Rubicon driveshaft vibes

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Long Rider

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I have a 2005 Rubicon with a 4 inch lift (probably Rough Country). The transfer case is lowered one inch, probably from Rough country too. All from the PO.

There is vibration at around 70 MPH. It's done this since I bought it and It seems to be getting worse.
I will be checking pinion angle tonight. I suspect it's fairly close to desired angle.

If angles are correct, should I pull the drive shaft and run it on 4 high and check for vibes?
If I do, is it safe to run a rubicon with 33In tires up to 75 mph off the front wheels?
Will the lift effect front drive shaft angles and vibrations at this speed?
If it doesn't vibrate, is there anything other than the removed driveshaft that could be causing the vibration?
Lastly, If it is the driveshaft, who do y'all recommend I buy the replacement from?

Thanks!
 
Long Rider said:
I have a 2005 Rubicon with a 4 inch lift (probably Rough Country). The transfer case is lowered one inch, probably from Rough country too. All from the PO.
Click to expand...

In the long run you'll want an SYE and DC driveshaft.

Long Rider said:
There is vibration at around 70 MPH. It's done this since I bought it and It seems to be getting worse.
Click to expand...

Don't discredit the tires. In fact, the first thing I would do is go to a reputable shop and have the wheels and tired balanced and inspected. More often than not this is the true source of vibrations.

Long Rider said:
If angles are correct, should I pull the drive shaft and run it on 4 high and check for vibes?
Click to expand...

Yes, I would.

Long Rider said:
If I do, is it safe to run a rubicon with 33In tires up to 75 mph off the front wheels?
Click to expand...

Yes, you'll be fine.

Long Rider said:
Will the lift effect front drive shaft angles and vibrations at this speed?
Click to expand...

The lift will affect driveshaft angles of course. In the long run you want a SYE and a DC driveshaft.

Long Rider said:
If it doesn't vibrate, is there anything other than the removed driveshaft that could be causing the vibration?
Click to expand...

Don't rule out tires. Often times vibrations are caused by improperly balanced or worn tires.

Long Rider said:
Lastly, If it is the driveshaft, who do y'all recommend I buy the replacement from?
Click to expand...

Tom Wood is one of the go to guys around here for driveshafts.
 
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I would expect vibrations on a SWB TJ with 4" of suspension lift with only a tcase drop. Install a replacement aftermarket DC driveshaft which also requires adjustable length rear control arms. Remove the tcase drop when you do this. This is a good source for the DC driveshaft... Www.4xshaft.com
 
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just a quick comment, OP mentioned he has a rubicon, the Rubicon model WON't require a SYE but will require a DC driveshaft, regarding brandings I agree with Chris about Tom Woods but I would add to Adams as well.. (I have Adams)

with the DC driveshaft and a well adjusted angles by rotating the pinion with adjustable upper rear control arms you should be fine.. but first things first... go to a shop and check your tires balance... (as Chris metioned)


20220606_160625 new.jpg

No SYE is needed (this photo was before I added my Adams DC driveshaft)

Ps. Rubicon Express adjustable rear upper control arms are on sale at 99 bucks right now on Amazon, might not be the best brand but for 99 bucks? its a pretty good deal....
 
I just went through this with the LJR when I did a bit of a tummy tuck. My vibes started way earlier around 35mph and under load. When I called woods to order a new shaft they said the Rubicon OEM shafts tap out around 10-11 degrees, I was at 14 degrees.
 
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Chris said:
In the long run you'll want an SYE and DC driveshaft.



Don't discredit the tires. In fact, the first thing I would do is go to a reputable shop and have the wheels and tired balanced and inspected. More often than not this is the true source of vibrations.



Yes, I would.



Yes, you'll be fine.



The lift will affect driveshaft angles of course. In the long run you want a SYE and a DC driveshaft.



Don't rule out tires. Often times vibrations are caused by improperly balanced or worn tires.



Tom Wood is one of the go to guys around here for driveshafts.
Click to expand...

It's a Rubicon, so it already has a SYE. It has a cadron driveshaft too.
I don't know if it's a factory shaft or not.

