Will 35s fit with a 3 inch lift kit?

[jjvw]

i had a 3 inch lift when i first bought my jeep. and it was on 33s....worked well. i went to 35s and they fit just fine too. but i had already added tube fenders to increase my wheel well space. this worked for a while and i rubbed my tires on my tubes alot but it didnt bother me. then i went to a 5.5 inch RE long arm and then the 35s seemed to small. 37s would have worked well with that setup.

The only pertinent question I would ask about any of the various arrangements listed would be the amount of shock travel along with the travel biases. There is a presumption in that question that the axles were fully cycled without the coils and the bump stops were sufficiently extended. Testing with ramps and forks don't count.

 

[Alex GK]

RE's springs are well known to give at least an extra inch over the advertised amount. That 5.5" kit gave your TJ more like 6.5" of lift. I ran RE's LA suspension on my previous TJ and after first ordering the 5.5" springs, downsized them to 4.5" during the ordering process after learning of that. Even with its 4.5" springs it was more like 5.5" of lift in reality. Even it, in combination with my 1" BL, was a bit too tall for my 35's. I'm glad I'm no longer running RE's LA suspension, it just didn't work for me well on the type of trails I enjoy.

i modified the RE long arm kit to work very well. i still ran the tall springs but... got rid of their track bar set up to fix the geometry issue and give more front end travel, 1 ton heim joint steering, and rear triangulated uppers. and this worked very well. if you daily drive your jeep. and like to run the con a few times a year !

 

[Jerry Bransford]

i modified the RE long arm kit to work very well. i still ran the tall springs but... got rid of their track bar set up to fix the geometry issue and give more front end travel, 1 ton heim joint steering, and rear triangulated uppers. and this worked very well. if you daily drive your jeep. and like to run the con a few times a year !

The Rubicon is a pretty easy trail, it doesn't take much of a suspension lift to run it.

 

[Mr. Bills]

The Rubicon is a pretty easy trail, it doesn't take much of a suspension lift to run it.

Says a guy who has never run the Rubicon Trail.

 

[Alex GK]

The Rubicon is a pretty easy trail, it doesn't take much of a suspension lift to run it.

true for the main trail. but it does if youre hitting runs like Old Sluice.

 

[Dcook65]

I have a 2.5 lift and run 33’s with no problem. I do a few trail rides and around town. Not sure why there are so many who say you can’t. Wouldn’t do any heavy off roading or rock crawling.

 

[jjvw]

...Not sure why there are so many who say you can’t. Wouldn’t do any heavy off roading or rock crawling.

Physically fitting the tire into the tire hole is not the immediate issue. Neither is the use of the vehicle. The concern has everything to do with the resulting suspension travel once the (very real) clearance problems of a larger than stock tire have been addressed. Is that resulting suspension travel more, comparable, or less than a stock TJ? The answer to that question is the answer to how well a larger than stock tire fits.

 

[Ehallspqr]

OME (Old Man Emu) kits where mentioned. That’s what I usually run because they offer a well mannered plush ride that’s close to stock feeling on the road and still works great off-road. They seem to have figured out good spring rates and correct valving on their shocks. ARB makes the OME kits and you can get the 2.5” or 4” with standard springs or heavy duty springs if your Jeep is heavy with a winch and steel bumpers etc. Very complete kit with rear track bar relocation bracket and HD steering stabilizer. There are options and adjustments you can fine tune your ride height specific to your rig.

The 2.5” kit on my orange TJ along with 1” bodylift allows narrow 33” tires to be run. If you want to go with 35’s then the 4” with a 1-1.25 bodylift should get you there if your only doing light wheeling. The kits run high but will settle to close to what they are rated at.

Personally what you describe that you are after for starting out with your TJ, it sounds like 33’s and a 3” lift will suit your purposes. However if you ultimately like the looks of 35’s then you need to rethink the 3” lift, go to at least a 4” and start thinking about a bodylift and regearing your axels. I think it’s good practice to go right to where you want to be with your build vs going in incremental steps. Saves time and money in the long run.

32-33” are a great all around size for the TJ. Cheaper, easy on your steering components, better gas mileage, better road manors, cheaper/easier build costs to get them under your Jeep. And they don’t give up too terribly much to 35’s. My Jeep group wheels some fairly tuff Black Diamond trails in the Cascade Mts. Most are running 35-37’s and 5-6 inches of lift. I go everywhere the group goes on 33’s, 3” of lift and lockers. 32’s and 33’s are no slouch off-road with proper gearing and setup.

 

[Jerry Bransford]

OME (Old Man Emu) kits where mentioned. That’s what I usually run because they offer a well mannered plush ride that’s close to stock feeling on the road and still works great off-road. They seem to have figured out good spring rates and correct valving on their shocks.

