Smooth(er) Ride

[Jerry Bransford]

The best ride quality you are going to get is with a long arm system which many of the people on this forum run.

Not true, you've read too many long-arm suspension ads. At the ride heights we run here, short arms don't get anywhere near to a steep enough angle to cause a stiff ride as the long arm suspension lift manufacturers want us to think happens. I had a long-arm suspension in my previous TJ and it rode no better than its previous short arm suspensions nor did it ride even as well as my current TJ does with its Currie short arm suspension with Rancho RS5000x shocks.

The key to a good ride is proper shock selection and proper tire inflation pressure, not the length of the control arms.

Not to mention the best thing that long arms do is get hung up on the rocks FAR more easily. When I was running long arms, they were constantly getting hung up on the rocks. Constantly. Multiple times a day.

Here are a few pics of my previous TJ with its long arm suspension (which I'll never run another)... the first one was one that a couple friends turned into the meme.... mrblaine took the photo while we were wheeling on a trail called Sunbonnet in Johnson Valley. The last photo is the one time my TJ made it into a magazine... with its front long arm hung up on a rock.

 

[Alex01]

Not true, you've read too many long-arm suspension ads. At the ride heights we run here, short arms don't get anywhere near to a steep enough angle to cause a stiff ride as the long arm suspension lift manufacturers want us to think happens. I had a long-arm suspension in my previous TJ and it rode no better than its previous short arm suspensions nor did it ride even as well as my current TJ does with its Currie short arm suspension with Rancho RS5000x shocks.

The key to a good ride is proper shock selection and proper tire inflation pressure, not the length of the control arms.

Not to mention the best thing that long arms do is get hung up on the rocks FAR more easily. When I was running long arms, they were constantly getting hung up on the rocks. Constantly. Multiple times a day.

Here are a few pics of my previous TJ with its long arm suspension (which I'll never run another)... the first one was one that a couple friends turned into the meme.... mrblaine took the photo while we were wheeling on a trail called Sunbonnet in Johnson Valley. The last photo is the one time my TJ made it into a magazine... with its front long arm hung up on a rock.

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Jerry... I have been around these forums long enough to know that there is a ton of experience behind what you say. But in order for me to fully jump on board will need more pictures

 

[Jerry Bransford]

Jerry... I have been around these forums long enough to know that there is a ton of experience behind what you say. But in order for me to fully jump on board will need more pictures

Alright just one more, just for you lol. And this one's not of me, just so everyone knows other people besides me get stuck with their long arms.

 

[bobthetj03]

My TJ weighs in at 3460 lbs. with a full tank of fuel and my fat ass in the seat, front winch, minimalist bumpers. My KM2's has 26K miles on them, mostly street driven miles. I have ran them at 26 psi. from new, unless loaded down, then 28 psi. Rotation every 5K miles. Wear is pretty darn even across the tire, with the center of tires just slightly worn more than the outer edge. By that indication, I can probably drop down even more to 24 or 25 psi. and still get even wear across the board.

 

[JMT]

If you're running the proper Load Range C 33" tire, there's no way its center tread should have been "bulging excessively" at 26 psi unless you're misinterpreting the tread shape. I can only see happening that if it was an improper Load Range D or even worse, a Load Range E. The air pressures I and most here recommend are based on the proper Load Range C tire.

My tire is C Load, and I ran 26 initially. I don’t know why it seems harsh, probably bc of the Bilstein’s that I can’t wait to take off and replace with rancho 5000x. That will be about a month. I agree with you though, and will get back in the 26 Zone soon

 

[Jerry Bransford]

I don’t know why it seems harsh, probably bc of the Bilstein’s

Yup.

 

[jjvw]

The best ride quality you are going to get is with a long arm system which many of the people on this forum run. ...

I am among the few that went to longer arms (and an arguably top tier setup) without making changes to the tires, springs or shocks. Any change to the ride quality was negligable between short and longer arms. While there were real changes to certain characteristics such as an increase in body roll, I attribute those to the control arm joints and the 3/4 link providing less inherent bind in the suspension - not from arm length.

Having recently made significant changes to my shocks, I can confidently say that they will absolutely have the greatest impact on your Jeep's ride quality along with tire pressure.

The Jeep is my daily driver, btw. I am fairly sensitive to it's changes in behavior.

2003 Rubicon

 

[superduty]

I am among the few that went to longer arms (and an arguably top tier setup) without making changes to the tires, springs or shocks. Any change to the ride quality was negligable between short and longer arms. While there were real changes to certain characteristics such as an increase in body roll, I attribute those to the control arm joints and the 3/4 link providing less inherent bind in the suspension - not from arm length.

Having recently made significant changes to my shocks, I can confidently say that they will absolutely have the greatest impact on your Jeep's ride quality along with tire pressure.

The Jeep is my daily driver, btw. I am fairly sensitive to it's changes in behavior.

2003 Rubicon

Which shocks did you go with?

 

[jjvw]

Which shocks did you go with?

Rancho rs5000x up front

Fox Remote remote reservoirs in the back

Relocated mounts for more travel on both ends.

2003 Rubicon

 

[Mike Jolley]

I currently have two Jeeps, a 2004 TJ and a 2006 LJ plus my sister has a 2004 TJ. My 2004 TJ with Skyjacker soft ride coils and Rancho shocks rode best until I replaced my Rubicon Express 5.5” springs with Currie 4”/4.5” springs on my LJ now I think it rides better. The LJ is on a RE longarm lift but I don’t recommend it over a short arm if you keep lift to 4” or less. The LJ has RE monotube shocks.

