I'm a new member here on the forum. I've had a 2000 Jeep TJ for a little over a year and installed a few upgrades. I have some questions concerning the Dana 35 differential expected performance after upgrading. I understand the desired upgrade would be to install a Dana 44 or Ford 8.8 but need to really understand why. The Dana 44 with the 30 spine axle is only ~ 11% larger than the 27 spine Dana 35. The Dana 35 Alloy 27 spine alloy axles data claim they are 30% stronger than stock axles which I can assume the Dana 35 axles with 30 spine would be ~ 41% stronger than the standard 27 spine Dana 35 axles based on it's increased diameter. Would it be correct to assume both the 27 spine Dana 35 alloy and 30 spine alloy would be stronger than the standard Dana 44 steel axles?
Axle questions
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Stox5225
TJ Enthusiast
Honestly, I don’t know lol. I would assume diameter of the axle shafts would come into play here. The Dana 44 is a bigger unit in general, not just in the pumpkin.
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Not necessarily. You can get the Super 35 kit and turn your Dana 35 axle into a fully capable axle that will run 35" tires without any issue... no joke. Check out this thread here: Should I upgrade my Dana 35 axle?
The Dana 35 gets a bad rep, when it's actually not that bad of an axle. The reason people blow those things up all the time is because they stick 35s on a stock Dana 35, go out and wheel, and they instantly break. The Super 35 kit addresses this by fixing the weak points of the Dana 35 axle. When you have that setup with some alloy shafts and a locker, you won't have any issue at all running 35" tires.
I can't comment on the strength of those axle shafts as I don't know for sure. You're reasoning sounds accurate, but without doing some sort of actual real world testing, it's impossible to say for certain.
@Jerry Bransford likely knows more about this than I do, but I'm just giving you the parts I do know. A Dana 35 doesn't have to be a bad axle. I don't think it would be worth swapping out a Dana 35 for a Dana 44 unless you got the Dana 44 for a really good price. If I was going to go through the hassle of swapping in another axle, it would be a RockJock 44 or RockJock 60 if the application called for it.
The Dana 35 gets a bad rep, when it's actually not that bad of an axle. The reason people blow those things up all the time is because they stick 35s on a stock Dana 35, go out and wheel, and they instantly break. The Super 35 kit addresses this by fixing the weak points of the Dana 35 axle. When you have that setup with some alloy shafts and a locker, you won't have any issue at all running 35" tires.
I can't comment on the strength of those axle shafts as I don't know for sure. You're reasoning sounds accurate, but without doing some sort of actual real world testing, it's impossible to say for certain.
@Jerry Bransford likely knows more about this than I do, but I'm just giving you the parts I do know. A Dana 35 doesn't have to be a bad axle. I don't think it would be worth swapping out a Dana 35 for a Dana 44 unless you got the Dana 44 for a really good price. If I was going to go through the hassle of swapping in another axle, it would be a RockJock 44 or RockJock 60 if the application called for it.
Thanks for the replies and link to "Should I upgrade my Dana 35 axle?". The thread contained a lot of good information and I found answers to most of my questions. Was curious on the real advantage for just upgrading axles vs the popular entire differential upgrade. My understanding now for bragging rights you upgrade to a Dana 44. However you should expect similar are better performance out of the Dana 35 than you would the Dana 44 when the complete Super 35 upgrade kit is installed. Also now understand upgrading the Dana 35 with just the 27 spine alloy axles leaves the stock spider gears exposed as the weak point. A lunchbox locker install should be considered when just installing the 27 spine alloy axles to upgrade spider gears. All feedback appreciated. Thanks
Yes, the alloy 30 spline axles are stronger than the factory Dana 44 axles. Just because the spline count is 11% bigger (Dana 35 to Dana 44), doesn't mean the strength follows (it doesn't). So, your first point about the difference between the Dana 35 27 spline and Dana 44 30 spline doesn't hold up. Another note, the housing and tubes are stronger on a 44,, not to mention you can buy alloy shafts for a Dana 44...thus far surpassing the strength of a Dana 35.
All that said, do you NEED to run a Dana 44? Probably not. As Chris said, S35 kit will be plenty good (until you bend a tube).