OME used to have the valving figured out with their previous Nitrocharger which I used to run. It was a great riding shock. Then OME replaced the Nitrocharger with the much more stiffly valved Nitrocharger Sport which most TJ owners agree was valved way too stiffly for the TJ. The Nitrocharger everyone loved was discontinued several years ago.

 

[Ehallspqr]

OME used to have the valving figured out with their previous Nitrocharger which I used to run. It was a great riding shock. Then OME replaced the Nitrocharger with the much more stiffly valved Nitrocharger Sport which most TJ owners agree was valved way too stiffly for the TJ. The Nitrocharger everyone loved was discontinued several years ago.

I noticed the OME kit I just installed did seem a little less plush and a bit harder riding. They seemed to have gone the way of Bilstein unfortunately. I attributed it to the heavy duty springs I chose vs the standard and hoped it would soften out, which it has a bit. But your right, the shocks are not as plush riding as the previous kits I’ve used on my last 3 Wranglers. Oh well I still recommend their suspension kits or the OP can piece together a kit with the best springs and shocks setup to his own preference. What are the best mannered shocks these days? I’ve been out of Jeeps the last few years. Things have changed is seems. Some better, Some worst like messing up the OME’s nearly perfect 2.5” Nitro shocks

 

[Fouledplugs]

I think what you call the 'right way' is just how you would do it, and to call anyone without a winch 'irresponsible' is ridiculous.

A re gear, a sye, a new ds, and adj links, is in deed the right way. Without lockers you are limited to 2WD as well.

 

[Jerry Bransford]

I noticed the OME kit I just installed did seem a little less plush and a bit harder riding. They seemed to have gone the way of Bilstein unfortunately. I attributed it to the heavy duty springs I chose vs the standard and hoped it would soften out, which it has a bit. But your right, the shocks are not as plush riding as the previous kits I’ve used on my last 3 Wranglers. Oh well I still recommend their suspension kits or the OP can piece together a kit with the best springs and shocks setup to his own preference. What are the best mannered shocks these days? I’ve been out of Jeeps the last few years. Things have changed is seems. Some better, Some worst like messing up the OME’s nearly perfect 2.5” Nitro shocks

For the $$$ it's real hard to beat the good ride and great offroad control of the newish gas-charged Rancho RS5000x. When my OME Nitrochargers died a year or two ago I replaced them with the Rancho RS5000x expecting a let-down. Nope, they seemed to ride exactly the same as the Nitrochargers they replaced. No one should confuse Rancho's newer gas-charged RS5000x for their older hydraulic RS5000 that makes a Wrangler ride like a buckboard wagon.

 

[Jerry Bransford]

Without lockers you are limited to 2WD as well.

If you are going to claim the axles only drive 1 wheel per axle, that's an incorrect old wive's tale. All four wheels are driven in 4x4, even an open axle splits the torque 50:50 between sides. The problem is when one tire loses traction, the available torque goes to near zero and neither side gives you enough power to keep moving. That's true of open or LSD equipped axles. I wrote a longish article that explains that in more detail many years ago if you're interested.

 

[Ehallspqr]

For the $$$ it's real hard to beat the good ride and great offroad control of the newish gas-charged Rancho RS5000x. When my OME Nitrochargers died a year or two ago I replaced them with the Rancho RS5000x expecting a let-down. Nope, they seemed to ride exactly the same as the Nitrochargers they replaced. No one should confuse Rancho's newer gas-charged RS5000x for their older hydraulic
RS5000 that makes a Wrangler ride like a buckboard wagon.

Rancho’s? Wow things have changed. Good to know, I’ll keep the Rancho RS5000x in mind when my OME shocks either go TU or they disappoint me and I ditch them. Thanks JB!

 

[Fouledplugs]

If you are going to claim the axles only drive 1 wheel per axle, that's an incorrect old wive's tale. All four wheels are driven in 4x4, even an open axle splits the torque 50:50 between sides. The problem is when one tire loses traction, the available torque goes to near zero and neither side gives you enough power to keep moving. That's true of open or LSD equipped axles. I wrote a longish article that explains that in more detail many years ago if you're interested.

Yea go to 3:30 and it shows what open diffs will be like off road. Beyond the 3:30 mark, Teraflex goes into basics behind 2wd with and without lockers as well as 4wd with and without lockers.

 

[Jerry Bransford]

Yea go to 3:30 and it shows what open diffs will be like off road. Beyond the 3:30 mark, Teraflex goes into basics behind 2wd with and without lockers as well as 4wd with and without lockers.

That still doesn't explain away the misconception some have on how open diffs work. That video gives nothing new, it's just about understanding the whole picture. Not many do.

