The great resignation—where is the hired help?

[TRE3TOP]

Were you asking me? I'm not in the construction industry.

No, OP said he owns a construction company.

 

[Jezza]

No, OP said he owns a construction company.

Oh, sorry

 

[Apparition]

We were at our local lumber yard yesterday to remind them that they had not given us a quote on a patio door for my sons house that we requested two weeks ago. (like to get these things lined up for rainy days on the farm)
First thing out of the mouth of the person that helped us was a barrage of excuses. I nipped that in the bud quickly with: I haven't stopped working in these last 2 "unprecedented" years, you have a personal choice, either you're going to be part of the problem, or the solution.
He took down our phone number along with the date and time.

Still haven't heard from them 36 hours later.

I've been telling people to stop with the BS excuses, that's not what I pay for.

 

[AndyG]

Just curious for the sake of this conversation, how much are you paying your employees at your construction company?

It depends on the skill level-We have basic laborers that start at $12 an hour and top guys that make over 23 with vehicles furnished and fuel and they get to drive the vehicle personally personally

We are not having the attendance problem I have to fight the problem of having too much help in keeping them busy

 

[TRE3TOP]

It depends on the skill level-We have basic laborers that start at $12 an hour and top guys that make over 23 with vehicles furnished and fuel and they get to drive the vehicle personally personally

We are not having the attendance problem I have to fight the problem of having too much help in keeping them busy

$12 is kinda low for even entry level construction. Chick fil-a is paying $15 and you get benefits with that. You’re asking for skilled labor at unskilled labor wages. Nobody is going to be excited for $12 an hour, nor are they going to be that willing to learn.

 

[Apparition]

$12 is kinda low for even entry level construction. Chick fil-a is paying $15 and you get benefits with that. You’re asking for skilled labor at unskilled labor wages. Nobody is going to be excited for $12 an hour, nor are they going to be that willing to learn.

$17/hr working the counter at the Under Armour Outlet here.

 

[AndyG]

$12 is kinda low for even entry level construction. Chick fil-a is paying $15 and you get benefits with that. You’re asking for skilled labor at unskilled labor wages. Nobody is going to be excited for $12 an hour, nor are they going to be that willing to learn.

No I’m not- $12 is plenty for someone that is borderline homeless- Smells like a bait and tackle store- Could not pass a drug test if their life depended on it-Is living with their wife and her boyfriend- And is just doing basic cleanup work. I have the guys like this beating my door down- The skilled help is where the Calvary is not coming .

Again this thread is not about my company...I don’t seem to be affected so far because we have a very cool work environment and network of laborers...At the same Time Scaling any business up is a challenge at any time

Really there are different conversations- The shortage of entry level help in the work market is really the thread topic

The shortage of skilled labor is something that’s been going on long time and that’s not going to change due to the fact that we have been so busy filling the corner office we haven’t told anyone how to build it

I only have a few guys that make below 15 and believe me they are marginally worth that- $20 an hour is the average with us

And every person in my company could make more money if they want to put in more effort ....But if they have to go to the methadone clinic in the morning and show up for work about nine and leave at three to get their kids and I have to stay late to finish the job guess who gonna make the most money? Besides I have a jeep habit to support

 

[AndyG]

$17/hr working the counter at the Under Armour Outlet here.

And believe me I’m all for people making a Livable wage and I’ll tell you guys another story- When I started paying people better that were better I started getting an entirely different person out of the same guy- It was great to see it but I would not pay it until some people worked through some personal issues and I knew it was going to be worth the investment- it has been And we have more than doubled of the companies’ volume of built work.

 

[TRE3TOP]

Then why are you asking our opinions if you’ve got it all figured out? Ya know $20/hr isn’t all that much anymore either. The reason the $12/hr is borderline homeless is because you can’t afford a home on $12/hr…

 

[AndyG]

Then why are you asking our opinions if you’ve got it all figured out? Ya know $20/hr isn’t all that much anymore either. The reason the $12/hr is borderline homeless is because you can’t afford a home on $12/hr…

If you guys would look at the thread topic and quit trying to solve problems I don’t have then we can get somewhere maybe.....