I’m very impressed with the Currie springs. Ride quality is a combination of springs and shocks. From an engineering standpoint the springs job is to support the weight and the shocks job is to reduce the bounce cycles from a deflection. The Currie springs have several advantages over your RE springs but they won’t fix your ride if the shocks are not doing the right thing.

 

[jchadscud]

Thanks for the input everyone. It turns out I was driving a dump truck... Tire PSI was at 40!

Lowered to 28 and the difference is amazing!

 

[dylansalrin]

Alright just one more, just for you lol. And this one's not of me, just so everyone knows other people besides me get stuck with their long arms.

View attachment 37347

Jerry I know that’s not yours but would you happen to know what rocker guards those are? Looks like genright corners but those aren’t genright sliders.

 

[mrblaine]

but softer springs would help.

No they won't.

 

[mrblaine]

I don't know of any specifically but I have heard there are some dual rate coils out there for TJs which would provide a more cushy ride.

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In what way?

 

[mrblaine]

The best ride quality you are going to get is with a long arm system which many of the people on this forum run.

If that were true, then two other things would not be true. I would not have removed several long arm kits in favor of installing shorter arm builds and I wouldn't have to work on so many rigs to try and improve the ride quality that have long arm kits.

Airing down the tires will make a huge difference. The tire place put 33 psi in mine when they installed and the jeep rode like a dump truck. I have it at 25 psi now and it is significantly better.

So what happens if you over-inflate the tires on a long arm kit rig?

Shocks obviously also have a large impact on ride quality. In my opinion though a stiff spring has to have some impact on ride quality. If the spring is too soft the jeep would want to bounce endlessly causing the shock to need to work overtime and most likely premature failure. On the flip side is the spring is to stiff then the shock would work much less thus having a smaller affect on the over all ride quality.

Spoken exactly like someone who has never done any experimentation to teach themselves anything about how their rig works. This is very simple, go remove your rear shocks, if you are brave, do the fronts as well. Go for a short drive. Can you tell how stiff or soft the springs are?

For people with short arms and have a good ride quality what is your setup?

Hope you get it to a point where you are happy with it.

Good tires and good well tuned shocks have more value than anything else within the constraints of reasonable lift heights for a given tire size.

 

[balfred]

In what way?

Why do you have to be such a hater? A dual rate coil compresses in two stages so yes it does make a difference. The difference might be small and depending on shock choice might make more or less of a difference but it does matter. Now bang for your buck is shocks first, coils second *not taking tire pressure into consideration. The science behind coil diameter, spacing, number of coils and overall the rate is so complicated and will change the potential for ride quality as those values change.

I was teasing with the hater comment btw

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[mrblaine]

Here are a few pics of my previous TJ with its long arm suspension (which I'll never run another)... the first one was one that a couple friends turned into the meme.... mrblaine took the photo while we were wheeling on a trail called Sunbonnet in Johnson Valley. The last photo is the one time my TJ made it into a magazine... with its front long arm hung up on a rock.

You left out the best part.
I'm watching Jerry with a big stuck. He works it forward and back and it ain't going anywhere. I flag him to stop for a minute so I can walk up to the rig without getting rocks kicked all over me. Lean in and ask him if he has his camera with him and he says yes. I tell him to give it to me and back up a couple of feet and take that picture with his camera and give it back to him. HaHa, you're stuck.

 

[mrblaine]

I am among the few that went to longer arms (and an arguably top tier setup) without making changes to the tires, springs or shocks. Any change to the ride quality was negligable between short and longer arms. While there were real changes to certain characteristics such as an increase in body roll, I attribute those to the control arm joints and the 3/4 link providing less inherent bind in the suspension - not from arm length.

Having recently made significant changes to my shocks, I can confidently say that they will absolutely have the greatest impact on your Jeep's ride quality along with tire pressure.

The Jeep is my daily driver, btw. I am fairly sensitive to it's changes in behavior.

2003 Rubicon

We experimented with the mid arm on Matt's rig when we converted it. We did it in stages even though it was a lot more work to do it that way.
1- rear mid arm suspension only, NO other changes
2-front mid arm only, NO other changes.
3-Rear outboard shocks, no other changes.
4-front shock work, no other changes.
5- stretch the rear out to 101" of WB.

In all of those, the only noticeable improvement in ride quality other than negligible amounts that would not have been noticed by anyone else but Matt, the shock work is the only thing that made a difference.

 

[Jeepaholic]

I had RE springs with ome nitro sports. I thought it rode like a covered wagon, because I couldn't get the suspension to budge even if I bounced on the front bumper. So I assumed the springs were too stiff. If I remember correctly, MrBlaine said it wasn't the how stiff the springs were, but rather where the springs had my shocks sitting in their range of travel. So I measured, had about 3" of shock up travel. I then put my metalcloak springs in, which raised it another inch, resulting in more shock up travel. It rode so much better, but not because of the springs, but rather because my shocks were not riding near the end of compression, which they get considerably stiffer as they compress. So for a better ride, we need to consider where the shock is in relation to how much up travel is left in it at ride height, as well as tire pressure.

 

[mrblaine]

Why do you have to be such a hater? A dual rate coil compresses in two stages so yes it does make a difference. The difference might be small and depending on shock choice might make more or less of a difference but it does matter. Now bang for your buck is shocks first, coils second *not taking tire pressure into consideration. The science behind coil diameter, spacing, number of coils and overall the rate is so complicated and will change the potential for ride quality as those values change.

I was teasing with the hater comment btw

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I will bet you any amount that you care to wager that I can set up a rig with any "dual rate" spring you care to show up with and then set the same rig up with a single rate spring and with all other things being equal, you won't be able to tell any difference in ride quality whatsoever.