Jeep hydraulic linkage: from 4 bolts to chaos

[tagunz]

so I was removing the slave cylinder from the jeep when I realized that the pin that was at the end of the slave cylinder that activates the clutch FELL INTO THE TRANSMISSION!! So at the very least i'm agitated because now I have no idea how to get this stupid pin out without dropping the whole trans.

I bought a flexible magnetic pickup to use through the sc hole but I couldn't get it bc it faces the opposite direction from the lowest point in the trans. so basically my question is can I drain this and remove the pin from there?

I also saw on another thread that a guy who had a similar issue so he removed the starter and got it from there.

last thing, I added a picture i took with my phone that shows the view from the slave cylinder hole. I can't seem to figure out what i'm looking at/if it looks right. I'm pretty sure that the thing in the front is the clutch fork but idk what that worn plate is behind it/if that's a bad thing.

 

[Steel City 06]

If you remove the starter, you should be able to unbolt the inspection plate (aka the thin piece of sheet metal between the engine and transmission) and possibly squeeze something back in there between the flywheel and the bell housing to fish it out. Even if not, it may give you a better look at it.

Heck, you might even be able to reach in there with a tool through the starter hole.

If it's steel you might be able to use a very strong magnet to slide it along the inside of the case. The case itself is aluminum and is not magnetic

 

[Steel City 06]

Draining the transmission won't help. It's lost in the bell housing, not the gearbox. There is no fluid in the bell housing. (If there was, your clutch would be toast.)

And that component in the front is in fact the clutch fork. It straddles the splined shaft using the throwout bearing.

The etching marks you see are on the pressure plate. They're not in a critical area, so I wouldn't be worried about it yet. But I have no idea where they would come from, so I'd be a bit curious. It's possible the clutch fork was over extended at some point.


If you do end up pulling the transmission, go ahead and replace the clutch while you're there. It's a major PITA to pull the transmission; you only want to do it once. You don't need to drain it to remove it.

 

[03coloradowrangler]

looking and retrieving from the starter hole sounds like a sound idea. be sure to disconnect the battery first or be very cautious as to what the terminals on the starter may come into contact with.

a spring grip tool such as this may assist.

 

[tagunz]

thanks for the responses guys. going to get that pin out through the inspection cover once i remove the starter.

it’s a PITA but at least i probably won’t need to drop the tranny.

 

[tagunz]

also the tool i have is a flexible magnetic pick up which i believe will work

 

[tagunz]

ok guys so I got some good news and some bad news:

good news is I got the starter off after a few expletives

bad news is I couldn't find the pin but instead pulled out two pieces of metal wire (I believe one was from the spring in the slave cylinder) and a bearing ball (also seems like it was from the master cylinder bearing) and a bunch of tiny chunks of metal. [pic attached]

There was a good amount of gunk in there when I ran the magnet across the bottom so I'm thinking since I have two openings now I can maybe run a hose through one side of the bell housing and let it drain out the other? honestly i'm running out of ideas to get the pin without pulling the trans (which I really don't have the money to do right now) so just spitballing at this point.

 

[03coloradowrangler]

the wire piece on the right in your photo almost looks like 1/4 of a mangled clutch fork pivot retaining spring - part number 4338855. this could explain what the rubbing on the pressure plate is from.

i cant place the ball though.

 

[Steel City 06]

Did you pull the inspection cover? You might be able to see inside through the gap between the flywheel and the bell housing. Simply pull any bolts that pass through it and it should just slide out.

I have to agree that those clips probably are not good news. They either belong to the fork retainer clip or the throwout bearing assembly itself. You run the risk of misaligning the fork and not being able to use the clutch at all. If that fork spins inside the housing, you can try to realign it manually but it will be a PITA.

If you were to pull the bellhousing, you will see a plastic ball on a stick on the exact opposite side of the transmission as the hydraulic piston for the clutch. This is the pivot that the fork pivots on. If the fork pops off it, there will be nothing for the fork to react against to disengage the clutch. With pressure on both the piston and the ball, it could be kept in place but it’s not a guarantee.

That little ball I have no idea. It’s possible your throwout bearing has self destructed, which would explain the clutch fork damage.

I’m starting to suspect your throwout bearing may have self destructed and caused issues with the clutch fork. In that case you will have no choice but to pull the transmission to fix it. Best to do the clutch while you’re in there.

What symptoms did you have that led you to remove the slave cylinder?

 

[tagunz]

Did you pull the inspection cover? You might be able to see inside through the gap between the flywheel and the bell housing. Simply pull any bolts that pass through it and it should just slide out.

I have to agree that those clips probably are not good news. They either belong to the fork retainer clip or the throwout bearing assembly itself. You run the risk of misaligning the fork and not being able to use the clutch at all. If that fork spins inside the housing, you can try to realign it manually but it will be a PITA.

If you were to pull the bellhousing, you will see a plastic ball on a stick on the exact opposite side of the transmission as the hydraulic piston for the clutch. This is the pivot that the fork pivots on. If the fork pops off it, there will be nothing for the fork to react against to disengage the clutch. With pressure on both the piston and the ball, it could be kept in place but it’s not a guarantee.

That little ball I have no idea. It’s possible your throwout bearing has self destructed, which would explain the clutch fork damage.

I’m starting to suspect your throwout bearing may have self destructed and caused issues with the clutch fork. In that case you will have no choice but to pull the transmission to fix it. Best to do the clutch while you’re in there.

