Noisy Lifter Help

[Kyle_W]

Alright, I have had noisy lifters for year upon starting my Jeep up every morning. It always went away though when my oil warmed up. However, recently they are ticking almost 24/7. I want to fix this problem before it gets even worse.

So, I have flushed my engine out twice: first time was with 1qt of Rislone in my crankcase, after 300 miles, drained it out, then refilled it back up with 5W-30 oil (instead of my usual 10W-30) and .5qt of Seafoam. Been 100 miles and so far the ticking hasn't changed.

Before I go through the massive ordeal of changing out my lifters, pushrods, and my camshaft, I want to see what ya'll think about my symptoms:

1. Upon startup, the ticking starts, and is pretty audible. It revs up and down with the engine. Then once the engine and oil warm up a little, the loud ticking spontaneously stops, then it starts again a few seconds later. It does this over and over until my engine reaches full operating temp.
2. But, I also hear a quieter ticking sound that's in the background of the loud ticking sound. It also revs up and revs down with the engine; I guess I have two different lifters that get stuck and then un-stick themselves randomly? This quiet ticking is going (while i'm driving around time) 90% of the time. The other 10% of the time it isn't ticking.
3. When the ticking sounds cut in and out, its extremely random. The only thing I can tell is that after my engine reaches full operating temperature, I hardly ever hear the loud ticking again. The quiet ticking is what I hear the most (90% of the time i'm driving down the road), and that's the ticking that has developed recently and hasn't changed at all since I flushed my engine twice.

Here is a video of the loud ticking:

https://photos.google.com/share/AF1...?key=dnFaZ3k3R2FTZkFZaExRMzl6eVdWMWhoaWtKZTlB

The 'quiet ticking' is basically the exact same thing as what you hear in the video. It just sounds quieter to me (maybe its coming from further up in the engine bay)?

Let me know what ya'll think, thank you!

 

[fourpointzero]

Here is a video of the loud ticking:

Link doesn't seem to be working.


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[Kyle_W]

Link doesn't seem to be working.


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It may be because you are on your iPhone, sir. On my browser it works fine!

 

[fourpointzero]

It may be because you are on your iPhone, sir. On my browser it works fine!

Lame me. I'll have to wait till tomorrow, when I'm at work.

I will say, I've had lifter noise (or some type of internal tapping) for years. I had the compression and oil pressure tested, as well as audibly inspected by various mechanics- even w a stethoscope. The assessment from all- It cannot be pinpointed. It does runs great, no symptoms other than the noise. But no mechanic wants to guess what it is and risk a failed attempt at fixing it.

Its my 'fun' ride and weekend trail runner. I've had it for almost 4 years and it's accumulated 50k since. Drove it daily for 2.5 years. At this point, I'll wait till it dies......if it does.


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[bobthetj03]

I've had a similar tick. I've tried Marvel, lifter free, and high mileage oil. Nothing helped. I finally decided to try something out of the box. Spent a week driving the jeep like I stole it. 4500 rpms getting on freeway on ramps, just plain drove it hard for a solid week. Gas mileage took a hit, but tick went away and stayed away. Yes, unconventional, but I was at my wits end, and figured if it's gonna blow, at least then I'd have a good excuse to spend all that time and $$$ to tear it apart.

 

[Kyle_W]

Lame me. I'll have to wait till tomorrow, when I'm at work.

I will say, I've had lifter noise (or some type of internal tapping) for years. I had the compression and oil pressure tested, as well as audibly inspected by various mechanics- even w a stethoscope. The assessment from all- It cannot be pinpointed. It does runs great, no symptoms other than the noise. But no mechanic wants to guess what it is and risk a failed attempt at fixing it.

Its my 'fun' ride and weekend trail runner. I've had it for almost 4 years and it's accumulated 50k since. Drove it daily for 2.5 years. At this point, I'll wait till it dies......if it does.


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Well sir, it's tempting to just let it ride like you did yours! And you haven't had any issues! But the damn noise is driving me crazy.....

