Still experiencing death wobble [Solved!]
- Thread starter nk24
- Start date
I didn't see anything that stood out. Short quick left-right steering wheel movements are better for that kind of test than long slow movements. You get more joint movements in the same length of time that way.
I’ve got the track bar out. I don’t feel any significant play in the axle side bushing. The frame side JJ is difficult to turn but it does move with a long 3/8” drive extension through the joint. A rebuild is probably in order for both sides anyway due to the age of the track bar (10 years).
Haha, I knew I would get flamed for that.
That one is really dried out, and likely flexes too much and too easily.
A moog replacement and new bolt is the best route.
I like to use a bushing that allows a larger bolt to be used, and some manufacturers offer those in their designs , but the stock components work when in good condition and the bolt hasn't been overtorqued.
Thanks Andy. I’ll use Currie replacements and I already picked up the HD bolt and nut kit from Blaine.
Replaced the bushing and rebuilt the Johnny joint in the track bar.
Getting the bushing sleeve out was the toughest part. I ended up cutting it with a hack saw and pounding it out with a chisel.
Johnny joint tool makes rebuilding the JJ so quick.
New grade 8 bolt and nut on the frame side. The threads on the old bolt looked a bit worn.
New Black Magic Brakes bolt and flag nut on the axle side.
Hopefully this work solves my death wobble problem. I plan to get the tires balanced this week prior to any high speed driving.
I did check the ball joints and the tie rod ends by prying horizontally and vertically on the front wheels and didn’t notice any play.
Getting the bushing sleeve out was the toughest part. I ended up cutting it with a hack saw and pounding it out with a chisel.
Johnny joint tool makes rebuilding the JJ so quick.
New grade 8 bolt and nut on the frame side. The threads on the old bolt looked a bit worn.
New Black Magic Brakes bolt and flag nut on the axle side.
Hopefully this work solves my death wobble problem. I plan to get the tires balanced this week prior to any high speed driving.
I did check the ball joints and the tie rod ends by prying horizontally and vertically on the front wheels and didn’t notice any play.
The tires were rebalanced on Monday and the shop said that one of the tires was missing a few weights (didn't specify which). Since then I haven't had the chance to get it on the highway at high speeds to determine if DW still persists. I'm planning to do that this weekend.
Update: I went to pick up some parts over the weekend which gave me the opportunity to take the Jeep out for some high speed driving to see if DW still persists. Through 45 miles of freeway driving between 65-80 mph, I didn't have any DW. I unintentionally hit a few bumps here and there without issue. I'm going to take it out again this weekend for another run, both on and off road, to hopefully feel more comfortable that the issue is gone.
Also, I saw that Rock Jock is now selling a replacement track bar end that has a Johnny joint on the axle side. Sure would have been a lot easier to replace (now and in a future rebuild) versus what I did.
Also, I saw that Rock Jock is now selling a replacement track bar end that has a Johnny joint on the axle side. Sure would have been a lot easier to replace (now and in a future rebuild) versus what I did.
Update: I went on a second test run yesterday. Drove 30 miles to a trail, 10 miles on the trail, then 30 miles back. At the freeway exit on the way back, a small bump in the road started death wobble again. Thankfully I was only going 50 mph, but that does tell me it isn't speed dependent.
After I got home I rechecked the torque on the track bar bolt, which was still fine. I think I can conclude that the death wobble was not caused by the following:
After I got home I rechecked the torque on the track bar bolt, which was still fine. I think I can conclude that the death wobble was not caused by the following:
- Track bar bushing
- Track bar axle side bolt
- Track bar Johnny Joint
- Tires/wheels
(Changed the thread title)
I replaced the ball joints and added Black Magic brake pads and rotors while everything was apart. After breaking in the brakes Monday and Tuesday I went for a drive to test for DW. At the exact same spot as last time, I got DW again.
I tried a few more dry steering tests to see if anything stands out now.
We leave for Moab on Friday. Taking the Jeep is in jeopardy.
I replaced the ball joints and added Black Magic brake pads and rotors while everything was apart. After breaking in the brakes Monday and Tuesday I went for a drive to test for DW. At the exact same spot as last time, I got DW again.
I tried a few more dry steering tests to see if anything stands out now.
We leave for Moab on Friday. Taking the Jeep is in jeopardy.
Last edited:
TheGanzman
TJ Enthusiast
Well, I hate to be "that guy", but here goes: You have a LOT going on with your suspension mods - 2" lift and 33" tires being the two things that jump out at me upon first blush. As a VERY good street rod builder from Rock Hill SC said to me: "Whenever you start to 'mess with the arithmetic' on a suspension (including wheels & tires), you're opening up a potential Pandora's Box, as the potential problems multiply at an exponential rate." I've had five Wranglers now - 4 TJ's and one YJ - all of them drove PERFECTLY, EXCEPT for the one with the 2" lift and the 33" tires, which had bowel-voiding Death Wobble despite my having the wheels and tires balanced at an excellent alignment shop. My current TJ has 1/2" spring spacers and 31" tires - not a single episode of anything that REMOTELY resembles DW in going on 3 years' ownership...
I know my advice will universally fall on deaf ears here, but if it was MY Jeep I'd return the suspension to AS close to stock as you can get it. Yeah, you won't be the big macho man with the lifted Jeep and big tires - you'll be the guy that doesn't need to Scotchgard his seats, LOL...
I know my advice will universally fall on deaf ears here, but if it was MY Jeep I'd return the suspension to AS close to stock as you can get it. Yeah, you won't be the big macho man with the lifted Jeep and big tires - you'll be the guy that doesn't need to Scotchgard his seats, LOL...
Track bar mount looks ok but the axle side bushing appears worn/damaged enough to need replacement. Also looks like you have some joint movement/play at both ends of your track bar In your videos. Make sure you have absolutely not movement in the joints. I had a similar issue after my son and I installed a 4” lift on his TJ. DW induced by bumps in the road. Through the process of elimination we replaced every joint on the front end and installed new tires & wheels. Still had DW. Last thing we replaced was the upper CA bushings on the front axle. No more DW for several months now.
The track bar axle bushing is brand new.
I‘ve set my toe to 1/2” out as a check for the upper control arms. Later tonight I will drive to the spot where I always get DW.
After setting the toe to 1/2" out, I drove to one of the spots where I get DW every time. I drove through it twice, once at 50 mph and once at 60 mph. DW did not occur either time. From another thread, this likely points to the front upper control arms or the upper bushings in the axle mounts.
Also, what size bolt is the frame side that goes through the JJ? My threads are looking pretty bad too.
It is a 5” x 5/8-18 bolt, grade 8. I believe the reason the threads get mangled is because the nut is a stover nut, which isn’t perfectly round and is only meant to be used once.
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