It’s my understanding the 35/44 tubes are identical & there’s at least some indication that the 35 housing is actually more rigid, @Jerry Bransford can explain the origin of those details. Bottom line the TJ 44 while certainly a preferable axle to start out life with isn’t all that much to write home about, the next generation is a whole different ball game & the fully aftermarket 44 offered by Currie encompasses all the newer bigger stronger elements which makes it a whole different ‘Dana44’ than Jeep was putting under Wranglers during the TJs production. Of course that comes at a whopping price, so you hit the nail right on the head as the real question always comes back to whether or not you need it or any upgrade for that matter, individual usage is by far the most relevant consideration.
I know the knuckles and such on the front Dana 44 in Wrangler usage is the same as the Dana 30 (so its like a hybrid...Dana 44 center section, Dana 30 tubes and outers), but I didn't realize that about the rear 44. I'll have to do some research.
The real issue with Dana 35 in the stock form is with larger tires and locker. Based on my own personal experience having snapped Dana 35 axle shafts twice in the past. both times I was locked and was running 33" tires with 3.07 gears. A stock Dana 44 has larger diameter shafts therefore stonger. As @Chris stated above a Super #5 kit would also take care of the issue. I have a friend who ran 37's locked on a Super 35 and never broke them.
The benefits I’ve heard cited of the TJ rear 44 include bigger ring/pinion & the non-C-clip design. The lack of a C-clip of course can be huge if you sheer a shaft because with a C-clip you’re stuck trying to figure out how to strap your wheel to your rig while you drag it out of the trails. That alone makes the 44 a ‘better’ axle in my view. The benefits of a bigger ring/pinion vary depending on who you ask, but it appears from the anecdotal evidence I’ve read over the past 2 years that the ring/pinion on a 35 isn’t a really common breaking point & accounts for only a negligible percentage of 35 failures. I think if you were to erase all accounts of broken stock 35 shafts from the history of the planet such that all we knew of were its other failures I don’t think we’d ever be talking about the Dana 35 as a bad axle, or at least it wouldn’t enjoy its current status as a horrendous axle with so many people.
Edit: by the way as for the pinion they're actually fairly comparable in size
Trying to figure out what you have, I see you upgraded to 4.56 gearing and lockers, I assume they're on your stock shafts? If so I think you're running some risks if you're taking that off road, particularly with the rear. I'm guessing it's some kind of auto locker in the rear? I would at a minimum get the stronger 27 spline shafts in there, better still of course the full S35
Ah yes both times I broke mine I had to have a buddy keep kicking my wheel back in because it kept sliding out LOL. good ole memories
The 27 spline alloy axle would be about as strong as a stock 44 axle. The 30 spline 35 axle is stronger than a stock 44 axle. While the c clip itself is a non issue, shearing an axle does become a problem on a c clipped axle.
Those are my thoughts also. I currently have a Dana 35 with 4.56 gears, 27 spine alloy axles, Detroit Truetrac limited slip locker with 33" tires. Wanted to determine if additional changes/upgrades were necessary for light to medium offroad use. Seems like the setup should be okay with my current tire size and expected use. Thanks for the input.
The axle tubes used on the TJ's Dana 35 and Dana 44 are identical, they were cut from literally the same axle tube stock.
You should be fine with that setup. A stock Dana 35 is, generally speaking, fine with 33's and a Detroit Truetrac limited slip differential.
However, understand this... that while Truetracs are superb on pavement like when the the streets are slick from ice, Truetracs are next to useless for offroad terrain that is uneven enough to lift a tire on the Truetrac axle off the ground. Truetracs just don't help in that situation. And in case someone suggests you just need to use a little braking action to improve how a Truetrac works, that's true but only by a very small amount... not enough to really help. I did that like crazy trying to get my Truetracs to help more when the terrain got a little more difficult but it just didn't do enough to really help.
I didn't understand this 20 years ago and I installed front and rear Detroit Truetracs. They were essentially useless and of no help on the terrain I enjoyed wheeling on so I replaced them both with true lockers which is what really helps offroad.
If you really want to offroad and not replace that rear Dana 35, I'd install a Super 35 kit from either Revolution Gear or Yukon, with Revolution Gear being my first choice. That will convert your Dana 35's carbon steel 27 spline shafts to significantly larger diameter 30 spline 1541H alloy axle shafts that are stronger than the TJ's stock Dana 44 axle shafts are. A Super 35 kit includes your choice of a couple lockers. That upgrade would make your Dana 35 truly worthy of wheeling in pretty much any terrain you'd have the nerve to tackle and handle up to 35" tires without a problem.
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