I've had a similar tick. I've tried Marvel, lifter free, and high mileage oil. Nothing helped. I finally decided to try something out of the box. Spent a week driving the jeep like I stole it. 4500 rpms getting on freeway on ramps, just plain drove it hard for a solid week. Gas mileage took a hit, but tick went away and stayed away. Yes, unconventional, but I was at my wits end, and figured if it's gonna blow, at least then I'd have a good excuse to spend all that time and $$$ to tear it apart.

I remember your post in the ATF fluid thread - did you have an almost constant ticking while driving down the road? How long did you have the ticking?

Thanks guys!

 

[bobthetj03]

My ticking was random and inconsistent. It would do it cold or hot. It would tick, then go away, then come back.

 

[Mike_H]

I don't know...that doesn't really sound like lifter tick to me. Almost sounds like exhaust, and that CAN come and go, seemingly at random as the manifold heat cycles. Had to say without hearing it in person.

Have you checked your exhaust manifold, by chance?

 

[94c2500]

I don't know...that doesn't really sound like lifter tick to me. Almost sounds like exhaust, and that CAN come and go, seemingly at random as the manifold heat cycles. Had to say without hearing it in person.

Have you checked your exhaust manifold, by chance?

Not very good audio in that video link, but my first impression was an exhaust leak, or maybe a loose spark plug?
Should be easy enough to check those areas before pulling the valve cover etc...
I've seen a couple of instances where a rocker arm bracket was bent off-center on high mileage 4.0's that resulted in excessive pushrod-to-rocker clearance resulting in tapping. Bending them back straight solved that problem.
Would be easy to find with the valve cover off.

I'm just taking a wild stab at the problem of course...

 

[Kyle_W]

Funny ya'll say that. That's what my Grandpa thought it was too. Damn ya'll smart people. I never listen to ya'll.

I just never got around to looking at the manifold! I'll look at it after work. But, so it comes and goes as the (possible) crack in the manifold expands and retracts?

 

[JWjeepSask]

I'm just installing new lifters I'm to lazy to trouble shoot through everything


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[Mike_H]

Funny ya'll say that. That's what my Grandpa thought it was too. Damn ya'll smart people. I never listen to ya'll.

I just never got around to looking at the manifold! I'll look at it after work. But, so it comes and goes as the (possible) crack in the manifold expands and retracts?

Yeah, and different vibration responses causing different orders of harmonics...Not sure what year your Wrangler is, but there are two styles of manifold...one cast that is on the later models, and a tubular one that is prone to cracking on the earlier models.

 

[Kyle_W]

I'm just installing new lifters I'm to lazy to trouble shoot through everything

That's hardly the "lazy" way to fix the problem! That's hard!!

Yeah, and different vibration responses causing different orders of harmonics...Not sure what year your Wrangler is, but there are two styles of manifold...one cast that is on the later models, and a tubular one that is prone to cracking on the earlier models.

Mine is a 2002. I guess, if I end up having to replace my manifold, would it be recommended to replace it with aftermarket exhaust? Or in this case is OEM the way to go?

 

[Kyle_W]

How are you supposed to check your exhaust manifold? The dank intake manifold completely covers it up.

 

[bobthetj03]

That's the tricky part.

 

[Mike_H]

If you can look around with a flashlight and maybe a mirror, you should see sooty residue where its cracked. Also, you might be able to start then engine and look / listen on the driver's side. If you do it first thing in the morning, while its still cool out, you might see the steam escaping too.

 

[Brantley]

How do you drive it? Are you always easy on it like a grandma, or are you regularly on the gas pedal and taking it to high rpm every once in a while? if you drive it like a grandma, my bets would be on it needing to be driven hard for a while.

I've had a tick before that's a very common noise in the older 4.0L that I have, and I was able to get it pretty much gone by driving it pretty hard as well. If it still exists, I don't notice it anymore, though I believe it's gone now.

When you're on the highway, drive about 65 mph and shift to 3rd and just drive it like that for a few minutes. Accelerate hard for a few weeks. See if it goes away. With your 3.73 and 33's, 65 in 3rd won't hurt it, my 4.10 gears and 31's were driving me at 65 in 3rd yesterday at about 4200 rpm so you'll be near there or lower on the rpm scale.