If you want to doubt what I'm saying, have a read if you want to learn something. I wrote this article 15 years ago.

Since questions about the frequently misunderstood subject of 4x4 and how torque is delivered to the wheels is a common one, I thought I'd write this explanation.

All four tires are driven equally by the 4x4 system and all four pull equally if they all have equal traction. If all four wheels have equally good traction, then all four will pull equally well. So even if your Jeep does not have a locker or limited slip differential, each of the four wheels will receive approximately 25% each of the torque from the engine, when traction is equal under each of the four tires.

A standard open differential always (always!) splits the torque 50:50 between both sides. The problem is that when one tire starts spinning due to poor traction, that reduces the amount of torque seen by either side by an exactly equal amount. So if one side starts slipping, the other side's power (torque) is reduced by an equal amount which usually means insufficient power to keep you moving.

The engine can develop no more torque than the tire with the least amount of traction can accept before spinning.

So the short answer is 'yes', all four tires pull in 4wd. But the moment one side starts slipping, neither side gets enough power to keep you moving even if the non-slipping side still has traction.

Why does the power (torque) get reduced to both sides and not just the side that is slipping? Again, because the differential always (!) splits whatever torque it receives 50:50 to both sides. Why does the amount of torque get reduced at all? Because the engine only develops torque when it is working into resistance. Run an engine with a torque meter connected and watch what happens to the amount of torque produced as resistance to the engine is varied. When the engine is working into zero resistance and just running free, it produces nearly zero torque. Apply a braking force to the engine and the amount of torque will increase in direct proportion to the amount of resistance the engine is working into. The more braking force applied to the engine's output shaft, the more torque the engine produces.

So because the engine only produces torque when working into resistance, a spinning tire reduces the amount of power (torque) the engine produces because the engine is working into less resistance caused by the spinning tire. This works the same way with 2wd and 4wd, it's just that with 4wd, you have more of a chance that at least one of the two axles will have enough traction to allow the engine to produce enough torque to keep you moving. Which is why you get stuck in the first place... when one side is spinning, there is insufficient power being delivered to the other side to get or keep you moving.

And all of this is why a limited slip differential (LSD) can help since it helps to "couple" (via a clutch or a gear-based device) the resistance the side with good traction is seeing to the other side with poor traction, increasing the amount of resistance seen by the engine... thereby increasing the amount of torque delivered to both sides. Which is why the simple technique of stepping on the brakes a little when a tire is spinning can often get you unstuck... because it too increases the resistance the engine is working into which increases the amount of torque that is delivered to the wheels. Or if a rear tire is spinning constantly, pulling the parking brake up a couple clicks can often help by acting as a poor-man's limited slip differential. Pulling the parking brake up a few clicks when you already have a limited slip differential will help improve its operation. A key drawback to a LSD whether it be clutch or gear based is that when one tire is spinning up in the air, it doesn't help create enough torque for the other tire still on the ground to keep you moving. Without you helping it by stepping on the brakes or pulling the parking brake handle up if it's a rear tire that is spinning, a LSD doesn't do much for you. On flat terrain they help a lot, but on uneven terrain when both tires can't always be on the ground, a LSD is not very helpful. That's a situation where a locker reigns supreme over a LSD.

What does a locker do? It mechanically locks the left and right wheels together so when one turns, they must both turn at the same speed. This arrangement prevents one side from spinning uselessly while the other side does nothing. Automatic lockers are always locked but they unlock automatically to allow the outside wheel in a turn to 'ratchet' faster as the outside tire must do through the turn. Once the turn is completed, the locker re-locks both sides together. A manual locker is one that doesn't lock the left and right sides together until it is actuated either via a push-button or lever. An ARB Air Locker is air-pressure actuated, others like the Detroit Electrac are electrically actuated. The Ox Locker is actuated via a lever and cable. Manual lockers have an advantage for on-road driving in that when unlocked, they act like an "open" axle... i.e. one without a locker or limited slip differential... which means it drives like an unlocked vehicle until the locker is activated via the push-button or lever.

Part-Time and Full-Time 4x4 systems...

A part-time 4x4 system called Commandtrac is in all Wranglers together with low-end Cherokees and Liberties. A part-time 4x4 system locks the front and rear driveshafts together inside the transfer case so they drive the front and rear axles together in lock step. Because they are locked together, the front and rear tires must rotate at the exact same rpms. However, the front tires must rotate faster than the rear tires during any turn so a part-time system fights that... which makes a part-time system inappropriate on a paved road because the high level of traction on a paved road prevents the tires from slipping which would otherwise allow the front and rear tires to grudgingly rotate at different rpms. Offroad this is not a problem since the poor traction of an offroad trail allows the tires to slip as needed. But when they try to slip/rotate at different rpms on a high-traction surface, the entire drivetrain is stressed which is bad for it. This problem is called "wind-up".

