SE's vs. anything else

[Squatch]

Yeah, but you can’t resist that AMC derived 4.0!

Now, I never said "Instead of". It's more of an "In addition to" way of thinking... The missus would never let me get rid of her 4.0 XJ, and I'm up to my elbows in my 4.0 TJ. But a nice, stock manual tranny SE with the four lunger might just be a fun version to have as the back-up rig or the every-now-and-then commuter.

 

[psrivats]

To be honest, I often think about selling the Rubi and going back to a bare bones SE, stock, on 30" tires at best. It always is in my mind that the SE is so much more refined, powerful, and capable than the WWII Jeeps originally built, but is the closest thing to those in the TJ line. Sort of like what a Jeep was originally intended to be.

I actually think it would be refreshing to not have all the doodads - LSD, locking diffs, Dana 44 axles, big a$$ed tires & lifts, and just drive the Jeep around town, know that it has it's limitations on the highway, and enjoy it off road from time to time. An SE would fit the bill for that admirably.

I agree with this wholeheartedly. One of the things that I really admire about CJs and older Jeeps is the simplicity of form. There is something very charming and attractive about purpose built equipment that has everything it needs and nothing more. It takes dedication and effort to not overdo things and stop at the right spot. The joy should perhaps be in using and maintaining and getting your enjoyment out of that usage in the long run.

It's very difficult to find that simplicity today in general, partly because almost everyone wants "more". Things are over designed and over complicated. Even if you are not one such person, you are mostly out of choice when it comes to mass produced items. That's not too say good items don't exist, but be prepared to (1) search a ton, and (2) possibly spend more in getting that simplicity you really want.

@Chris started a good thread about shoes and clothes, prime examples of this kind of "more" thinking, and change for change's sake and no real need. I would also classify most auto makers in the same category .. Do we really need a new model civic or whatever car every year, and do they need to be selling the 2019 model by mid 2018? Jeep has been following a ~10 year cadence for the Wranglers and who knows how long that'll last?

I understand cars and wrenching being a good hobby for a lot of us. I'm not saying that's a bad thing. However, at least for some of us, I think it will pretty refreshing to call a build "Done!" and then start really using our TJs. My goal is to get there in 2019.

I really admire @jjvw's build thread. He's stuck a great balance between learning, building and then using his Jeep. As much as I enjoyed reading the build, I enjoy seeing his exploration photos even more (along with his maintenance stuff as things break and he fixes them, of course). That for me captures the Jeep spirit.

Great thread @StG58. Thanks for starting it.

 

[Equilibrium31]

Eh, I have an SE and I kinda wish it was a Rubicon. I mean, sure, I can get new axles and install lockers myself, but I'm still saving up for my first lift and my budget's tight for Jeep upgrades right now, so anything like that is pretty far down the line.

Still, I have the 4.0 version and while it would be nice to have lockers right now, it's not a big deal. Worst case scenario, I'll just winch it out. =P

Nothing against the 2.4, but I like the extra pep driving around. Never tried a 2.4 though, so I don't know that it would have been much different.

 

[Westtown Willy]

The longer I own my TJ the more I appreciate simplicity. The trend for the most part is bigger better faster more & I get the appeal of that but my mind seems to be going in the opposite direction. I’m somewhere in the middle between stock & really built so it could go either way for my TJ, but when I see one coming my way lower to the ground on 30/31 inch tires that are flush with the flares (rather than tucked under) with stock bumpers I’m inclined more & more to think they’re the coolest looking ones out there, they just seem the most proportional & the big bonus is that they’re the simplest, probably suffering from fewer quirks than the rest. This makes me wonder if at some point in the future I will put in some lower springs & smaller/narrower tires, yank all the skids & lose the heavy front bumper… this all assumes I give up wheeling it of course, which isn’t happening anytime soon but eventually will. I ‘had to have’ a 4.0 when I was in the market, but in hindsight a 2.5 would’ve been more than sufficient for my actual purposes.

 

[05 Blue Unlimited]

Well to each his own. (For the way I wheel) As you know I have an 05 LJ (it's blue too) that cost 15K 5 yrs ago. The same in a Rubi would have been north of 25K so that is 10K for mods. So for the way I wheel I figure 5K will get me to what I need and the look I am after. And doing some simple math means I have 5K for maintenance on the wife :banana:

 

[John’o]

I owned a 99 Sport TJ for 14 years. East coast salt finally ate it apart. Bought an 02 SE 2.5L recently (June) after a move to Tucson. Love it. SE (in my opinion) stands for Systems Engineered. The last hurrah of the AMC engineers. Motto of System Engineering is “Better is the Enemy of Good-Enough”. Everything on the SE is set correctly. The 2.5L is ~180 lbs lighter coupled with the Dana 30 front end, allows you to float on mud and bounce up and over boulders. Never gets stuck. With Gas Tank full, weight is on the rear tires. Means you don’t need to go to 4x4 until gas tank hits 1/2. With gas tank between 3/4-1/4 full the weight is balanced on all 4 wheels (what you want in the snow). Maintenance simple and fun. The TJ was engineered and designed to be an SE, then it got fat as a Sport or Rubi. In conclusion, you want an SE. BEST Jeep design… ever.