Moving 4cyl engine 2 forward

Gollywomper

Gollywomper

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My AxX5 trans is showing signs of some potential syncro issues. I am contemplating an AX15 swap into my 2.5. The AX15 is about 2” longer than the ax5. I don’t have the room for a shorter driveshaft due to running a doubler setup. So that leaves the option of moving the engine forward.
I do not want to cut and weld frame mounts. I thought of custom block brackets, not sure how well they will hold up. I was thinking since I am running a MML what if I used the same thickness aluminum, bolted it to the stock location then drilled new holes 2” forward in the aluminum block for the motor mount? Obviously with new custom MMl blocks?
What do you all think is the best route to accomplish this?
 
Back when JP magazine was still around they added a Klune V crawler box on a 4 popper Jeep by moving the engine forward but I don't remember exactly how much. I don't know if that article is online or not.

I'd just see if you can get the 4 cyl or 6 cyl engine mounts and weld them on in the new position.
 
Wildman said:
Back when JP magazine was still around they added a Klune V crawler box on a 4 popper Jeep by moving the engine forward but I don't remember exactly how much. I don't know if that article is online or not.

I'd just see if you can get the 4 cyl or 6 cyl engine mounts and weld them on in the new position.
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Cutting and moving or replacing frame mounts would be a last resort.
 
Gollywomper said:
Cutting and moving or replacing frame mounts would be a last resort.
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I was thinking get another set of the frame mounts and that way you have your currents ones as you move the engine around. It's been too long since I I had my 4 cyl to remember what they even look like.
 
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I think it could be done. Could just place them against the front side of the existing mount. I would much rather off set the frame to engine mount or build new block brackets if either of those are viable.
 
Gollywomper said:
I think it could be done. Could just place them against the front side of the existing mount. I would much rather off set the frame to engine mount or build new block brackets if either of those are viable.
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Do you have access to a welder? Sounds like an easy job with some scrap metal and torch. I like to use cardboard cutouts and tape to mock up stuff like that. get the flat plate pieces bolted to the block and motor mount surfaces. then mock up cardboard shapes to span the gap.transfer to tube/angle iron/flat stock and cut/weld them in place. Great for irregular shapes and fast. you'd have a bolt in brackets that way. Or like you said,try and drill some elongated bar stock to take the place of your mml. I'd probably weld tube or angle iron from the end of it back to the frame though so the leverage doesn't rip it off.
 
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Gollywomper said:
My AxX5 trans is showing signs of some potential syncro issues. I am contemplating an AX15 swap into my 2.5. The AX15 is about 2” longer than the ax5. I don’t have the room for a shorter driveshaft due to running a doubler setup. So that leaves the option of moving the engine forward.
I do not want to cut and weld frame mounts. I thought of custom block brackets, not sure how well they will hold up. I was thinking since I am running a MML what if I used the same thickness aluminum, bolted it to the stock location then drilled new holes 2” forward in the aluminum block for the motor mount? Obviously with new custom MMl blocks?
What do you all think is the best route to accomplish this?
Click to expand...

We solved that problem when we built one with a doubler. We set it up to use the 4.0 fan shroud and moved it enough to reuse the existing driveshafts. At the same time, we also eliminated the lift blocks for the MML and just set the new mounts up to bolt up directly to the engine mounts without the spacer blocks.

My concern with the 2" move is you might need to upgrade the fasteners that hold the spacer block to the frame side mount. Not difficult to do though. Just make sure you move it enough to let the stud for the OEM isolator miss the side of the frame mount.
 
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mrblaine said:
We solved that problem when we built one with a doubler. We set it up to use the 4.0 fan shroud and moved it enough to reuse the existing driveshafts. At the same time, we also eliminated the lift blocks for the MML and just set the new mounts up to bolt up directly to the engine mounts without the spacer blocks.

My concern with the 2" move is you might need to upgrade the fasteners that hold the spacer block to the frame side mount. Not difficult to do though. Just make sure you move it enough to let the stud for the OEM isolator miss the side of the frame mount.
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Are you thinking a longer version of the MML could work? With larger fasteners.

