vent tube
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The Genright valves also have a spring in them which slows venting. As you pointed out this is exactly why I added the 2 bungs just in case I need them. The filler neck I'm using also has provisions for an air return hose so it'll be easy add. The ORB to AN adapter should be arriving on Monday and then I'll try filling that remaining 8 gallons.

COVID-19 is starting to cause delays for simple things like this filler neck since my suppliers of one of a kind items are closing. I actually was the last order the hose company took before shutting down. So it's possible that the remote filler might have to wait until after things return back to normal so I can get what I need.
 

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How is the filler cap or tank vented to atmosphere to allow for fuel consumption? Are you using one of the two vents to atmosphere via a pressure/vacuum vent or is the cap itself have a tiny pressure/vacuum relief built in? Some bracket drag guys (and circle track where allowed) used a simple rollover loop and since their fuels were methanol or ethanol added a ball valve to close off when not in use to keep the fuel dry-- not saying I am advocating this but just wondering. Their consumption out of the cell was only 'bout 5X yours per hour. :p
 
toximus said:
The Genright valves also have a spring in them which slows venting. As you pointed out this is exactly why I added the 2 bungs just in case I need them. The filler neck I'm using also has provisions for an air return hose so it'll be easy add. The ORB to AN adapter should be arriving on Monday and then I'll try filling that remaining 8 gallons.

COVID-19 is starting to cause delays for simple things like this filler neck since my suppliers of one of a kind items are closing. I actually was the last order the hose company took before shutting down. So it's possible that the remote filler might have to wait until after things return back to normal so I can get what I need.
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nice find.
i might go for that 1. the flange would allow it to mount to an aluminum plate but could also allow the top to be fit tight and removable (no matter where the hole ends up), with just the 6 face screws. make a gasket and the top will seal well. and vent tube to boot , that's the ticket.
 
Novak Conversions Jeep Wrangler TJ engine mounts
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