Please help with death wobble

[Jerry Bransford]

Ok guys, I really appreciate the help and I mean that sincerely. Here's my question at this point.
I already plan to replace the ball joints, just sounds like the right thing to do.
Should I make every effort to eliminate the spacers?? They are only there to convert 5x4.5 to 5x5.
Are they just too difficult to balance correctly? This jeep sees very little off-road.
If I do this I will want to go back to stock 15", maybe with a little width. Thoughts Please!

I'm no fan of spacers but they're fine for your need of bolt pattern conversion. I wouldn't use them for aftermarket wheels with their reduced backspacing as that combined with the width of the spacers would position the wheels out too far. But for use with factory wheels that have a lot of backspacing to begin with, they're ok.

And when you replace your ball joints, make sure to stick with Spicer and avoid junk like Synergy or house brands. This is what I installed a couple years ago, they're a bit of an upgrade over the factory Spicer ball joints... https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00UTD76GY/?tag=wranglerorg-20

 

[mots]

Ok guys, I really appreciate the help and I mean that sincerely. Here's my question at this point.
I already plan to replace the ball joints, just sounds like the right thing to do.
Should I make every effort to eliminate the spacers?? They are only there to convert 5x4.5 to 5x5.
Are they just too difficult to balance correctly? This jeep sees very little off-road.
If I do this I will want to go back to stock 15", maybe with a little width. Thoughts Please!

I'd keep on your current path, get the ball joints fixed etc., and get the alignment in spec. But, in the meantime, I would highly recommend raising the priority on tire balancing by some experts with the proper equipment as was suggested. Make sure you check with them on tire pressure and report back on what pressure you are running with your exact tire size. While your'e getting the balancing work done, also ask them double check the wheel adapters to make sure they are sound and installed properly. In other words, I'm not suggesting to throw out the baby with the bathwater, LOL, just keep in mind that those adapters are another point of failure (improper install, damaged during install, stress fracture etc.). It just would have been real easy to troubleshoot if you did have another set of wheels/tires, that also didn't require the adapters.

 

[henrysTj]

On my 2006 TJ ,I have 31 inch tires the sidewall says 44 pounds what I did was took it down to 30 and I haven’t got the wobble back yet

I have the exact same lift that you have and when I got an adjustable track bar and did not use the relocation hole in the front that got rid of it... hope this helps

 

[henrysTj]

Hello all,

Thank you for the suggestions, so far. I will get the tires balanced immediately. I did relocate the track bar, but took great care to make sure the bar was tightened to 125. The track bar does not appear to move at all when turning the wheels. I know that does not ensure that the ends are not worn. I'm pretty sure this was DW, if not I don't know what it might be. I hit a pot hole doing about 45mph and thought the world was coming to an end. It was a violent shake and I attempted to pull over, which may have been a bad idea. The jeep headed off the road into a grassy area and ultimately stopped. I thought it was the end. The steering rods will move front to back, but little else. I have not gotten an alignment yet.

My relocation a hole in the front track bar is what caused mine...as soon as I changed to the stock hole with an adjustable front track bar everything was good to go

 

[Mike_H]

I'm running the JK wheels with 1.25" thick spacers. They are so small in diameter compared to the tires, balance isn't an issue. HOWEVER, if they are installed improperly, they could cause your tires to run offcenter...which you would notice almost immediately. It would feel like a tire balance issue. You might pull the wheels and tires off, and check the spacers. Make sure they are installed properly. I torqued mine to 110 ft-lbs, then run the wheels around 95. I also check them after 500 miles if I have to take the spacers off for some reason.

 

[Glenn Hodges]

Interesting update on my progress, As mentioned my next step was to replace the ball joints, which I accomplished over the weekend. I used the Dana Spicer joints and replaced the LH side joints first. The older, LH likely stock joints did not seem too bad. However when I replaced the RH side joints the lower joint was toast. It literally has zero tension to it. I can wiggle it around by holding the top of the joint.

My research tells me that ball joint are the second likely cause of DW, so I believe I have solved another contributor.
1. Adjustable track bar
2. New ball joints (all 4)
3. Replaced left side outer tie rod end (seal was blown out) so why not
4. Next is wheel balance and alignment.