The front end was poorly aligned, which wore out the front tires. I changed over to the solid tie rod and had the front end aligned and new front tires, mounted and balanced.

The thing is, it seemed to make the vibrations worse.
 
Don Bulee said:
just a quick comment, OP mentioned he has a rubicon, the Rubicon model WON't require a SYE but will require a DC driveshaft, regarding brandings I agree with Chris about Tom Woods but I would add to Adams as well.. (I have Adams)

with the DC driveshaft and a well adjusted angles by rotating the pinion with adjustable upper rear control arms you should be fine.. but first things first... go to a shop and check your tires balance... (as Chris metioned)


View attachment 417593

No SYE is needed (this photo was before I added my Adams DC driveshaft)

Ps. Rubicon Express adjustable rear upper control arms are on sale at 99 bucks right now on Amazon, might not be the best brand but for 99 bucks? its a pretty good deal....
Click to expand...

The (probably) Rough Country lift already has adjustable upper arms. I wonder if they have enough adjustment?
 
Camdenst said:
I just went through this with the LJR when I did a bit of a tummy tuck. My vibes started way earlier around 35mph and under load. When I called woods to order a new shaft they said the Rubicon OEM shafts tap out around 10-11 degrees, I was at 14 degrees.
Click to expand...

My driveshaft angle is 11 degrees and my axle is at 10 degrees. Does it need adjusting? If so, what are the optimal angles? I plan on removing the transfer case drop, so I'm guessing I need to get a new driveshaft anyway, correct?
 
Long Rider said:
My driveshaft angle is 11 degrees and my axle is at 10 degrees. Does it need adjusting? If so, what are the optimal angles? I plan on removing the transfer case drop, so I'm guessing I need to get a new driveshaft anyway, correct?
Click to expand...
With the factory driveshaft the rear axle's pinion angle is supposed to be the same as the transfer case output shaft angle. Like shown below for the 2 u-joint factory driveshaft. The driveshaft angle is irrelevant where the rear pinion angle is concerned for the factory 2 u-joint rear driveshaft.

But to get rid of your tcase drop you need to replace the factory 2 u-joint driveshaft with a 3 u-joint driveshaft called a DC (double-cardan) or more commonly a CV (constant velocity). DC is actually the more correct term than CV is but that's a different story.

The driveshaft angle become more relevant with the CV 3 u-joint driveshaft because for it, the rear pinion angle needs to be the same as the driveshaft. In other words the pinion shaft will be aimed directly up the driveshaft and pointed at the CV joint. To be able to raise the pinion angle so it's correct for the replacement CV driveshaft you need adjustable length control arms for the rear axle.

This is the factory driveshaft.... 2 u-joints
2joint_angle.jpg


This is the type of driveshaft that will allow you to get rid of the tcase drop.

cv_angle-.jpg
 
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Jerry Bransford said:
With the factory driveshaft the rear axle's pinion angle is supposed to be the same as the transfer case output shaft angle. Like shown below for the 2 u-joint factory driveshaft. The driveshaft angle is irrelevant where the rear pinion angle is concerned for the factory 2 u-joint rear driveshaft.

But to get rid of your tcase drop you need to replace the factory 2 u-joint driveshaft with a 3 u-joint driveshaft called a DC (double-cardan) or more commonly a CV (constant velocity). DC is actually the more correct term than CV is but that's a different story.

The driveshaft angle become more relevant with the CV 3 u-joint driveshaft because for it, the rear pinion angle needs to be the same as the driveshaft. In other words the pinion shaft will be aimed directly up the driveshaft and pointed at the CV joint. To be able to raise the pinion angle so it's correct for the replacement CV driveshaft you need adjustable length control arms for the rear axle.

This is the factory driveshaft.... 2 u-joints
View attachment 417705

This is the type of driveshaft that will allow you to get rid of the tcase drop.

View attachment 417706
Click to expand...