The main thing is to drive it hard for a while. With your rather undesirable gearing, it might need to be driven hard for a while. Give it a shot. In the mean time, you can check the exhaust manifold but I highly doubt it cracked since you have an 02.

If that doesn't fix it, you can probably drive it fine on a tapping lifter for a while but eventually you'll probably want to get in there and swap them out.

I'd take it to some higher rpm for a while. If you're afraid to do it, bring that thing over to College Station and I'll do it for you.

 

[bobthetj03]

How do you drive it? Are you always easy on it like a grandma, or are you regularly on the gas pedal and taking it to high rpm every once in a while? if you drive it like a grandma, my bets would be on it needing to be driven hard for a while. Based on you saying

I've had a tick before that's a very common noise in the older 4.0L that I have, and I was able to get it pretty much gone by driving it pretty hard as well. If it still exists, I don't notice it anymore, though I believe it's gone now.

When you're on the highway, drive about 65 mph and shift to 3rd and just drive it like that for a few minutes. Accelerate hard for a few weeks. See if it goes away. With your 3.73 and 33's, 65 in 3rd won't hurt it, my 4.10 gears and 31's were driving me at 65 in 3rd yesterday at about 4200 rpm so you'll be near there or lower on the rpm scale.

The main thing is to drive it hard for a while. With your rather undesirable gearing, it might need to be driven hard for a while. Give it a shot. In the mean time, you can check the exhaust manifold but I highly doubt it cracked since you have an 02.

If that doesn't fix it, you can probably drive it fine on a tapping lifter for a while but eventually you'll probably want to get in there and swap them out.

I'd take it to some higher rpm for a while. If you're afraid to do it, bring that thing over to College Station and I'll do it for you.

This^^^

 

[Kyle_W]

If you can look around with a flashlight and maybe a mirror, you should see sooty residue where its cracked. Also, you might be able to start then engine and look / listen on the driver's side. If you do it first thing in the morning, while its still cool out, you might see the steam escaping too.

How do you drive it? Are you always easy on it like a grandma, or are you regularly on the gas pedal and taking it to high rpm every once in a while? if you drive it like a grandma, my bets would be on it needing to be driven hard for a while.

I've had a tick before that's a very common noise in the older 4.0L that I have, and I was able to get it pretty much gone by driving it pretty hard as well. If it still exists, I don't notice it anymore, though I believe it's gone now.

When you're on the highway, drive about 65 mph and shift to 3rd and just drive it like that for a few minutes. Accelerate hard for a few weeks. See if it goes away. With your 3.73 and 33's, 65 in 3rd won't hurt it, my 4.10 gears and 31's were driving me at 65 in 3rd yesterday at about 4200 rpm so you'll be near there or lower on the rpm scale.

The main thing is to drive it hard for a while. With your rather undesirable gearing, it might need to be driven hard for a while. Give it a shot. In the mean time, you can check the exhaust manifold but I highly doubt it cracked since you have an 02.

If that doesn't fix it, you can probably drive it fine on a tapping lifter for a while but eventually you'll probably want to get in there and swap them out.

I'd take it to some higher rpm for a while. If you're afraid to do it, bring that thing over to College Station and I'll do it for you.

Thank ya'll for your help! I have been driving it pretty hard, for my standards (yes I do drive like a Grandma), per ya'll's recommendations, and the ticking has dropped in frequency (time will tell though if this is just a coincidence).

I also took the best pictures I could of the exhaust; I didn't see any cracks or soot:

Here is also what my engine sounds like after I changed the oil for the 2nd time; no ticking. Sounds fine to me?

https://photos.google.com/share/AF1...?key=NW0xRkdWQ2RJZjA4LTl3VkdnT0V3eXdwcUZZRGl3

Anddddd here is the crack on my Radiator, waiting for the time to change it out; would ya'll be overly concerned?

 

[bobthetj03]

That radiator is rough brah.