And this person wouldn’t have a home if he made $30 an hour. I totally understand paying people a livable wage, And maybe you’ve never dealt with some of these types but it is unbelievable...That is another story and A lot of the restaurants are ultimately likely to get a better class of person now that they’re paying wages that people that have better values and more to live for need to make

I really don’t appreciate your comment when you’re totally off base with the conversation...I didn’t ask for anybody’s help on how to run my business in this thread-

The thread topic is why are people not wanting to return to work and why is there such a shortage of laborers even with higher wages offered

 

[Apparition]

And believe me I’m all for people making a Livable wage and I’ll tell you guys another story- When I started paying people better that were better I started getting an entirely different person out of the same guy- It was great to see it but I would not pay it until some people worked through some personal issues and I knew it was going to be worth the investment- it has been And we have more than doubled of the companies’ volume of built work.

Don't get me wrong I wasn't saying you should pay $17 just pointing it out. Likely the $12/hr remodeler and the $17/hr model at the counter aren't the same person.

 

[Farmergreg]

Then why are you asking our opinions if you’ve got it all figured out? Ya know $20/hr isn’t all that much anymore either. The reason the $12/hr is borderline homeless is because you can’t afford a home on $12/hr…

There are those who think a minimum wage should buy all life's amenities.
Then there is the reality that minimum skills are paid accordingly and wages rise with skills gained. (I'm in this camp)

If $15/ hour would be a good minimum wage, wouldn't $100 be better? And every other price adjust up and the minimum skilled still cant afford a home that now costs $3 mil.

We also have a whole society of paper pushers, bureaucrats, regulators whose job it is to make sure the small % of people who actually have skills to create are doing it to their satisfaction. These people won't be of much use down the road.

 

[TRE3TOP]

There are those who think a minimum wage should buy all life's amenities.
Then there is the reality that minimum skills are paid accordingly and wages rise with skills gained. (I'm in this camp)

If $15/ hour would be a good minimum wage, wouldn't $100 be better? And every other price adjust up and the minimum skilled still cant afford a home that now costs $3 mil.

We also have a whole society of paper pushers, bureaucrats, regulators whose job it is to make sure the small % of people who actually have skills to create are doing it to their satisfaction. These people won't be of much use down the road.

That is literally why the minimum wage was created, to afford the basic cost of being a living human being. Somewhere along the way that narrative shifted into the way you currently view it.

 

[AndyG]

There are those who think a minimum wage should buy all life's amenities.
Then there is the reality that minimum skills are paid accordingly and wages rise with skills gained. (I'm in this camp)

If $15/ hour would be a good minimum wage, wouldn't $100 be better? And every other price adjust up and the minimum skilled still cant afford a home that now costs $3 mil.

We also have a whole society of paper pushers, bureaucrats, regulators whose job it is to make sure the small % of people who actually have skills to create are doing it to their satisfaction. These people won't be of much use down the road.

Don't get me wrong I wasn't saying you should pay $17 just pointing it out. Likely the $12/hr remodeler and the $17/hr model at the counter aren't the same person.

We don’t pay people with skills $12 an hour and we don’t pay people that can barely find their way to work five days a week $18-$25 an hour..I have a guy right now that is heading in the direction of making six figures a year...I’m not trying to be a knot head And I know this forum is largely about helping people solve challenges but I’m not trying to solve this particular problem within my company...The thread topic is about a nationwide trend that. is baffling.

I am one of the better paying construction companies in this area...But we pay based on ability. Guys like I’m referring to would be probably glad work for less...At the same time sometimes they are glad not to work at all....

 

[Farmergreg]

That is literally why the minimum wage was created, to afford the basic cost of being a living human being. Somewhere along the way that narrative shifted into the way you currently view it.

And is has never worked. Thats why I threw the $100/ hour out there.
It won't work and because of you and others who share your views inability to understand simple economics it will never work.

