Brake fluid reservoir dry - best course of action?

[hunterrva]

My 97 tj had soft brakes last night. I popped the hood today and brake fluid reservoir was dry! I filled with fresh fluid hope I can get it a mile to the shop that I use.

Figure leak somewhere... is there a typical issue that I should expect to be the culprit or is it a crapshoot on any of the components being potential issue?

 

[RangerTJ]

You're going to have to fully bleed the system before trying to drive it anywhere.

No brakes is No Bueno.

Have someone take a look while you apply the brakes to see if they can spot where the leak is.

 

[mrblaine]

My 97 tj had soft brakes last night. I popped the hood today and brake fluid reservoir was dry! I filled with fresh fluid hope I can get it a mile to the shop that I use.

Figure leak somewhere... is there a typical issue that I should expect to be the culprit or is it a crapshoot on any of the components being potential issue?

Best case is downstream of the master, easy to find with little collateral damage. Worst case is the master leaking into the booster. Hard to find and takes out the booster.

 

[KennethS]

Most common failure I’ve had is a leaky rear wheel cylinder. Look at the insides of the tires for wetness, which would indicate a leaking wheel cylinder. But as said the leak could be elsewhere.

 

[Gilaguy23]

Have any enemies?

 

[Bammo68]

KennethS has ID'd the most likely culprit - leaking rear slave / wheel cylinders. Not a difficult DIY job and not very expensive unless you have OCD like me and wind up replacing ever single component of the drum brakes "while you are in there"!!!

 

[Rcroane]

KennethS has ID'd the most likely culprit - leaking rear slave / wheel cylinders. Not a difficult DIY job and not very expensive unless you have OCD like me and wind up replacing ever single component of the drum brakes "while you are in there"!!!

Just curious....can a cylinder be replaced without disassembling the springs, shoes, etc?

 

[ColoJeep]

Just curious....can a cylinder be replaced without disassembling the springs, shoes, etc?

No , Just do it correctly. It's a great time to replace the shoes at a minimum .

 

[hear]

Just curious....can a cylinder be replaced without disassembling the springs, shoes, etc?

It absolutely can be done. But there’s a really really good chance all that stuff needs a refresh anyway.

 

[macleanflood]

Anything leaking in the rear drum area...brake piston, axle seal...any of those oils gets soaked up by brake shoes...which compromises the shoe.

-Mac

 

[mrblaine]

It absolutely can be done. But there’s a really really good chance all that stuff needs a refresh anyway.

How do you hold both shoes back off of the anchor pin far enough to get the wheel cylinder in and out? Not doubting, just curious how it is done.

 

[Larry L TJ]

Buy several cans of brake cleaner to start with. Wear a mask so you don't inhale the break dust. Spray the crap out of (rear brake assembly) before you take anything apart. once you get the springs and things cleaned you can see what needs replaced. If you replace one brake cylinder on the back, go ahead and replace the other one. You will sleep better at night knowing you did both sides. Should be able to get cylinder and spring kit for around $60.00 at local parts store or Amazon.

 

[hear]

How do you hold both shoes back off of the anchor pin far enough to get the wheel cylinder in and out? Not doubting, just curious how it is done.

It was last summer, and I only did it because I was in a pinch. Anyway, iirc it was the sort of thing you’d want 4 or 5 hands for. Getting the old one out was easy, as you probably suspected. I vaguely recall getting the new one in, then pulling one shoe back to get that “pusher pin” into the new wheel cylinder, then maybe doing the other side whilst making sure the equalizer bar didn’t fall out of place. I may have used something for leverage. I wish I could remember.

I didn’t get it on my first try, I do remember that much. But it wasn’t so painful that I didn’t do it on the other side as well.

I’m honestly a little surprised you’ve never had to try this stunt.