Two Questions:
I've been told, by a mechanic, that the steering box could use to be tightened. Is this something I should tackle myself or have him do it?

Here's the big one, I have replaced the steering dampener, so as I'm diagnosing/repairing DW, should I remove the dampener to fully determine if DW is gone????

 

[Ardenlonewolf]

any progress made on this? I recently installed a 2.5" lift and am getting serious dw when I hit a 45 degree bump around 50mph. Never had any vibrations before with the same set of tires I have.

 

[Jerry Bransford]

any progress made on this? I recently installed a 2.5" lift and am getting serious dw when I hit a 45 degree bump around 50mph. Never had any vibrations before with the same set of tires I have.

Did you read all of the posts in this thread? The most common causes/fixes of DW were covered way up above this. The cure is very likely covered above. If you haven't already thoroughly read all of the above posts please do so now.

 

[Ardenlonewolf]

Interesting update on my progress, As mentioned my next step was to replace the ball joints, which I accomplished over the weekend. I used the Dana Spicer joints and replaced the LH side joints first. The older, LH likely stock joints did not seem too bad. However when I replaced the RH side joints the lower joint was toast. It literally has zero tension to it. I can wiggle it around by holding the top of the joint.

My research tells me that ball joint are the second likely cause of DW, so I believe I have solved another contributor.
1. Adjustable track bar
2. New ball joints (all 4)
3. Replaced left side outer tie rod end (seal was blown out) so why not
4. Next is wheel balance and alignment.

Two Questions:
I've been told, by a mechanic, that the steering box could use to be tightened. Is this something I should tackle myself or have him do it?

Here's the big one, I have replaced the steering dampener, so as I'm diagnosing/repairing DW, should I remove the dampener to fully determine if DW is gone????

Did you read all of the posts in this thread? The most common causes/fixes of DW were covered way up above this. The cure is very likely covered above. If you haven't already thoroughly read all of the above posts please do so now.

Nobody likes an self proclaimed internet forum know it all, I was simply asking the thread starter where his jeep stands currently after replacing those parts months ago as mine has the same symptoms. I have read the complete thread as well as many others on DW. I have a researched list of things to check once I get some free time to do it. Don't be an ass.

 

[Jerry Bransford]

Nobody likes an self proclaimed internet forum know it all, I was simply asking the thread starter where his jeep stands currently after replacing those parts months ago as mine has the same symptoms. I have read the complete thread as well as many others on DW. I have a researched list of things to check once I get some free time to do it. Don't be an ass.

Wow.

 

[JMT]

Nobody likes an self proclaimed internet forum know it all, I was simply asking the thread starter where his jeep stands currently after replacing those parts months ago as mine has the same symptoms. I have read the complete thread as well as many others on DW. I have a researched list of things to check once I get some free time to do it. Don't be an ass.

Interesting update on my progress, As mentioned my next step was to replace the ball joints, which I accomplished over the weekend. I used the Dana Spicer joints and replaced the LH side joints first. The older, LH likely stock joints did not seem too bad. However when I replaced the RH side joints the lower joint was toast. It literally has zero tension to it. I can wiggle it around by holding the top of the joint.

My research tells me that ball joint are the second likely cause of DW, so I believe I have solved another contributor.
1. Adjustable track bar
2. New ball joints (all 4)
3. Replaced left side outer tie rod end (seal was blown out) so why not
4. Next is wheel balance and alignment.

Two Questions:
I've been told, by a mechanic, that the steering box could use to be tightened. Is this something I should tackle myself or have him do it?

Here's the big one, I have replaced the steering dampener, so as I'm diagnosing/repairing DW, should I remove the dampener to fully determine if DW is gone????

You two need to stop being idiots. I don’t mean to be disrespectful, but I really can’t believe @Glenn Hodges has spent bookoos of $$$ before doing the simplest thing possible, having his wheels balanced, which is ALWAYS the cause of DW, in the sense that it TRIGGERS DW. Yes, other components can be worn and need replacement, but DW WON’T get started unless you either need your wheels balanced OR you need new tires. This is because of the definition of DW (i.e. quick oscillation increasing in amplitude; how do you think that gets going?). I can’t believe this is still going on and you guys have a checklist you found somewhere on the internet and you seem to just be going through the checklist. Look, every time you get DW you are doing harm to other components. So, yeah, over a few months, at least @Glenn Hodges has probably worn out several components in the process of just finally getting to wheel balance and alignment? You could have saved $100’s of dollars and probably more than $1000 if you had done this first. And @Ardenlonewolf, you can get bitchy, but it doesn’t change the facts.