What symptoms did you have that led you to remove the slave cylinder?

i looked online about the inspection cover but it says i may not be able to remove it if I don’t have the transmission disconnected from the engine. I may be wrong so i‘lol still try it tomorrow.

I’m pretty sure the ball bearing is from the slave cylinder because i found some ball bearings in the slave cylinder also.

i originally removed the clutch hydraulics because the slave cylinder failed. i knew it had failed because the clutch pedal had no resistance/stopped working but it would shift into gear when turned off. also there was something pouring out of the slave cylinder which was the fluid it uses.

 

[Steel City 06]

You may not be able to completely remove the inspection plate without removing the transmission. But you can remove all the bolts and pull it back to look or possibly reach in with a tool

 

[tagunz]

good news is i am finally able to confirm it’s really in there.

bad news is i still can’t get it out through the inspection plate.

i tried pulling it back with an inflatable bag type contraption which worked well, but there just isn’t enough space in the gap to grab it with anything because it’s currently sitting perpendicular to the driveshaft.

got a picture taken from the inspection plate which shows the pin with the white cover that breaks when you pressurize the system for the first time. it’s currently on the opposite side from the starter/same side as the slave cylinder hole.

FML THIS IS SO STUPID ITS MY DAILY DRIVER.

 

[tagunz]

good news is i am finally able to confirm it’s really in there.

bad news is i still can’t get it out through the inspection plate.

i tried pulling it back with an inflatable bag type contraption which worked well, but there just isn’t enough space in the gap to grab it with anything because it’s currently sitting perpendicular to the driveshaft.

got a picture taken from the inspection plate which shows the pin with the white cover that breaks when you pressurize the system for the first time. it’s currently on the opposite side from the starter/same side as the slave cylinder hole.

FML THIS IS SO STUPID ITS MY DAILY DRIVER.

View attachment 142792

looking at it now it seems like the boot is also still attached

 

[Leahatrill]

Poor you! And I thought I had some really bad luck lately lol. This is an awesome thread though and something to learn from

 

[tagunz]

well... i thought i made it out of the woods...

so after 2 weeks of trying to get the stupid thing out i finally just got it. i thought i was set and i reinstalled everything to start her up... had the new slave cylinder and master clutch cylinder in... and then it failed AGAIN!

i’m not sure what the cause is anymore. i’m guessing something in the trans blew and isn’t letting the clutch go in. i heard maybe it was the throw out bearing? i’m not sure. i’m going to claim a warranty with LUK and get a new one, maybe it was just a fluke part. but the way it failed was almost exactly like the first time so i don’t think that a bad replacement is the issue.

how i feel about this situation right now:

 

[03coloradowrangler]

im thinking your throw out fork isnt aligned correctly or something. something else is causing the slave to lose the push rod. the wear on the rear of the pressure plate doesnt make sense for normal operation, nothing should be touching it other than the throw out bearing on the fingers.

 

[tagunz]

ok guys finally have an update. I sent her to a trusted mechanic who gave me a good price for dropping the bellhousing ($500) and replacing all the obviously worn/broken parts.

I ended up replacing 4 parts that cost $60 in total: the clutch fork, clutch fork pivot, clutch fork retainer spring/clip, and the throwout bearing. The first point of failure was the throwout bearing, which is where that bearing ball that i pulled out of the bellhousing came from. the second point of failure was the clip, which was broken when i drove her home in first gear with the slave cylinder pin from the clutch linkage just bouncing around everywhere. the clutch fork and clutch fork pivot were replaced as precautionary maintenance since they had not been replaced in a while and were on their way out.

So at the end of the day the initial cause was the throwout bearing failure, which may or may not have been due to the fact it was the new version for LUK that is made of plastic; either way I replaced it with an all metal throwout bearing I bought from Autozone for $30. the rest of the parts I bought from 4WP for $30.

thank you everyone who helped me troubleshoot this whole process. Next step, upgrading to an NP242 transfer case!!

 

[Tony11705]

ok guys finally have an update. I sent her to a trusted mechanic who gave me a good price for dropping the bellhousing ($500) and replacing all the obviously worn/broken parts.

I ended up replacing 4 parts that cost $60 in total: the clutch fork, clutch fork pivot, clutch fork retainer spring/clip, and the throwout bearing. The first point of failure was the throwout bearing, which is where that bearing ball that i pulled out of the bellhousing came from. the second point of failure was the clip, which was broken when i drove her home in first gear with the slave cylinder pin from the clutch linkage just bouncing around everywhere. the clutch fork and clutch fork pivot were replaced as precautionary maintenance since they had not been replaced in a while and were on their way out.

So at the end of the day the initial cause was the throwout bearing failure, which may or may not have been due to the fact it was the new version for LUK that is made of plastic; either way I replaced it with an all metal throwout bearing I bought from Autozone for $30. the rest of the parts I bought from 4WP for $30.

thank you everyone who helped me troubleshoot this whole process. Next step, upgrading to an NP242 transfer case!!

It’s been a year since you posted. Is it still working? I have the same issue after having a shop replace my clutch.

 

[tagunz]

It’s been a year since you posted. Is it still working? I have the same issue after having a shop replace my clutch.

yeah it did, clutch engages great now.

i recommend checking your hydraulic clutch linkage first for failure (rusted line, slave cylinder failure, etc.) before taking it to the mechanic and then go from there. if the clutch slave cylinder failed, then it can be replaced without removing the bell housing pretty easily. if there isn’t any damage and it simply dropped the pin like mine, you’ll need to drop the bell housing and do what i did.