Thanks for the refresher. Back when I was a kid, this kind of information and even dual cadron CVs were not available to many.
It has a CV and adjustable upper arms already installed.
The shaft angle is 11 degrees and the pinion angle is 10 degrees.
.
My plan:
Drop rear shaft out this afternoon and see if the vibes change or disappear.
If they do not, I will re-install and do the same with the front.
If the vibes continue regardless of shaft presence, then I will spend the money on checking the balance of all 4 wheels at a separate shop from where I had the front tires replaced last week.
.
If it goes away with rear shaft removal, I'll buy new shaft with CVs and a new U-joint from Mr Wood.
 
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Camdenst said:
I just went through this with the LJR when I did a bit of a tummy tuck. My vibes started way earlier around 35mph and under load. When I called woods to order a new shaft they said the Rubicon OEM shafts tap out around 10-11 degrees, I was at 14 degrees.
Click to expand...

So, a new shaft fixed it?
 
New 06 Rubicon owner (1st jeep ever) came with 3.5" suspension lift 1.5" body lift and 1" motor mount lift....if adding rear upper adjustable control arms with this setup (using a DC driveshaft) setting pinion, wont the rotation of the axle put the springs out of alignment? or am I over thinking this?
 
Last edited:
danstockwell said:
New 06 Rubicon owner (1st jeep ever) came with 3.5" suspension lift 1.5" body lift and 1" motor mount lift....if adding rear upper adjustable control arms with this setup (using a DC driveshaft) setting pinion, wont the rotation of the axle put the springs out of alignment? or am I over thinking this?
Click to expand...

It will have a slight bend in the spring but as long as the bump stops still engage each other you’ll be fine. Most will relocate the upper spring perch to keep the spring and bumps contacting in the vertical fashion is was made for if the pinion rotation is extreme.
 
Jerry Bransford said:
To be able to raise the pinion angle so it's correct for the replacement CV driveshaft you need adjustable length control arms for the rear axle.
Click to expand...

Are only UPPER rear adjustable arms needed to adjust the pinion angle for the DC driveshaft? Or is it highly preferred/necessary to use both UPPER and LOWER rear adjustable control arms?

Thanks.
 
HaydukeLives! said:
Are only UPPER rear adjustable arms needed to adjust the pinion angle for the DC driveshaft? Or is it highly preferred/necessary to use both UPPER and LOWER rear adjustable control arms?

Thanks.
Click to expand...

Yes only the rear uppers are needed (that’s what I currently have) I would also recommend getting a quality one preferred with a Johnny joint (had a rough country one and didn’t last a year) as well double adjustable so it’ll make life a lot easier to get it set up.
https://savvyoffroad.com/product/ce-9103sa/
This is the one I’m running and will be getting the rest of the set once money allows.
 
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HaydukeLives! said:
Are only UPPER rear adjustable arms needed to adjust the pinion angle for the DC driveshaft? Or is it highly preferred/necessary to use both UPPER and LOWER rear adjustable control arms?
Click to expand...
You can raise the pinion angle to the desired angle with just upper adjustable length control arms. Having uppers and lowers allows more precise location of the axle but you can definitely get away with just the uppers. Not to mention the suspension lift moves the rear axle forward a bit but adjusting the upper arm to raise the pinion angle up as required by the DC driveshaft helps move the rear axle back some.
 
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Jerry Bransford said:
You can raise the pinion angle to the desired angle with just upper adjustable length control arms. Having uppers and lowers allows more precise location of the axle but you can definitely get away with just the uppers. Not to mention the suspension lift moves the rear axle forward a bit but adjusting the upper arm to raise the pinion angle up as required by the DC driveshaft helps move the rear axle back some.
Click to expand...

going to go with a tom woods driveshaft, my rubicon has a 1" raised motor mounts, stock rear control arms now (have clayton upper and lower overlands ready to go on) my current pinion angle looks like the angle of the pic you posted with the double cardan 3 joint set up (have a angle gauge on the way) ...my question is, when ordering the drive shaft do I measure, the current angle from the edge of the yoke to flange or make the pinion straight first??? like the pic of the stock 2 joint set up???https://4xshaft.com/collections/jeep-tj/products/tj-rubicon-rear-shaft
 
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