 

[Zorba]

Try living in Florida. The market for IT workers here was *destroyed* by a certain well-known large/huge employer here who reputedly forced their IT staff to train overseas replacements then laid them off. As a result, IT jobs start at $12/hr, and you're expected to be a complete network guru for that! I tried for over a year to get a job when I first arrived here, only got 1 interview despite being very experienced and knowledgeable. For about the best pay I've seen here for the field, $20 if I remember correctly. I gave up and retired early. Maybe I could get an IT job now, but for the shit wages and my situation, I no longer care. I don't expect California wages here, but $12, $15, or even $20 is ridiculous.

As for construction, I'm in the middle of supposedly getting an addition put onto this house. Foreman told me that call-outs are frequent - and they have to put up with them, otherwise they wouldn't have anybody at all! A crew is supposed to be here today, its past 9:30 and all's quiet...

 

[TRE3TOP]

If you guys would look at the thread topic and quit trying to solve problems I don’t have then we can get somewhere maybe.....

And this person wouldn’t have a home if he made $30 an hour. I totally understand paying people a livable wage, And maybe you’ve never dealt with some of these types but it is on believable...That is another story and A lot of the restaurants are ultimately likely to get a better class of person now that they’re paying wages that people that have better values and more to live for need to make

I really don’t appreciate your comment when you’re totally off base with the conversation...I didn’t ask for anybody’s help on how to run my business in this thread-

The thread topic is why are people not wanting to return to work and why is there such a shortage of laborers even with higher wages offered

People don’t want to return to work for peanuts. Nobody wants to pay to train someone to become a good skilled employee that they feel is worth paying a better wage, so you’re kind of stuck in the vicious circle you’re in.

The bigger issue is wages have been stagnant for like 20 years, not just the past few, meanwhile $20 20 years ago spends about like $100 currently. I’m not off base at all, it’s just a lot more systemic and complex than you are thinking it is.

Also I’m not trying to tell you how to run your business, but if you’re getting upset at me asking these basic questions(that have to do with the topic at hand, if nothing more than an example of the issue you’re asking about) then maybe that’s something else to think about.

Have a good day, carry on.

 

[AndyG]

Try living in Florida. The market for IT workers here was *destroyed* by a certain well-known large/huge employer here who reputedly forced their IT staff to train overseas replacements then laid them off. As a result, IT jobs start at $12/hr, and you're expected to be a complete network guru for that! I tried for over a year to get a job when I first arrived here, only got 1 interview despite being very experienced and knowledgeable. For about the best pay I've seen here for the field, $20 if I remember correctly. I gave up and retired early. Maybe I could get an IT job now, but for the shit wages and my situation, I no longer care. I don't expect California wages here, but $12, $15, or even $20 is ridiculous.

As for construction, I'm in the middle of supposedly getting an addition put onto this house. Foreman told me that call-outs are frequent - and they have to put up with them, otherwise they wouldn't have anybody at all! A crew is supposed to be here today, its past 9:30 and all's quiet...

And the very last part of this post rings true to what I was talking about in the original post- We have gotten to the point where we will put up with unbelievable employee behavior just to have help. I have caught myself tolerating things I said I never would - why? Because breach of contract and attorneys can cost you a lot more money than problem workers.

I’m both amazed with all the opportunity in this country that people do not want to take advantage of And the fact that it cost a good bit to live here and we’re having people that don’t even want to work .....for any wage. This is the phenomenon that I’m referring to in the thread.

 

[Zorba]

People don’t want to return to work for peanuts. Nobody wants to pay to train someone to become a good skilled employee that they feel is worth paying a better wage, so you’re kind of stuck in the vicious circle you’re in.

Knock off the money printing and enabling by our Benevolent OverLords, and this "vicious circle" crap will end right quick!

 

[Zorba]

And the very last part of this post rings true to what I was talking about in the original post- We have gotten to the point where we will put up with unbelievable employee behavior just a have help. I have caught myself tolerating things I said I never would - why? Because breach of contract and attorneys can cost you a lot more money than problem workers.

I’m both amazed with all the opportunity in this country that people do not want to take advantage of And the fact that it cost a good bit to live here and we’re having people that don’t even want to work .....for any wage. This is the phenomenon that I’m referring to in the thread.

Foreman told me he'd fire anybody like that in the old days, has to put up with it now if he wants any workmen at all!