And no, there is no need to remove the steering damper to make sure your DW is gone. If it makes you feel better you can.

 

[k-huevo]

Wheel imbalance is not always a death wobble instigator. I know it can happen with zero-balanced wheels, I have first hand experience. Take a look at this video https://www.bing.com/videos/search?...EEE69E0D716C563DF851EEE69E0D716C563&FORM=VIRE

 

[JMT]

Wheel imbalance is not always a death wobble instigator. I know it can happen with zero-balanced wheels, I have first hand experience. Take a look at this video https://www.bing.com/videos/search?...EEE69E0D716C563DF851EEE69E0D716C563&FORM=VIRE

Are you wanting to discuss precession?

In all reality, you may be technically correct, but if you want to help the two guys in the previous post, you won’t pander to their ignorance and you’ll start by trying to help them save $$$.

 

[Jerry Bransford]

Wheel imbalance is not always a death wobble instigator. I know it can happen with zero-balanced wheels,

I have had tire shops claim "zero-zero" balanced wheels before only to discover they were still shimmying at some particular speed. Turns out their "zero-zero" balance wasn't giving a perfect balance at all. One example...my local Discount Tire store finally got the balance perfect after two more attempts after their previous claimed "zero-zero" balance. I.e. three balance attempts in one day there before they finally got it right. What tire shops claim as a perfect balance is not always the truth in reality.

 

[Kelly Butler]

I have an update! About a month ago I had my mechanic install a 2 inch heavy duty old emu lift kit which included the steering stabilizer, shocks, coils, but it did not include the TC lowering case kit. I went to go pick up my Jeep and start driving it out of the parking lot and the whole Jeep and the steering wheel was just shaking like crazy! After lots of research and calling Quadratec and ARB 4X4. I purchased the lift kit from Quadratec but it was sold by ARB 4X4. ARB inform me that it was mandatory to have the TC lowering kit and I told them that nowhere on Quadratec website did it mention that. It was not mentioned on Quadratec website that the TC lowering kit was mandatory in order for the warranty to be honored so I called them after talking to ARB and Quadratec, they sent me a free lowering kit and it took care of the wobble.

 

[JMT]

I have an update! About a month ago I had my mechanic install a 2 inch heavy duty old emu lift kit which included the steering stabilizer, shocks, coils, but it did not include the TC lowering case kit. I went to go pick up my Jeep and start driving it out of the parking lot and the whole Jeep and the steering wheel was just shaking like crazy! After lots of research and calling Quadratec and ARB 4X4. I purchased the lift kit from Quadratec but it was sold by ARB 4X4. ARB inform me that it was mandatory to have the TC lowering kit and I told them that nowhere on Quadratec website did it mention that. It was not mentioned on Quadratec website that the TC lowering kit was mandatory in order for the warranty to be honored so I called them after talking to ARB and Quadratec, they sent me a free lowering kit and it took care of the wobble.

Glad to hear your Jeep is back to running well. It's pretty common to get some driveline vibes at 2-2.5". Looking at your Avatar I'm pretty sure you actually netted more than 2" with the OME HD kit. A TCase lowering kit will fix it. If you ever want to lose the TCase lowering kit, you can do a 1" motor mount lift and that will solve it as well, plus, you'll get the clearance back that you lost at the TCase skid. The mounts are about $115. Or the blocks that work with the stock motor mounts are only about $79.

 

[Glenn Hodges]

Good morning all,
Sorry I've been away for a while, but all seems to be well with the DW. On to the next couple of problems. Appears my clutch needs replacing so that's the next project. All of your suggestions were very helpful and I did get the tires Road Force balanced. But am glad I went through the whole front end as my ball joints were toast and I'm not sure I would have gotten that deep into the front end if not checking everything. Anyway, I'm glad you are ALL here to help. Now any suggestions for the clutch change would be appreciated. HA, yea me.