After a quick look, there is no easy button here. The oil filter sits real tight behind the passenger side mount. The frame mount has to come out to accommodate a move forward. On the drivers side, the steering shaft comes into play. I think it could be clearanced to work. Maybe a remote oil filter would work on the passenger side
 
Gollywomper said:
Are you thinking a longer version of the MML could work? With larger fasteners.
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Mechanically, yes. Barring anything like you listed below that is in the way but the 2-2 1/2" offset mounts that take the place of a spacer lift won't be a problem.
Gollywomper said:
After a quick look, there is no easy button here. The oil filter sits real tight behind the passenger side mount. The frame mount has to come out to accommodate a move forward. On the drivers side, the steering shaft comes into play. I think it could be clearanced to work. Maybe a remote oil filter would work on the passenger side
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It isn't as hard to cut the frame side mounts loose and move them as you think. It is just a lot of work to pull all the stuff that is in the way.

edit- and you can move the motor about 8" or so and really improve your rear driveshaft length.
 
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mrblaine said:
Mechanically, yes. Barring anything like you listed below that is in the way but the 2-2 1/2" offset mounts that take the place of a spacer lift won't be a problem.

It isn't as hard to cut the frame side mounts loose and move them as you think. It is just a lot of work to pull all the stuff that is in the way.

edit- and you can move the motor about 8" or so and really improve your rear driveshaft length.
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Manual trans prevents much more than the 2” move. It is an endless circle. If I were to remove the motor to cut mounts and weld in new for the same effort I could have a larger engine in there. Use of a wider MML makes moving the engine worth the effort. If it is possible.
 
Gollywomper said:
Manual trans prevents much more than the 2” move. It is an endless circle. If I were to remove the motor to cut mounts and weld in new for the same effort I could have a larger engine in there. Use of a wider MML makes moving the engine worth the effort. If it is possible.
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You've apparently never driven an old Fageol moving van. The shifter is at least 48" long to get back to the transmission.
 
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Gollywomper said:
Manual trans prevents much more than the 2” move. It is an endless circle. If I were to remove the motor to cut mounts and weld in new for the same effort I could have a larger engine in there. Use of a wider MML makes moving the engine worth the effort. If it is possible.
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Pulling that cute lil motor is easy. Cut off the mounts,then bolt up the ax15,install said cute lil motor loosely and tack in the mounts to compensate for mml or leave them on if easier. Burn em in if accessible or pull motor and git er dun. You can just trim the shroud 2" if necessary. Will the fuel lines stretch? Anything else an issue?
 
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mrblaine said:
You've apparently never driven an old Fageol moving van. The shifter is at least 48" long to get back to the transmission.
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There is plenty of room to use a remote oil filter to get past the existing frame mount. It is also far enough to keep access to the motor mount bolts. This is all just planning at this point to fit the ax15 for possible future power improvements for a bit of highway power help. Sometimes I think I should just buy a trailer and tow it. 😑
 
Rickyd said:
Pulling that cute lil motor is easy. Cut off the mounts,then bolt up the ax15,install said cute lil motor loosely and tack in the mounts to compensate for mml or leave them on if easier. Burn em in if accessible or pull motor and git er dun. You can just trim the shroud 2" if necessary. Will the fuel lines stretch? Anything else an issue?
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Yea all can be done. Just need to figure out what is worth the effort.
Every one thing takes 10 more to get the first thing right.
 
Gollywomper said:
Manual trans prevents much more than the 2” move. It is an endless circle. If I were to remove the motor to cut mounts and weld in new for the same effort I could have a larger engine in there. Use of a wider MML makes moving the engine worth the effort. If it is possible.
Click to expand...

This is how guys that put a magnum into their TJ's modified their shifters to work since the V-8 swap moves the AX15 forward of the stock location.

Shifter Mod 3.jpg



Shifter Mod.jpg
 
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Remote filter will be a must and assuming you have a body lift no reason not to put a little lift on the steering shaft bearing to get it out of the way. Some reasonably simply brackets that both move the engine up and forward should get the job done. I would add an angle brace the ties into the side of the frame bracket just because.
 
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