 

[mrblaine]

It was last summer, and I only did it because I was in a pinch. Anyway, iirc it was the sort of thing you’d want 4 or 5 hands for. Getting the old one out was easy, as you probably suspected. I vaguely recall getting the new one in, then pulling one shoe back to get that “pusher pin” into the new wheel cylinder, then maybe doing the other side whilst making sure the equalizer bar didn’t fall out of place. I may have used something for leverage. I wish I could remember.

I didn’t get it on my first try, I do remember that much. But it wasn’t so painful that I didn’t do it on the other side as well.

I’m honestly a little surprised you’ve never had to try this stunt.

I removed and installed disc brake parking brake shoes on a Ford 8.8 because I didn't want to pull the cover and c-clips. It wasn't worth it. I've also installed one side of the triple drilled rear axles. No access hole so you have to get really stupid getting the retainer bolt nuts started and then tightened. One side because I told the owner to buy dual drilled, he refused, so I made him do the other side. Again, not worth it.

The 4-5 hands dropped to just 2 if you pull the return springs, no?

 

[ColoJeep]

I removed and installed disc brake parking brake shoes on a Ford 8.8 because I didn't want to pull the cover and c-clips. It wasn't worth it. I've also installed one side of the triple drilled rear axles. No access hole so you have to get really stupid getting the retainer bolt nuts started and then tightened. One side because I told the owner to buy dual drilled, he refused, so I made him do the other side. Again, not worth it.

The 4-5 hands dropped to just 2 if you pull the return springs, no?

Just about every time I've tried to keep something assembled to " save time " , it isn't worth the mental slowburn of the " work around ".
A drum brake multi tool pliers makes this so easy , it isn't saving anything by not R&R the parts conventionally .

 

[hear]

I removed and installed disc brake parking brake shoes on a Ford 8.8 because I didn't want to pull the cover and c-clips. It wasn't worth it. I've also installed one side of the triple drilled rear axles. No access hole so you have to get really stupid getting the retainer bolt nuts started and then tightened. One side because I told the owner to buy dual drilled, he refused, so I made him do the other side. Again, not worth it.

The 4-5 hands dropped to just 2 if you pull the return springs, no?

Probably? In reality I most likely didn’t spend any time considering that I could just reuse the components. In that moment it was probably “I don’t have the parts so I shouldn’t disassemble anything.” But I was also probably thinks how badly I didn’t want to jack with drum brakes in that moment.

So in conclusion, it can be done. It’s not *that* hard to do. But it might not be worth the effort when all you really need to do is remove a spring or two. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

[NskLJ]

How do you hold both shoes back off of the anchor pin far enough to get the wheel cylinder in and out? Not doubting, just curious how it is done.

How do you hold both shoes back off of the anchor pin far enough to get the wheel cylinder in and out? Not doubting, just curious how it is done.

I seen it done. Remove the upper springs off the anchor. Pull the shoes out beyond the pads of the backing plate the shoe sits on. Remove the parking brake bar. Fight with the cylinder to get it out and back in. Try to reassemble the drum brakes and get everything back where it belongs. Even though I was on flat rate for 30 plus years some things don’t make too much sense. This is right up there with trying to pull one V-8 head with the intake still connected to the other head or butchering a heater case to remove the heater core .Perfect case of just because it can be done doesn’t mean it should.

 

[mrblaine]

Perfect case of just because it can be done doesn’t mean it should.

Yep, I'm aware. That and it is pretty obvious no one has fought the pair of overly stout parking brake springs on an 8.8 trying to get them in with the axle flange in the way, otherwise they would have commented how much of a retard I was for even trying.

 

[NskLJ]

Yep, I'm aware. That and it is pretty obvious no one has fought the pair of overly stout parking brake springs on an 8.8 trying to get them in with the axle flange in the way, otherwise they would have commented how much of a retard I was for even trying.

Yes those are a pain. I have a screwdriver I have put a v notch in for those type of springs. I will also put one shoe on install the spring then pull the other shoe over the anchor. Much easier to remove the axle.