In reality however, the front and rear axles really don't even turn exactly the same RPMs when you're in 4wd so you still get "wind-up" if you drove in 4wd on the street even if you drove in a perfectly straight line. Why? Because 1) you can't drive in a perfectly straight line and 2) the front and rear axle ratios are usually .01 different from each other. Like a 3.73 and 3.74, 4.10/4.11, etc.. Why the .01 ratio difference between the front and rear axles? Because the front and rear axles usually have different ring gear diameters which makes it nearly impossible for the gear manufacturers to economically make the front and rear axle ratios exactly the same. And no, they are not made .01 different on purpose to make the front or rear pull more when in 4wd, that is an old wive's tale.

Finally, a full-time 4x4 system like Selectrac is available on Grand Cherokees, Cherokees and Libertys couples the front and rear axles together, but they are not mechanically locked together like they are with a part-time 4wd system. The front-to-rear axle coupling can be done via either a differential like the Selectrac system uses (just just like what is in the center of an "open" axle) or a fluid (viscous) coupler. The benefit to a full-time 4wd system is that because the front and rear axles are not mechanically locked together, the front and rear tires/axles can rotate at different rpms from each other. This allows a vehicle with a full-time 4wd system to drive in 4wd "full time" on a paved road without problem since there is no 'wind-up' problem to harm the drivetrain. You cannot get a full-time 4x4 system in a Wrangler from the factory.

 

[Mike_H]

Oh really, The first rough country kit that I used was in 1983 on a c10 chevy and have used them on various 4x4's without any problems. As far as ride goes I don't expect it to ride like a lexus sedan. And to address the dropped tc plate, I don't do any rock crawling only mud where I live so its a non issue.

Yes, really. If it works for you, great. Just know that Jeeps don't have to be rough riding buckboards. If you set your bumpstops and tire pressure appropriately, get some good shocks, and pay attention to maintaining at least 4" of uptravel, you can have a Wrangler that rides pretty damn well. Mine rides at least as well as my stock 2017 Colorado. Some days, I think it might ride better. Is it equal to my Audi? No...but its close...really it is. Further, my jeep is set-up with the "stiff" Bilstein 5100's and Load Range D Mud Terrains.

Regarding your point about the dropped skid... Even in mud, it's an issue. That skid literally becomes a shovel, scooping up dirt and stones when you drag it through the mud. Driving in the mud is difficult enough, why add more drag? Just my opinion though, from swampy Michigan, your milage may vary.

To @Karolinacouple . I think the point of all this is to run whatever you want, but understand there are always compromises. You can physically fit 35's with a 3" lift, but it's gonna be a rough ride and acceleration will suffer. 33's will be better. They require less bumpstop and be easier for the factory drivetrain to handle.

My personal recommendation would be 2-2.5 inches of lift and 32 x 11ish tires. Easy on the wallet AND the Jeep. Stay away from the rabbit hole!

 

[mgroeger]

$8K total to do 33’s right, lift $900, a regear will run you $1500 minimum, while in there you might as well do lockers, another $1400-2300. Adjustable front trackbar, $200, rear trackbar relocation bracket $25, extended rear sway bar links, $30, body lift, $170, MML $170, front sway bar disconnects $175, winch and recovery gear $700, bumpers? $750, tires $1000, wheels with proper bs or spacers $500-800, extended brake lines?, what else for your unique situation? Every TJ has its differences. Maybe you need a SYE and DC to eliminate vibes $600.

None of this is including labor, parts only.

Now, yeah, you can live with 33’s and crappy gearing and thus no lockers and a TCase drop and you can be irresponsible and not have a winch and you could jettison the bumpers, but how are you going to carry a 33 spare? You can’t jettison most of the other stuffs

I carry my 33" spare just fine with an upgraded Rugged Ridge tailgate mount. Factory hinges and have had zero problems.

 

[JMT]

I carry my 33" spare just fine with an upgraded Rugged Ridge tailgate mount. Factory hinges and have had zero problems.

My factory hinges (2005), started to sag after a couple days, so I upgraded to Exogate hinges only, IIRC, $150. Looks like your running a 33x10.5 while I’m running a 33x12.5. Wonder what the weight differences are there?

For 35’s one would be way beyond the factory hinges.

 

[jjvw]

I carry my 33" spare just fine with an upgraded Rugged Ridge tailgate mount. Factory hinges and have had zero problems.

The beginning trick is to make sure the tire snubbers on the gate and the body are fully contacting the spare. This reduces the constant vibration and will slow down the metal fatigue that will eventually crack and tear apart the tailgate.